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Will Daenerys be 'Unhappy' with Westeros when she gets there?


Craving Peaches

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I think she might be a bit disappointed because people there will not treat her in the same way as people in Essos, they probably won't be clamouring for her to 'free' them. To be frank I'd expect they probably won't want her there much at all given the continent has already been ruined by war, there is a food shortage, and she's bringing thousands of Dothraki and former slaves and other foreigners with foreign religion (unless of course by the time she gets there the Others have already invaded and she's bringing Dragons to fight them).

I also think Westeros probably won't live up to Daenerys' own expectations, having never been there herself a lot of her information comes from Viserys and I don't think we should discount that he was looking at it with a nostalgic influence. Daenerys is constantly looking for home and I don't think Westeros will satisfy this wish. I don't think it will live up to the idealistic expectations.

What do you think?

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It’s hard to say.  If Euron is sitting the IT, I expect the people will flock to her.  If it’s fAegon/Arianne, I expect it will be a harder fight, although I’d still expect families like the Tyrells, who will have lost out, to join her (I suspect Margaery and her cousins will perish with Tommen and Myrcella).

I think there will be multiple factions.  The North will be held by Stannis or Jon.  The Vale by LF or Sansa.  The Riverlands by the BWB.  The West and parts of the Reach by Cersei and Euron.  The Crownlands and Dorne by fAegon and Arianne.

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7 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said:

I think she might be a bit disappointed because people there will not treat her in the same way as people in Essos, they probably won't be clamouring for her to 'free' them. To be frank I'd expect they probably won't want her there much at all given the continent has already been ruined by war, there is a food shortage, and she's bringing thousands of Dothraki and former slaves and other foreigners with foreign religion (unless of course by the time she gets there the Others have already invaded and she's bringing Dragons to fight them).

Add that Aegon VI just ousted crazy Cersei and seems an otherwise competent king. They already have a Targ king who will "set everything to right again". The commoners and KL-ers won't care for the dragon queen trying to start yet another civil war, just because she believes Aegon VI is an imposter.

Tragic really: Dany tried to learn from Astapor by sticking with Meereen, and another one stole her "save KL from Cersei rule" opportunity.

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I think Dany's last published chapter when she embraced "fire and blood" and "dragons plant no trees" is the beginning of a new (worse) Dany, and she won't be the same person by the time she arrives in Westeros as we saw her in Essos.  She'll be too angry that Aegon/Arianne "stole" her throne and too preoccupied fighting to reclaim it (even though she never had it) to care what the commonfolk think of her.

I suspect Aegon and Arianne will be well-liked by the commonfolk, her "easy Dornish allies" will have fully sided with them not her, so Dany will be "disappointed" that Aegon/Arianne will have the backing she thinks she is owed.  But again, I think that she will project that disappointment onto the "usurpers" and not on the commonfolk.  And Tyrion ("the villain", according to George Martin) speaking evil advice into her ear won't help her any.

All my predictions are based on my assumption that Aegon and Arianne will take the Iron Throne somewhat easily, but if not... then everything I predict goes out the window.  I neither like nor strongly dislike Present Dany, but this is where I think Future Dany is going, not where I "want" her to go.  Obviously I could be wrong, and if she is the great champion of lovingkindness to all of humanity after all, great.

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I don't think she'd find happiness in Westeros, and she'd likely be disappointed by the fact that people don't cheer her, likely because they would already have their Targaryen king. but it in no way can be like the show's portrayal. she won't expect the treatment she received in Essos. Daenerys doesn't seem to think she needs to "free" Westeros. that's why going back to Westeros is not her priority. if she goes back to Westeros after the throne , I see a Stannis like situation for her where she needs to choose between going to Kingslanding and to the Wall. 

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24 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Add that Aegon VI just ousted crazy Cersei and seems an otherwise competent king. They already have a Targ king who will "set everything to right again". The commoners and KL-ers won't care for the dragon queen trying to start yet another civil war, just because she believes Aegon VI is an imposter.

Tragic really: Dany tried to learn from Astapor by sticking with Meereen, and another one stole her "save KL from Cersei rule" opportunity.

My own view is that Jon Connington and the Sand Snakes will carry out a brutal purge of anyone associated with the Tyrells, Baratheons, and Lannisters.  Connington wants to extinguish Robert’s bloodline, and the Sands are just vicious.

