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The Roman ties.


AlaskanSandman

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So this is a look at the Roman/Latin influences found with in the story and what clues they may give. This is just a general look and not a deep analytical dive. Mainly just wanted to compile clues or inspirations relating to Rome.

Valyrian comes from the Valir people of Valland in Norse myth, led by Kjarr. This is Caesar and Roman-Gaul. Add in the -ia found in many Latin place names like Albania, and you end up with Valiria. Which works for the Greenman myth of Garth the Green, as Valerian is also an herb.

 

The Valirians/ Romans used to go to England to get tin and other stuff. One such place is Belerion, the Island now known as Ictus. This is like Valyrians coming for Dragonglass perhaps.

The Valirians built many roads through England, one of the main roads is known as the Fosse-way that runs south to North. Which brings to mind House Fossoway

One famous possible roman was Arturius. Who came down in history as King Arthur, possibly from Celtic Artos meaning Bear. Making him the Bear king of sorts. The Last Hero who stayed in England to lead a resistance against the invading Sea Peoples known as Saxons. The Saxons who are related to the other later sea peoples, the Norse Vikings. The Norse is where the Vandals comes from.

Like the Romans pulling out of England, the Valyrians appear to have pulled out of Westeros. Leaving behind advanced buildings the locals couldn't rebuild. They left possible families behind like that of Arthurs. 

A possible one in the books is Lanista for the Lannisters. Lanista is a Gladiatorial pimp, something we see Tyrion caught up in some when he goes to Essos and joins the fighting pits. The Lannisters trace back to the Age of Heroes near when the Wall was built.

The Germanic age of Heroes that the Valir people pop up in, is around the time that Hadrians Wall was erected. Germans even serving as Guards on the Wall. 

 

The Valirians/Romans and English/Westeros were both founded by descendants of Aeneas, a Trojan Prince who survived the Trojan War with Greece. Roman going to far as to submit Greece/Ghis in later ages as payback for Troy. This suggest that Valyria and Westeros were settled by family members who were related, and that the Valyrians have a blood claim to the Island in a similar way that the Normans had a claim. Perhaps there was a recent wedding in Westeros with someone from Valyria or one of the Free-Cities founded by Valyria. Giving the Essosi a recent claim to the Island as well as an Ancient claim. Brutus and Aeneas are the British and Roman founders.

 

Now, The Worst Year on Earth. 536Ad possibly during the time of King Arthur, or, general time he is listed to really. 536Ad saw a volcanic eruption in the far East that covered the world in darkness for a year. The Long Night that the Bear King Last Hero led his Island people out of and into a new Dawn. The Northern Dawn? Aurora Borealis- Northern Dawn. Where the Big Bear and Lil Bear constellations are, With the Lil Bear connecting to the Dragon constellation of the North. With King Arthur's father being Uther Pendragons, the Head Dragon. Making Arthur, the Dragon/Bear of the North. Tying in House Dayne, and House Mormont. House Mormont who gives Jon Snow Long Claw, their ancestral sword. 

The Bear-Dragon though, descends from the Great Wolf/Wolves, Romulus and Remus. Who were suckled by wolves and grew to found Rome, the heart of the Valirian people. This suggest that the Last Hero was of the Wolf family that became dragons, and Bears as they went north. Maybe they were always dragons of fire, but became Ice Dragons of the North when they went North. 

The White Phantom bride of Arthur. Guinevere, from Welsh Gwenhwyfar. This brings to mind the 13th Lord Commander and his corpse bride at the Wall. 

The Old North of the Hen Ogledd was the region now associated with Northumbria, south of Hadrians wall. House Umber is likely inspired by this. The blood of the native people ran strongest here, as the Valirians didn't bother much with the Highlands other than building a wall to protect their southern territories. 

 

The Greenman is a myth mentioned in the South, and beyond the Wall in Scotland. Scotland being the other Alban kingdom along with the Kingdom of Alba Longa in Italy that Rome came from. 

 

That is most all the ones I can think of that relate largely to Rome. There are other inspiration like the War of the Roses and the Lannister name similarity to the Lancasters. 

House Tudor who actually got the crown, was neither German or Latin/French. They were Welsh, the native blood of the Island. Henry the VIII and Queen Elizabeth mark the union of England south of the Wall. What particularly this means to the story I leave to you, but the Welsh flag is the Red dragon of the Welsh, vs the White Dragon of the Saxons. Arthur is usually depicted as blood of both Rome and England through the female line. Henry the VIII's older brother who was supposed to be king till his death, was named Arthur, after their legendary ancestor. House Tudor won the War of the Roses though between the Starks/Yorks and the Lannisters/Lancasters. So keep an eye out for which House this could be that beats House Stark and Lannister.

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Loose Bolt

Last king of Rome was Lucius Tarquinius Superbus (Tarq instead of Targ) and by the founding myth of the republic he lost his crown bc his son raped wife of VIP and so started a rebellion against his father that turned Rome as a republic.

 


 

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Craving Peaches

Don't forget the Emperor Valerian! Rumoured to have been killed by the Persian Emperor Shapur I by being forced to swallow molten gold (in one version of the story). Sounds familiar...

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Loose Bolt said:

Last king of Rome was Lucius Tarquinius Superbus (Tarq instead of Targ) and by the founding myth of the republic he lost his crown bc his son raped wife of VIP and so started a rebellion against his father that turned Rome as a republic.

