Covid 48： The Long March

[Zorral]

3 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

I prefer to continue my luck of avoiding this and if I were to, to avoid getting deathly sick or getting the prolonged covid. I would feel safer having another round of booster as its been a while now since my last one.

Indeed!  Without having had boosters and so on, I wouldn't have risked two long trips this winter -- one to New Orleans and the other to Europe.  Even so we masked throughout the time in the terminals and on the flights -- just as in Europe we masked in the train stations and the on the train itself -- and also if we were in a theater or museums.  But both locations are built in every way to advantage ventilation and outdoors when possible, so generally outside of travel we hardly felt the need to mask at all.  And we never needed to use one of the covid tests we brought with us, or the meds, since -- hey! yay! -- we didn't get sick.  IOW we behaved away as we do here.  But again, it's the vaccinations that provided the confidence to do this -- and the generally falling and low numbers of the infected. 

OTOH, there sure was a lot of coughing in the airport and the flight back home -- including kids and babies.  And we were among the 13 or so out of the hundreds on that flight who were masked.

 

[Zorral]

Ah Ha! Just saw this:

FDA to okay second omicron-targeting booster for some, officials say
Biden administration is moving to make the shot available for older people and those with impaired immune systems

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/04/03/covid-booster-shot/

Quote

 

.... Doctors and other experts have expressed mixed views about a second bivalent booster. Some say there is little data to justify it, while others argue it would benefit high-risk individuals who received their first omicron-targeting shot last fall and probably have reduced protection as the effects fade.

Some anxious patients have been “really clamoring” for a second omicron booster, said Camille Kotton, clinical director for transplant and immunocompromised host infectious diseases at Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston. At a recent meeting of the CDC vaccine advisory panel, she said she would support allowing additional booster doses for high-risk groups, especially for the most significantly immunocompromised patients. ....

.... Administration officials acknowledge there is not extensive data on the bivalent vaccine, which was first authorized in August. But they said real-world data and smaller studies are consistent with large studies on the original vaccine showing that its protection against symptomatic infection fades after several months.

In addition, unpublished data presented at the CDC’s vaccine advisory panel meeting in February confirmed earlier real-world reports that bivalent vaccines are providing protection against serious illness — emergency room visits and hospitalizations — in adults, compared with people who received previous doses of the original vaccine and no omicron-targeting dose.

Other studies also suggest older people might be better shielded from serious illness with an additional booster, the officials said. They noted they are not advocating the second omicron booster for young people, who might experience rare heart-related side effects. ....

 

 

[Zorral]

This sounds good --

A new approach to a Covid-19 nasal vaccine shows early promise

https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/03/health/nasal-vaccine-sterilizing-immunity/index.html

 

[mcbigski]

On 4/3/2023 at 7:38 PM, Raja said:

I hope when you get to a point in life when you need to be mechanically ventilated, you have the same attitude. It boggles my mind that someone can reach the age of 50 and barely have any real world understanding of science & medicine.

Also, The Affordable Care Act has done so much good for your country, but again, you seem to have no real world understanding of it.

There are dramtically fewer small practice general physicians anymore in the US.  You have absolutely no idea about how terrible ACA has been.  If you want to keep your doctor, you're going to need to store him in your freezer.

Nearly every medical practice has been acquired and reacquired and consolidated.  The doctors close enough to retirement have mostly left and the rest are all just promoting whatever the insurance companies are saying.  Top down planning is shit in general, and also specifically in this case. 

When hospitals get reimbursed for covid deaths and intubating, how do you think those trends would change?  There's almost nothing personal left in personal health care, it's mostly salaried folks in debt, following orders.  But the economies of scale are great for the important people.

Edited April 5 by mcbigski

[Zorral]

What in the bloomin' world does any of that have to do with ACA??????????  The ACA provided access to health care that otherwise people didn't have, so small practices shut down? Calm down, take another drink, take a buncha more drinks, and save yourself from ACA. 

Edited April 5 by Zorral

[maarsen]

2 hours ago, Zorral said:

What in the bloomin' world does any of that have to do with ACA??????????  The ACA provided access to health care that otherwise people didn't have, so small practices shut down? Calm down, take another drink, take a buncha more drinks, and save yourself from ACA. 