I’m sure Arianne will be horrified by this, but her whole story is of someone who doesn’t really appreciate how cruel  the game of thrones is.

That may not dent their popularity in the capital, but will generate opposition elsewhere.

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1 hour ago, SeanF said:

My own view is that Jon Connington and the Sand Snakes will carry out a brutal purge of anyone associated with the Tyrells, Baratheons, and Lannisters.  Connington wants to extinguish Robert’s bloodline, and the Sands are just vicious.

I’m sure Arianne will be horrified by this, but her whole story is of someone who doesn’t really appreciate how cruel  the game of thrones is.

That may not dent their popularity in the capital, but will generate opposition elsewhere.

Sand Snakes will be playing their game as Doran wants them to play it: one is at Dorne on her way to Darkstar, one is placed to infiltrate the High Sparrows, the other to sit at the council.

The Tyrells have no ally in Cersei (not after Kevan's death) and major troubles in the Reach, that will only worsen with Euron. And if Marg is toast (maybe literally) they will back Aegon, if they are not turning their cloak already.

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Good points made about the politics of it all. But I’m more interested in another aspect of this… Does Dany really, truly want the IT? Does she really, truly want to ‘plant no trees’ and go full fire and blood? How much of that comes from what she’s heard from her idiot brother rather than her own ideas and desires? Dany’s been through so much, basically since she was born. Initially fleeing and depending on the ‘kindness’ of others (even if she’s called Dany and not Blanche), to being abused and brainwashed by Viserys, then all she had to deal w/ by being forced to marry a stranger (w/o even getting into many other issues there), her struggles after Drogo’s death, and everything in Slaver’s Bay. It’s a lot, seriously. And again, I do wonder how much she really wants the IT and all the rest. I don’t think she’s had the opportunity to even get to know herself very well, nor what is it she herself really wants. Of course, her lines at the end of ADwD about dragon planting no trees and her embrace of her house words seem to point in one direction. But whether that will remain her direction going forward remains to be seen. 

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15 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Good points made about the politics of it all. But I’m more interested in another aspect of this… Does Dany really, truly want the IT? Does she really, truly want to ‘plant no trees’ and go full fire and blood? How much of that comes from what she’s heard from her idiot brother rather than her own ideas and desires? Dany’s been through so much, basically since she was born. Initially fleeing and depending on the ‘kindness’ of others (even if she’s called Dany and not Blanche), to being abused and brainwashed by Viserys, then all she had to deal w/ by being forced to marry a stranger (w/o even getting into many other issues there), her struggles after Drogo’s death, and everything in Slaver’s Bay. It’s a lot, seriously. And again, I do wonder how much she really wants the IT and all the rest. I don’t think she’s had the opportunity to even get to know herself very well, nor what is it she herself really wants. Of course, her lines at the end of ADwD about dragon planting no trees and her embrace of her house words seem to point in one direction. But whether that will remain her direction going forward remains to be seen. 

I don't think that she really wants the Iron Throne, I believe that what she does really want is the House with the red door, the mental image of the happiness and home that she lost when Willem Darry was here for her and Viserys. 

Unfortunately she may fixate on the Iron Throne out to retrieve what her family lost, because it gives her a purpose and dream of home, and because she doesn't want to take a look back and faces the fact that she cannot find happiness with the Iron Throne or any power.

Daenerys wants a home and hapiness but takes the wrong path and fixates on the wrong item to reach it. And the further she goes from her true desire, the more she clings to her idea of the Iron Throne instead of allowing herself to look back.

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51 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Good points made about the politics of it all. But I’m more interested in another aspect of this… Does Dany really, truly want the IT? Does she really, truly want to ‘plant no trees’ and go full fire and blood? How much of that comes from what she’s heard from her idiot brother rather than her own ideas and desires? Dany’s been through so much, basically since she was born. Initially fleeing and depending on the ‘kindness’ of others (even if she’s called Dany and not Blanche), to being abused and brainwashed by Viserys, then all she had to deal w/ by being forced to marry a stranger (w/o even getting into many other issues there), her struggles after Drogo’s death, and everything in Slaver’s Bay. It’s a lot, seriously. And again, I do wonder how much she really wants the IT and all the rest. I don’t think she’s had the opportunity to even get to know herself very well, nor what is it she herself really wants. Of course, her lines at the end of ADwD about dragon planting no trees and her embrace of her house words seem to point in one direction. But whether that will remain her direction going forward remains to be seen. 

