The Hornwood issue

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

One of the most important secondary plots in the North storyline has been the question of the lordship and succession of House Hornwood lands, after lord Halys Hornwood and his sons were killed at the Battle of the Green Fork in large part of Roose Bolton, leading to a succession crisis with the other powerful neighouring houses seeking to marry Lady Donella Hornwood while Bran Stark proposed to make Halys' bastard son Larence Snow the heir to his father, until Ramsay Snow forcibly took over their lands and married Donella Hornwood before imprisonning her and having her starve and eat her own fingers, surely after having flayed them.

Ser Rodrik arrested Ramsay, but it was only a short break as he had Reek executed in his stead, and later took back control of the Hornwood lands and had himself made lord by his father after Roose killed Robb Stark at the Red Wedding, and was named Warden of the North by Tywin Lannister.

With the Battle of Ice coming, and House Bolton doubtlessly going to be defeated and taken down either by Stannis and/or by the returning Stark childre, the issue of the succession is inevitably going to ressurface and Stannis or the Starks will have to choose a new lord for Hornwood to settle this issue once and for all.

Who do you think is going to inherit Hornwood and its lands ? Do you think that Larence Snow will be legitimized and become the new lord of Hornwood ? Do you see someone else inheriting these lands ?

Whom support will Larence and other potential candidates will benefit from ? Also do you think that the men of Hornwood will play a role in the Battle of Ice and of Winterfell as revenge on Ramsay for what he did to their lady and to them since taking over ?

[King_Tristifer_IV_Mudd]

As long as Larence is alive I think he’ll end up there. 

[1000th Lord Commander]

16 hours ago, KingEuronGreyjoy said:

As long as Larence is alive I think he’ll end up there. 

Given that most of the other claimants have been killed, you're probably right

[Corvo the Crow]

16 hours ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

One of the most important secondary plots in the North storyline has been the question of the lordship and succession of House Hornwood lands, after lord Halys Hornwood and his sons were killed at the Battle of the Green Fork in large part of Roose Bolton, leading to a succession crisis with the other powerful neighouring houses seeking to marry Lady Donella Hornwood while Bran Stark proposed to make Halys' bastard son Larence Snow the heir to his father, until Ramsay Snow forcibly took over their lands and married Donella Hornwood before imprisonning her and having her starve and eat her own fingers, surely after having flayed them.

Ser Rodrik arrested Ramsay, but it was only a short break as he had Reek executed in his stead, and later took back control of the Hornwood lands and had himself made lord by his father after Roose killed Robb Stark at the Red Wedding, and was named Warden of the North by Tywin Lannister.

With the Battle of Ice coming, and House Bolton doubtlessly going to be defeated and taken down either by Stannis and/or by the returning Stark childre, the issue of the succession is inevitably going to ressurface and Stannis or the Starks will have to choose a new lord for Hornwood to settle this issue once and for all.

Who do you think is going to inherit Hornwood and its lands ? Do you think that Larence Snow will be legitimized and become the new lord of Hornwood ? Do you see someone else inheriting these lands ?

Whom support will Larence and other potential candidates will benefit from ? Also do you think that the men of Hornwood will play a role in the Battle of Ice and of Winterfell as revenge on Ramsay for what he did to their lady and to them since taking over ?

Stannis wants to legitimize Jon to consolidate North, he can also legitimize Larence as “a favor” to Hornwood men who has  already joined him. Stannis has nothing against bastards as can be seen by him placing Rolland Storm as the commander of Dragonstone garrison, even after the stunt he pulled with Edric Storm. 

 

[Canon Claude]

2 hours ago, 1000th Lord Commander said:

Given that most of the other claimants have been killed, you're probably right

Which claimants have been killed? Halys Hornwood’s sister is still alive, as are her children. They were the only other serious claimants to the house besides Larence Snow

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

4 hours ago, Corvo the Crow said:

Stannis wants to legitimize Jon to consolidate North, he can also legitimize Larence as “a favor” to Hornwood men who has  already joined him. Stannis has nothing against bastards as can be seen by him placing Rolland Storm as the commander of Dragonstone garrison, even after the stunt he pulled with Edric Storm. 

 

The Stark siblings, as shown with Bran in ACOK, are also sympathetic to Larence's cause due to Jon, and there's also the support of the Glovere who took him as a ward, and possibly of the Manderlys too.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

There's also a reason why Wyman Manderly would want someone on who he would have some influence and means of pressure on as Lord of the Hornwood. 

