SeanF Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 1 hour ago, Moiraine Sedai said: The only thing left for Rickard was a trial of combat. Only through that can the guilty hope to get away with the crime of treason. The king turned the tables on Rickard. Rickard and Brandon were not leaving the city alive. Brandon said enough to convince the king and his advisers of his family’s guilt. Executing them was the right thing though perhaps doing so by roasting was over the top. A simple beheading would have sufficed. A trial by combat is a form of duel, and like all duels, it’s governed by rules. Cheating in a duel makes you a common murderer, and Aerys cheated. Jack McCall was hanged as a murderer for shooting Bill Hicock in the back of the head, without warning. Had he challenged him, and killed him in a gunfight, he’d have gone free. Had Rickard been slain in a trial by combat, and Brandon executed, that would have been considered fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenin Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 It didn't really matter whether Rickard was inocent or guilty, by killing him, his son and their party Aerys had alienated too many people, it was reckless. It was a high risk high reward move. If Aerys got what he wanted, the Targaryen would have become as powerful as they were with dragons, if they could effectively just off Great Lords just by sending a raven they would unstoppable. The other side of the coin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna<3Rhaegar Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 On 1/18/2023 at 9:43 AM, The Commentator said: The Starks earned their downfall. Jaime and Cersei Lannister contributed but the failure is mainly the fault of the Starks. Just out of curiosity, which Starks would those be? Which ones are to blame? All of them? Even the children? Further more, it's only the children suffering the consequences now so to say it's deserved is a little outlandish IMO but please tell me what Bran did at what 9? Arya at 11? Rickon is suffering as well, he was like 4 right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna<3Rhaegar Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 3 hours ago, Craving Peaches said: No it was not. Rickard was completely innocent. What Aerys did made a mockery of the sacred trial by combat. He used it as a vehicle to satisfy his perverse and cruel desires. I'm telling ya, it's pointless. I get it though, the sheer ridiculousness of it is too much not to respond sometimes LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 11 minutes ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said: I'm telling ya, it's pointless. I get it though, the sheer ridiculousness of it is too much not to respond sometimes LOL I cannot believe people are actually defending a murderous rapist who is aroused by burning people to death and tried to kill half a million innocents... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 14 minutes ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said: IMO but please tell me what Bran did at what 9? Arya at 11? Rickon is suffering as well, he was like 4 right? They have the name Stark. That's all that's needed. And sometimes not even that. Jon doesn't have the name. It's not like they've done anything to Daenerys anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 8 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: I cannot believe people are actually defending a murderous rapist who is aroused by burning people to death and tried to kill half a million innocents... Do they really believe it or is it just to wind people up? I find it odd that I seldom see the TARGAs replying, for the most part they just quote each other to pat themselves on the back for being so ‘smart’. Irony is deader than Ned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 1 minute ago, kissdbyfire said: I find it odd that I seldom see the TARGAs replying, for the most part they just quote each other to pat themselves on the back for being so ‘smart’. Yes, when you use logic or just quote the text there is a strange silence. I always think of that 'How will the Unsullied and Dothraki do in Westeros' thread where everyone would be discussing the weaknesses of said units by looking at military history and what people in the book say and then there'd just be another 'The Unsullied and Dothraki will now down any opposition' post. Now people aren't obliged to respond or really even to read other posts, but still... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel Eyes Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 4 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Yes, when you use logic or just quote the text there is a strange silence. I always think of that 'How will the Unsullied and Dothraki do in Westeros' thread where everyone would be discussing the weaknesses of said units by looking at military history and what people in the book say and then there'd just be another 'The Unsullied and Dothraki will now down any opposition' post. Now people aren't obliged to respond or really even to read other posts, but still... Well first off to get the Dothraki Daenerys has to stop spewing green bile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commentator Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 17 hours ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said: Just out of curiosity, which Starks would those be? Which ones are to blame? All of them? Even the children? Further more, it's only the children suffering the consequences now so to say it's deserved is a little outlandish IMO but please tell me what Bran did at what 9? Arya at 11? Rickon is suffering as well, he was like 4 right? Ned, Catelyn, Sansa, and Robb all contributed to the deserved downfall of the Starks. Jon single-handedly destroyed the Night’s Watch. We will see the consequences of what Jon did in the next book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 8 minutes ago, The Commentator said: Jon single-handedly destroyed the Night’s Watch. Well he did not because the Watch is still standing as of when he gets stabbed