UK Politics: Mone, Mone, Mone. It's not funny. It's a rich toff's world.

[Week]

12 minutes ago, Rippounet said:

I have to admit, I've personally concluded that this extraordinary contention that an individual should be free to deny their basic biology is a direct consequence of liberalism, and the source of a collective disconnect from reality that threatens the survival of our species.

That's a wild conclusion based on little evidence which completely ignores intersex and other biologies that defy the binary you're imposing and also ignores gender as a social construct that an individual must be empowered to define for themselves. 

[Darzin]

6 hours ago, mormont said:

Re: defining 'gender critical', this goes back to a previous post about 'gender ideology'. 'GC' people adopt that name because they are critical of what they claim is the 'ideology' of gender, specifically the idea that one can have a gender different from one's biological sex assigned at birth. That's what the term 'gender critical' means.

 

A lot of gender critical people use the name because they don't believe in gender at all except as a set of sexist stereotypes. They are critical of the existence of gender and want to eliminate it. This goes with the etymology of the word TERF, Trans exclusionary radical feminist. The radical feminist part  because the abolishment of gender is one of the key goals of radical feminism and if gender is eliminated then Trans people cannot exist, thus the trans exclusionary part.  

[Heartofice]

1 hour ago, Week said:

That's a wild conclusion based on little evidence which completely ignores intersex and other biologies that defy the binary you're imposing and also ignores gender as a social construct that an individual must be empowered to define for themselves. 

Im sure you are aware that sex is binary and the existence of intersex does not disprove this basic fact.

[Derfel Cadarn]

42 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Im sure you are aware that sex is binary and the existence of intersex does not disprove this basic fact.

Apparently it’s bimodel, not binary.

https://cadehildreth.com/gender-spectrum/amp/

[mormont]

I personally don't give a hoot about biology. I ignore biological facts every day. It's amazing and wonderful that we can allow people who want gender affirming care to have their bodies reflect who they want to be, and it matters not a jot to me what the 'biological facts' are. We live in the fucking future, folks, biology is not destiny.

[Heartofice]

25 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Apparently it’s bimodel, not binary.

https://cadehildreth.com/gender-spectrum/amp/

Or it’s not bimodal.

 

[Heartofice]

13 minutes ago, mormont said:

I personally don't give a hoot about biology. I ignore biological facts every day. It's amazing and wonderful that we can allow people who want gender affirming care to have their bodies reflect who they want to be, and it matters not a jot to me what the 'biological facts' are. We live in the fucking future, folks, biology is not destiny.

By the same note, pretending biology doesn’t matter is a nonsensical position

[Week]

7 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

By the same note, pretending biology doesn’t matter is a nonsensical position

May matter but it can certainly be ignored or altered via gender-affirming or gender-transition surgeries and procedures.

Care less about what another person's genitalia and chromosomes are. Mind yourself. 

[Spockydog]

nvm

[JGP]

2 hours ago, Heartofice said:

By the same note, pretending biology doesn’t matter is a nonsensical position

Biological processes play out within, all around us. So yeah, life wouldn't be anywhere without, HoI, but that isn't what mormont was saying, so you're either stuffing another strawman or are bored maybe and arguing in bad faith.

Perception of self, however you identify, doesn't occupy a physical place in the realm of consciousness. Biology argumentation on this matter is comically unserious, I find.      

  

[Raja]

1 hour ago, JGP said:

 arguing in bad faith.

Correct. Let's not pretend that this is a discussion that is going on with any sort of genuine curiosity or the want to learn - especially when terms like 'safeguarding' 'medical review' are being stated without any actual knowledge of both of those things and the inability to recognize the paucity of gender affirming care in the UK( As an aside, I literally do safeguarding referrals every single day)

More than anything, I feel for our trans friends that they have to read these facile arguments put forward every 2-3 months in this thread.

[Raja]

Our public services are on their knees - have we ever had so many public services striking at the same time?

Big ambulance strike tomorrow - I have no idea what's gonna happen at the hospitals.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

the strikes are disgusting,  We should never be in this situation.  any Doctors, Nurses, Ambulance, Fire, Police strikes should not NEED to happen.

Its disgusting we have a government that cares so little it really is the only thing they can do left to make their point.

 

Let me make myself clear I absolutely 100% support the strikers and its the Government that are forcing the strikes on us not the Nurses.  And I totally support the right to strike.  (the short sighted thinking of the government if you take away the right to strike the next option people have is mass quitting)

 

These strikes could easily have been avoided if the government was just vaguely not terrible. (and the Nurses would still be getting shafted)   I am in favour of people Not being shafted and having decent pay and reasonable conditions.  

[Spockydog]

9 minutes ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

These strikes could easily have been avoided if the government was just vaguely not terrible.