Her mood at the end of ADWD is sad, not triumphalist nor vindictive. She realises (correctly) that her efforts to make peace in Slavers Bay were fruitless.

Actually, I hope she does not get the Iron Throne, because I think she'd hate it.

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3 hours ago, SeanF said:

My own view is that Jon Connington and the Sand Snakes will carry out a brutal purge of anyone associated with the Tyrells, Baratheons, and Lannisters.  Connington wants to extinguish Robert’s bloodline, and the Sands are just vicious.

I’m sure Arianne will be horrified by this, but her whole story is of someone who doesn’t really appreciate how cruel  the game of thrones is.

That may not dent their popularity in the capital, but will generate opposition elsewhere.

Well, Connington would be disappointed right? There's only about four of Robert's bloodline still running around, none in King's Landing; Gendry and Bella are in the Riverlands, Edric Storm is in Lys, and Mya Stone is in the Vale. Unless he doesn't know about the incest...

On the other hand I think that Connington would be more willing to pursue more desperate courses of action due to his impending greyscale.

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4 hours ago, StarkTullies said:

I think Dany's last published chapter when she embraced "fire and blood" and "dragons plant no trees" is the beginning of a new (worse) Dany, and she won't be the same person by the time she arrives in Westeros as we saw her in Essos.  She'll be too angry that Aegon/Arianne "stole" her throne and too preoccupied fighting to reclaim it (even though she never had it) to care what the commonfolk think of her.

I suspect Aegon and Arianne will be well-liked by the commonfolk, her "easy Dornish allies" will have fully sided with them not her, so Dany will be "disappointed" that Aegon/Arianne will have the backing she thinks she is owed.  But again, I think that she will project that disappointment onto the "usurpers" and not on the commonfolk.  And Tyrion ("the villain", according to George Martin) speaking evil advice into her ear won't help her any.

All my predictions are based on my assumption that Aegon and Arianne will take the Iron Throne somewhat easily, but if not... then everything I predict goes out the window.  I neither like nor strongly dislike Present Dany, but this is where I think Future Dany is going, not where I "want" her to go.  Obviously I could be wrong, and if she is the great champion of lovingkindness to all of humanity after all, great.

The only problem with your predictions is that the Others will be Daenerys' number one priority. Euron will probably be her number two priority followed by Aegon at number three.

Marwyn (who, in addition to knowing everything that he knows about magic, dragons and prophecy, now knows everything that Maester Aemon and Sam Tarly know) is travelling to Daenerys with the intention of telling her that if she does not go to Westeros and fight now, then all humanity will be doomed.

I don't think she will want the Iron Throne and I don't think she will like Aegon (or anyone in his inner circle) but I do think that she won't attack them unless she is forced to do so. Team fAegon will be the first ones to attack and draw blood.

11 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

Well, Connington would be disappointed right? There's only about four of Robert's bloodline still running around, none in King's Landing; Gendry and Bella are in the Riverlands, Edric Storm is in Lys, and Mya Stone is in the Vale. Unless he doesn't know about the incest...

He doesn't know about the incest.

Nor would he care. A Baratheon in name only is still an enemy as a Baratheon in the flesh.

 

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6 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

The only problem with your predictions is that the Others will be Daenerys' number one priority. Euron will probably be her number two priority followed by Aegon at number three.

Marwyn (who, in addition to knowing everything that he knows about magic, dragons and prophecy, now knows everything that Maester Aemon and Sam Tarly know) is travelling to Daenerys with the intention of telling her that if she does not go to Westeros and fight now, then all humanity will be doomed.

Exactly this. If GRRM doesn't want Westeros - and especially the North (and with it his whole story) - to look completely ridiculous at the end of TWoW, events must move forward just as much as in Essos. So if Daenerys does (most likely) decide to set sails in her last chapter (and/or maybe we will get her arrival in the epilogue), being told by Marwyn why it is important to go just yet, and not after she not only has finished her business with the slavers and the Free Cities, but also has established some kind of stability, we should have a major Others-problem in Westeros already.