so... It is impossible to claim this because we have not seen the state of the Watch after Jon is stabbed. Just because you don't like a character, doesn't mean you can make massive sweeping statements like this and treat them as true. At best this is a gross misreading of the situation, at worst you do not believe what you are posting and are making numerous claims in bad faith just to get a reaction out of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Stonehearts Simp Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 1 hour ago, The Commentator said: Ned, Catelyn, Sansa, and Robb all contributed to the deserved downfall of the Starks. Jon single-handedly destroyed the Night’s Watch. We will see the consequences of what Jon did in the next book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowen 747 Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 On 1/31/2023 at 4:54 PM, frenin said: It didn't really matter whether Rickard was inocent or guilty, by killing him, his son and their party Aerys had alienated too many people, it was reckless. It was a high risk high reward move. If Aerys got what he wanted, the Targaryen would have become as powerful as they were with dragons, if they could effectively just off Great Lords just by sending a raven they would unstoppable. The other side of the coin... Most people accepted the deaths of Brandon and Rickard. King Aerys II should have stopped there and most of the families, except the Starks and the Baratheons, would have been fine with it. The social whisperings would go, "You know, about Rick and his boy, they should have known better. They were plotting against our king. What a bad way to go but it wasn't undeserved. Treason against the Targaryens is an insult to the Gods. The Fire God got ol' Rick." King Aerys II should have stopped there. The wolf and the stag would rebel but he had plenty of time to prepare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Stonehearts Simp Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 3 hours ago, Bowen 747 said: Most people accepted the deaths of Brandon and Rickard. King Aerys II should have stopped there and most of the families, except the Starks and the Baratheons, would have been fine with it. The social whisperings would go, "You know, about Rick and his boy, they should have known better. They were plotting against our king. What a bad way to go but it wasn't undeserved. Treason against the Targaryens is an insult to the Gods. The Fire God got ol' Rick." King Aerys II should have stopped there. The wolf and the stag would rebel but he had plenty of time to prepare. Lol wow. I know you guys just want a reaction but it still irritates me. Brandon and Rickard did not deserve what happened. Not a debate. Social whisperings would’ve been, “those poor men, I hope the Mad King doesn’t do that to me.” And no, the Starks would not have been fine with it, Eddard would not have been fine with it. The rebellion may not have happened but the North would’ve been completely alienated. Though Rhaegar would’ve eventually came down and worst case imprisoned the Mad King after overthrowing. Best case, Rhaegar would’ve ordered his execution. As to the “insult to the gods” comment. Lol ok partner. Whatever you say With a name liked Bowen (assuming a Bowen Marsh reference) I should know not to take you too seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Stonehearts Simp Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 15 hours ago, Craving Peaches said: Well he did not because the Watch is still standing as of when he gets stabbed so... It is impossible to claim this because we have not seen the state of the Watch after Jon is stabbed. Just because you don't like a character, doesn't mean you can make massive sweeping statements like this and treat them as true. At best this is a gross misreading of the situation, at worst you do not believe what you are posting and are making numerous claims in bad faith just to get a reaction out of people. If the Watch collapses it will be Jon’s fault….for not seeing Bowen and his traitors coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 4 hours ago, Bowen 747 said: Most people accepted the deaths of Brandon and Rickard. Yeah, right. Whatever you say. 4 hours ago, Bowen 747 said: Treason against the Targaryens is an insult to the Gods. The Targaryens are an insult to the Gods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenin Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 7 hours ago, Bowen 747 said: Most people accepted the deaths of Brandon and Rickard. Who are most people? Besides Aerys did not just kill the Starks, he also killed the Arryn heir, a Mallister, Royce etc. All high profile Houses that joined the Robellion because... obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna<3Rhaegar Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 On 1/31/2023 at 4:54 PM, frenin said: It didn't really matter whether Rickard was inocent or guilty, by killing him, his son and their party Aerys had alienated too many people, it was reckless. It was a high risk high reward move. If Aerys got what he wanted, the Targaryen would have become as powerful as they were with dragons, if they could effectively just off Great Lords just by sending a raven they would unstoppable. The other side of the coin... Saw you posted & just wanted to say hello! Haven't talked to ya in a while. Hope you are doing well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 12 hours ago, Prince Rhaegar Targareyen said: If the Watch collapses it will be Jon’s fault….for not seeing Bowen and his traitors coming. I guess Jon forgot to be born with eyes in the back of his head. Bad Jon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Sidious Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 The Wall will fall and it will be because of Jon Snow’s inability to stay out of the Stark’s quarrel with the Boltons. Jon had no right to get the Watch involved in that fight. His loyalty belongs to the Watch, not his old Stark family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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