Thats a great addition. If anyone has more please mention them. There may be some other clever tie-ins Im not aware of. Specially name influences, mythic, constellation or otherwise.  I know purple was sign of Royalty in Rome also. You also had Elizabeth Taylor playing Cleopatra who hooked up with two Romans as a tie in George has mentioned before when talking about Valyrian eye color. 

There is also the quote from George RR Martin saying that he left clues in the names, being that AE is used in Valyrian names. So Bael the Bard, and Margaery are Valyrian some how.

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6 hours ago, AlaskanSandman said:

Scotland being the other Alban kingdom along with the Kingdom of Alba Longa in Italy that Rome came from. 

With Alba Longa, correct me if I'm wrong but I thought rather than Rome coming from them the Alba Longa citizens were forcefully assimilated into the already existing Rome. Rome and Alba Longa were both members of the Latin League at some point.

Don't forget the Emperor Valerian! Rumoured to have been killed by the Persian Emperor Shapur I by being forced to swallow molten gold (in one version of the story). Sounds familiar...

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1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said:

With Alba Longa, correct me if I'm wrong but I thought rather than Rome coming from them the Alba Longa citizens were forcefully assimilated into the already existing Rome. Rome and Alba Longa were both members of the Latin League at some point.

Don't forget the Emperor Valerian! Rumoured to have been killed by the Persian Emperor Shapur I by being forced to swallow molten gold (in one version of the story). Sounds familiar...

Aeneas was welcomed by Latinus, king of the Latins, and later Aeneas became King of the Latins. His son Ascanius built Alba Longa. The Gen Julii trace their descent back to Alba Longa, predating Rome's founding by Romulus and Remus. Brutus of Troy was either son of Ascanius or his grandson.

And that is a great one with Emperor Velerian! I've never actually heard of him and wonder now if that's were the Norsemen got the name Valir from.  And yea that molten gold part definitely sounds familiar haha Im wondering how much more Roman stuff is littered into the Novels.

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1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said:

With Alba Longa, correct me if I'm wrong but I thought rather than Rome coming from them the Alba Longa citizens were forcefully assimilated into the already existing Rome. Rome and Alba Longa were both members of the Latin League at some point.

Don't forget the Emperor Valerian! Rumoured to have been killed by the Persian Emperor Shapur I by being forced to swallow molten gold (in one version of the story). Sounds familiar...

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In reply (according to one version), Shapur was said to have forced Valerian to swallow molten gold (the other version of his death is almost the same but it says that Valerian was killed by being flayed alive) and then had Valerian skinned and his skin stuffed with straw and preserved as a trophy in the main Persian temple.

 

This part sounds familiar too. Specifically Bael the Bard and his son being flayed by a Bolton

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Florian is short for Florianus.

Valerian comes from Latin valere meaning "to be strong"

From Valerian comes words such as Valor, Validiction, Valiant, Value and Vale for either goodbye and or Vale as in Valley. Something that makes me think of House Arryn, its legends, and the Vale of Arryn. 

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/val#Swedish

From Old Norse valr (the slain, the fallen), from Proto-Germanic *walaz (corpse, body; carnage).

 

From Old Norse val, related to the verb velja (“to choose”). Related to välja, vilja (English will).
Noun
val n

an election[1]
a choice

It seems to relate to some other words and likely Valkyrie too. One Valkyrie was Olrun, daughter of Kjarr who was ruler of the Valir people in Valland. Also seems to relate to the dead slain in Valor? Which the Valkyrie then guide to the after life. 

Some clever word play on George's part. His world building never ceases to amaze me

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Another one I found of interest is Tyrian purple (Tyrion Lannister). Tyrian Purple was made best when the Dog Star had risen. The Dog Star being the Morning Star Sirius. That begins the Dog Days of Summer when the Sun is at its Zenith. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrian_purple

Pliny the Elder described the production of Tyrian purple in his Natural History:[25][c]

The most favourable season for taking these [shellfish] is after the rising of the Dog-star, or else before spring; for when they have once discharged their waxy secretion, their juices have no consistency: this, however, is a fact unknown in the dyers' workshops, although it is a point of primary importance. After it is taken, the vein [i.e. hypobranchial gland] is extracted, which we have previously spoken of, to which it is requisite to add salt, a sextarius [about 20 fl. oz.] to every hundred pounds of juice. It is sufficient to leave them to steep for a period of three days, and no more, for the fresher they are, the greater virtue there is in the liquor. It is then set to boil in vessels of tin [or lead], and every hundred amphorae ought to be boiled down to five hundred pounds of dye, by the application of a moderate heat; for which purpose the vessel is placed at the end of a long funnel, which communicates with the furnace; while thus boiling, the liquor is skimmed from time to time, and with it the flesh, which necessarily adheres to the veins. About the tenth day, generally, the whole contents of the cauldron are in a liquefied state, upon which a fleece, from which the grease has been cleansed, is plunged into it by way of making trial; but until such time as the colour is found to satisfy the wishes of those preparing it, the liquor is still kept on the boil. The tint that inclines to red is looked upon as inferior to that which is of a blackish hue. The wool is left to lie in soak for five hours, and then, after carding it, it is thrown in again, until it has fully imbibed the colour.

This really makes me think of the Hunter Orion and his two Hounds. Specifically, the Clegane brothers.

 

Pliny's Natural Histories reminds me of Maester Benifer's Dragons, Wyrms, and Wyverns: Their Unnatural History

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