They could have been easily avoided if the government wasn't preparing the country for one of their most shitty pieces of legislation since Brexit. 

They are being deliberately antagonistic, in the hope of turning the people against the unions.

Rishi Sunak under pressure to accelerate anti-strike legislation
 

Quote

Rishi Sunak is under pressure from Tory MPs to accelerate new strike-busting legislation, as Britain faces the biggest wave of industrial action since the tail-end of Margaret Thatcher’s government.

More than 1mn working days will be lost to strike action in December — the worst disruption in any month since July 1989 — based on unions’ current plans for action by postal and rail workers, NHS staff and civil servants.

On Tuesday, ministers accused the RMT rail union of “holding the country to ransom” by scheduling walkouts over Christmas, after it rejected a 9 per cent two-year offer from Network Rail. The union has also rejected a separate 8 per cent offer from train operating companies.

But unions have accused ministers of wrecking a potential deal by stopping train companies from raising their pay offers and insisting on changes to working practices.

 

[Spockydog]

Not to mention the £37bn they stole via, sorry, allocated to, Dido Harding's Test and Trace.

 

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

43 minutes ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

the strikes are disgusting,  We should never be in this situation.  any Doctors, Nurses, Ambulance, Fire, Police strikes should not NEED to happen.

Its disgusting we have a government that cares so little it really is the only thing they can do left to make their point.

You know what's even more disgusting? A decade of zero or negative public sector wage growth, cuts to the NHS, social services, benefits, education, etc.; all in the name of austerity; All because, "There is no alternative", "We need to tighten our belts", blah blah blah...

And then as soon as Liz Truss gets in, Bam, 12.5% tax cut for the highest earners.

The reason the almighty markets reacted the way they did wasn't because it was fiscally irresponsible; it was because they were worried about a general strike, if not a full-on revolt. 

[Pebble thats Stubby]

25 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

You know what's even more disgusting? A decade of zero or negative public sector wage growth, cuts to the NHS, social services, benefits, education, etc.; all in the name of austerity; All because, "There is no alternative", "We need to tighten our belts", blah blah blah...

And then as soon as Liz Truss gets in, Bam, 12.5% tax cut for the highest earners.

The reason the almighty markets reacted the way they did wasn't because it was fiscally irresponsible; it was because they were worried about a general strike, if not a full-on revolt. 

I think this was my point.

Its disgusting because we should not have got to this point.  And its not the NHS or workers or general public that is disgusting its the Government and its been disgusting for so fucking long that we are now at breaking point and can't go on.  We have had so many chances to be a bit more functional.  Its been a decline for 10 years and the last few years we have accelerated that decline.

[The Anti-Targ]

1 hour ago, Spockydog said:

Not to mention the £37bn they stole via, sorry, allocated to, Dido Harding's Test and Trace.

 

I did a quick google search for number of public sector workers in the UK and the average salary for public sector workers. 5.77 million workers, ~£27,000 average salary. An 11% pay rise would cost ~£17Bn not £28Bn.

Interestingly Google also tells me that in 2009 the number of public sector workers was 6.46 million people. By axing about 690,000 jobs in the public sector the Tories cut ~£18bn in public sector wages. 

Of course one need not explain why £1000 more tax per household (which is actually ~£600 using that language) is a bullshit number for several reasons. Not least because taxes don't pay for anything, a widely unrecognised truth that is at the very core of economic injustuce.

10 hours ago, Darzin said:

A lot of gender critical people use the name because they don't believe in gender at all except as a set of sexist stereotypes. They are critical of the existence of gender and want to eliminate it. This goes with the etymology of the word TERF, Trans exclusionary radical feminist. The radical feminist part  because the abolishment of gender is one of the key goals of radical feminism and if gender is eliminated then Trans people cannot exist, thus the trans exclusionary part.  

The aim of eliminating gender as part of human consciousness as a means to achieve full female liberation seems rather naive. While vaginas, penises, uteri, ovaries, testicles and mammary glands continue to exist there will be sexism, until people stop seeing these anatomical structures as features that determine worth, and limit their importance solely to being the apparatuses we use to prevent species extinction, and addressing medical considerations regarding disease and dysfunction conditions specific to those structures.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

2 hours ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

I think this was my point.

Its disgusting because we should not have got to this point.  And its not the NHS or workers or general public that is disgusting its the Government and its been disgusting for so fucking long that we are now at breaking point and can't go on.  We have had so many chances to be a bit more functional.  Its been a decline for 10 years and the last few years we have accelerated that decline.

Apologies. If I didn't make it totally clear, yes I totally agree with you. The situation in the UK is so insane it gets me excited and I get carried away somethings. 

I need to stop watching news out of there. 

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]