I am sure that in some way the ACA is responsible for the aging boomer population of  MDs retiring.  Did Obama not specifically put in a time portal to boost births in the 50s to screw old Republicans who can no longer find a doctor in the 2020s? 

Silly as it seems my argument makes more sense than the drivel posted by McB.

[Raja]

19 hours ago, mcbigski said:

 You have absolutely no idea about how terrible ACA has been. 

I do, actually. And it hasn't been terrible. If anything, it didn't go far enough.

The amount of people that that got covered by insurance because of the ACA and medicaid expansion is a net positive. In addition, things like Employer requirements, Essential benefits package, dependent coverage. The ACA was the comprehensive plan that your country needed for it's residents - is there more to do? Absolutely.

Does the ACA have issues? Absolutely, there is a lack of coverage for undocumented immigrants in addition the state based exchanges are certainly not perfect.

But without the act, you would be in a much worse position and the Republicans have come up with nothing that is anywhere close to an alternative.

Moving on.

You're drinking some conspiratorial Kool aid if you think people are getting intubated and hospitals were full of covid patients because of money. Hospitals in the UK were full of covid too ( I remember because I was there and have seen 100s of covid patients - and will continue to do so), we don't have any of the incentives that doctors in the US and we were still intubating people and using non-invasive ventilation.

None of this will convince you because you're off the deep end, but I want you to remember this conversation when you're in a hospital and you need a tube or any other life saving procedure for yourself  ( and you will) - *then* turn around and say you don't want it - because words are wind and talk is cheap.

Edited April 6 by Raja

[mcbigski]

On 4/5/2023 at 11:59 AM, Zorral said:

What in the bloomin' world does any of that have to do with ACA??????????  The ACA provided access to health care that otherwise people didn't have, so small practices shut down? Calm down, take another drink, take a buncha more drinks, and save yourself from ACA. 

Increased coverage was mostly through medicaid expansion and people aging into medicare.   Where are the promised cost savings though?  Thesis: expanded government controlled medical spending is going to be for the benefit of people controlling where the spending goes, rather than the sick.  Am I too cynical there?

On 4/5/2023 at 2:44 PM, maarsen said:

I am sure that in some way the ACA is responsible for the aging boomer population of  MDs retiring.  Did Obama not specifically put in a time portal to boost births in the 50s to screw old Republicans who can no longer find a doctor in the 2020s? 

Silly as it seems my argument makes more sense than the drivel posted by McB.

Maybe you're a gov employee drone, but doctors used to be respected in the US for their expertise and judgement.  If you have to follow what WHO says because they declare Science, then really doctors are going to be the opposite of independent problem solvers, but that used to be the case in the US.  Obamacare didn't start that trend but definitely magnified it by promoting a merger between govt diktat and health insurer obedience, where the actual doctors are financially dependent on obedience instead of making good judgements.

Personally I don't think that's a good model, but I've usually been a bottom up instead of top down organization guy. 

Heck even if somehow top down and bottom up were about equal in a vacuum, the top down people are the ones you need to fight against, becuase it's so much easier to corrupt the few, instead of the many.

On 4/5/2023 at 6:30 PM, Raja said:

I do, actually. And it hasn't been terrible. If anything, it didn't go far enough.

The amount of people that that got covered by insurance because of the ACA and medicaid expansion is a net positive. In addition, things like Employer requirements, Essential benefits package, dependent coverage. The ACA was the comprehensive plan that your country needed for it's residents - is there more to do? Absolutely.

Does the ACA have issues? Absolutely, there is a lack of coverage for undocumented immigrants in addition the state based exchanges are certainly not perfect.

But without the act, you would be in a much worse position and the Republicans have come up with nothing that is anywhere close to an alternative.

Moving on.

You're drinking some conspiratorial Kool aid if you think people are getting intubated and hospitals were full of covid patients because of money. Hospitals in the UK were full of covid too ( I remember because I was there and have seen 100s of covid patients - and will continue to do so), we don't have any of the incentives that doctors in the US and we were still intubating people and using non-invasive ventilation.

None of this will convince you because you're off the deep end, but I want you to remember this conversation when you're in a hospital and you need a tube or any other life saving procedure for yourself  ( and you will) - *then* turn around and say you don't want it - because words are wind and talk is cheap.

We've all been lied to about this. 