Halys Hornwood wanted to build a dam on the White Knife, which could greatly affect house Manderly given how power and wealth the Manderlys gain from their control over the river and use of it for trade. 

With Larence Snow he would have better chances of persuading him to not continue that project that the other candidates from the other sides of the Hornwood and Tallhart families who aren't linked to him or House Glover.

[Angel Eyes]

As far as the Hornwood question is concerned, why was Donella so careless with security while traveling from Winterfell? She knew that Ramsay was going to be a problem and was already suspicious of him due to Domeric's death.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

3 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

As far as the Hornwood question is concerned, why was Donella so careless with security while traveling from Winterfell? She knew that Ramsay was going to be a problem and was already suspicious of him due to Domeric's death.

Sounds like plot convenience to be honnest. 

In universe it would be said that she underestimated his greed and impulsivity. 

[Angel Eyes]

9 minutes ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

Sounds like plot convenience to be honnest. 

In universe it would be said that she underestimated his greed and impulsivity. 

Surprised at that by GRRM, given his emphasis on realism.

But at far as underestimating his greed and impulsivity, again I'm surprised because she's the one who voices concerns about him in the first place.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

13 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

Surprised at that by GRRM, given his emphasis on realism.

But at far as underestimating his greed and impulsivity, again I'm surprised because she's the one who voices concerns about him in the first place.

Well GRRM isn't always exemplary about realism.  In this book in particular things get particularly irrealistically bad for the Starks and their side, this being an example alongside the Ironborn's attack of the North, Ramsay Bolton managing to have Reek executed in his stead without anyone telling Rodrik Cassel about Ramsay's identity and appearance and Reek being a decoy, Rodrik leaving Winterfell vulnerable to be taken by Theon, Ramsay going from Winterfell to the Dreadfort and return with his men in time to kill Ser Rodrik and his men and sack Winterfell despite the huge distance between WF and the Dreadfort, etc...

[Angel Eyes]

4 minutes ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

Well GRRM isn't always exemplary about realism.  In this book in particular things get particularly irrealistically bad for the Starks and their side, this being an example alongside the Ironborn's attack of the North, Ramsay Bolton managing to have Reek executed in his stead without anyone telling Rodrik Cassel about Ramsay's identity and appearance and Reek being a decoy, Rodrik leaving Winterfell vulnerable to be taken by Theon, Ramsay going from Winterfell to the Dreadfort and return with his men in time to kill Ser Rodrik and his men and sack Winterfell despite the huge distance between WF and the Dreadfort, etc...

Well, one can see where the show got its unrealistically savvy villains from...

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

7 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

Well, one can see where the show got its unrealistically savvy villains from...

Sure but while abandonning all pretense or facade of realism and not in a good way more often than not.

[Floki of the Ironborn]

Realistically, I think Beren Tallhart will change his name to Hornwood and become the next Lord Hornwood. Larence Snow will fade into the background, he's not important enough to break through the bastardy barrier.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

1 hour ago, Floki of the Ironborn said:

Realistically, I think Beren Tallhart will change his name to Hornwood and become the next Lord Hornwood. Larence Snow will fade into the background, he's not important enough to break through the bastardy barrier.

He was important enough to be groomed by the Glovers, who will surely support his claim, and to be seriously considered by Bran during ACOK. 

[Alden Rothack]

5 hours ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

He was important enough to be groomed by the Glovers, who will surely support his claim, and to be seriously considered by Bran during ACOK. 

Manderley wants who he wants and hes going to get the one he wants unless they die first

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

8 minutes ago, Alden Rothack said:

Manderley wants who he wants and hes going to get the one he wants unless they die first

He may want Larence Snow, with Donella dead and him being Robett Glover being his closest ally and Larence's foster father/uncle. He can also arrange for Larence to marry Wynafrid or Wylla.

[Alden Rothack]

1 minute ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

He may want Larence Snow, with Donella dead and him being Robett Glover being his closest ally and Larence's foster father/uncle. He can also arrange for Larence to marry Wynafrid or Wylla.

Good deal for him and for Larence, whats not to like

[astarkchoice]

14 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

As far as the Hornwood question is concerned, why was Donella so careless with security while traveling from Winterfell? She knew that Ramsay was going to be a problem and was already suspicious of him due to Domeric's death.

To be fair her security might have bee  fine but ramsays force larger and/or suprised them

[Alden Rothack]

4 hours ago, astarkchoice said:

To be fair her security might have bee  fine but ramsays force larger and/or suprised them

He has six hundred men later even after fights with hornwood and manderley