Do you think intubation is still the right default treatment?

Do you think that based on the effects Covid has on kids under 15 or so that vaccinating them is a good idea?  Do you, Raja, think the mRNA treatments are safe, effective and rubust?

Roughly speaking doctors kill less than one order of magnitude the amount of people they save. But they also, hopefully just through incompetence, rather than pecuniary incentives, make a lot of wrong calls.

Edited April 8 by mcbigski

[Raja]

'intubation is still right default treatment'

Your posts are not worth seriously responding to as you've somehow become a middle aged man whilst having absolutely no clue what you're talking about.

[DireWolfSpirit]

On 4/5/2023 at 1:44 PM, maarsen said:

I am sure that in some way the ACA is responsible for the aging boomer population of  MDs retiring.  Did Obama not specifically put in a time portal to boost births in the 50s to screw old Republicans who can no longer find a doctor in the 2020s? 

Silly as it seems my argument makes more sense than the drivel posted by McB.

Time portals are real yo !

[Zorral]

nvm

Edited April 9 by Zorral

[Raja]

I've been watching the Lenox Hill netflix documentary - it's a hospital in NYC and the last episode is on the pandemic and would defo recommend people check it out

 

[Zorral]

Some people in particular should be checking out this documentary.

[Kalnak the Magnificent]

42 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Some people in particular should be checking out this documentary.

Yes, if the science studies, government research, experience with medical professionals and their peers didn't convince them SURELY the documentary will do the trick

[Zorral]

The BBC News mentioned that India is attempting to prepare for a new surge/wave of Covid.  Does anyone know anything about this?  It's not as if there was any info provided as to why India thinks it's going to experience yet another tragic covid wave.

All I could find was this -- not helpful:

https://www.indiatoday.in/cities/delhi/story/fourth-covid-wave-unlikely-expect-peak-in-20-days-say-experts-2356770-2023-04-07

Contradicted by this from 3 days ago:

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/india/india-sees-sharp-jump-in-daily-covid-cases-5300-fresh-infections-in-24-hours/articleshow/99284211.cms

 

4 hours ago, Kalnestk Oblast said:

f the science studies, government research, experience with medical professionals and their peers didn't convince them SURELY the documentary will do the trick

You are missing how much I, for one, would enjoy their fake noose denial meltdown.  

 

Edited April 9 by Zorral

[DireWolfSpirit]

Has anyone read a concrete time frame for a 2nd round of the bivalent boosters?

My impression is this is still in the talking/hand wringing phase and nothing is greenlit yet?

I would love to be wrong, I have an appointment on the 28th, sure would be convenient to get another booster then.

[Zorral]

It sounds as if They are wanting to roll this next booster out fairly soon.  I too am keeping my eye out for when it is available.

Again -- I would never have dared to go to Europe w/o being vaxxed with the latest boosters.

Nearly 1600 people die per week here still die from covid.  And long covid hits a lot of the younger people who get it, even now.

Edited April 9 by Zorral

[Derfel Cadarn]

Due my next booster end of the month. It’ll be my 6th jab.

(I’m on the vulnerable list as I was on immune suppressants when Covid hit though my consultant took me off them. Will very likely be back on them again soon).

[Zorral]

3 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

I’m on the vulnerable list as I was on immune suppressants when Covid hit though my consultant took me off them.

Glad to hear you're able to get that 6th booster!

[Zorral]

"A new coronavirus subvariant, XBB. 1.16, has been designated as a “variant under monitoring” by the World Health Organization. The latest omicron offshoot is particularly prevalent in India, where it has sparked a rise in infections, and a return to mask mandates in parts of the country."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/04/14/covid-variant-arcturus-india-explained/

Quote

 

.... The WHO designated XBB. 1.16 a “variant under monitoring” on March 22. This means the variant has “genetic changes” that could affect its characteristics as a virus, including a possible “growth advantage” over other variants, but the epidemiological impact is not clear. The WHO is monitoring seven variants, including the BA.2 version of omicron seen in many parts of the United States.

A “variant under monitoring” is considered to be of lesser concern than a “variant of interest,” which is predicted or known to be more transmissible or virulent, or able to evade antibodies, according to the WHO. The XBB. 1.5 strain, currently the most prevalent subvariant globally, is described as a variant of interest. ....