So the Iron Throne and the people playing stupid games over it will not be her priority.

22 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

I don't think she will want the Iron Throne and I don't think she will like Aegon (or anyone in his inner circle) but I do think that she won't attack them unless she is forced to do so. Team fAegon will be the first ones to attack and draw blood.

Here I disagree. She will "want" it, but - as said above, here we agree - without priority. She will think about it as belonging to her family etc. BUT I think that during her time in Westeros she will realise that it really isn't her place, these aren't her people, Westeros ist not her home. Her people are in Essos, her home is in Essos. As @kissedbyfire rightly said, Daenerys did not have much time to think about who she is and where she belongs, the time in Westeros will help her realise were and what the red door is (I still think her ending in the abomination is a twisted version of her and her surviving troops leaving Westeros, maybe she will keep Dragonstone. I would not be surprised if she would give the command to melt the Iron Throne, as a sign of severing her ties with Westeros).

39 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:
52 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

Well, Connington would be disappointed right? There's only about four of Robert's bloodline still running around, none in King's Landing; Gendry and Bella are in the Riverlands, Edric Storm is in Lys, and Mya Stone is in the Vale. Unless he doesn't know about the incest...

He doesn't know about the incest.

Nor would he care. A Baratheon in name only is still an enemy as a Baratheon in the flesh.

Agree. Also I don't think he would be more forgiving toward Lannisters.

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As everyone else said above, probably not happy. In Essos she was a symbol of hope and liberation for an enslaved people. At this point she is used to resistance and is aware that she will face it in Westeros. The difference is, the common folk will not see her as their savior. She is bringing further doom and destruction. Famine follows her wherever she goes, and she will bring that theme to Westeros, not to mention Westeros is already in a bad spot food-wise. Conquering Westeros at this point and time is just a terrible idea. Starving people out is a common tactic in war, but with the coming winter, it would be in her best interest to stay in Meereen (this is excluding the war against The Others since she's not even aware of that yet.)

If she were to forgo the Iron Throne (even temporarily), then that means she'll have turned her attention to The Others. It's going to cause her and her army more grief, and more pain. Who will reach out to her about the coming ice threat, and how long will it take to convince her to join in the war? The trek to the Wall or even Winterfell will be costly, and it will test her. The harsh terrain and weather will be unpredictable and only grow stronger the further North they travel. She will have to worry about food shortage, broken wagons, putting down horses that are ill equipped for Northern terrain, her men freezing to death. Blizzards will become more frequent and will blind both her army and dragons. They'll be forced to wait out storms for a few days, I imagine. The "abomination" decided to go with an extremely mild winter so she could get there easily and quickly, but the books are different. I'm far more interested in this than her possible conquering arc.

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20 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Her mood at the end of ADWD is sad, not triumphalist nor vindictive. She realises (correctly) that her efforts to make peace in Slavers Bay were fruitless.

Actually, I hope she does not get the Iron Throne, because I think she'd hate it.

The true tragedy of Daenerys is that she will most certainely continue to seek the Iron Throne, despite knowing deep down that it's not what her heart desires, and her quest for it only making her more lonely and miserable and that the worse her life becomes the more desperately she clings to it.

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21 minutes ago, Morte said:

being told by Marwyn why it is important to go just yet, and not after she not only has finished her business with the slavers and the Free Cities, but also has established some kind of stability

This is actually something I'm very curious about. Is stability a real possibility for Meereen in such a short amount of time? I don't find it realistically possible. What lengths would she have to go to in order to achieve it? Who would she leave in charge of Meereen? There are too many schemers in her service alone already. And don't forget the bloody flux is taking people out left and right. Does she have anyone with enough competence to lead and govern in her absence? Ending slavery is a massive feat that requires more than a lifetime of work, especially in a place as large as Slaver's Bay. She's accomplished an incredible feat already in disrupting some of the slavers' power. I believe the best we can hope for is a slave revolt, and we will never find out how it goes.

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12 minutes ago, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

This is actually something I'm very curious about. Is stability a real possibility for Meereen in such a short amount of time? I don't find it realistically possible. What lengths would she have to go to in order to achieve it? Who would she leave in charge of Meereen? There are too many schemers in her service alone already. And don't forget the bloody flux is taking people out left and right. Does she have anyone with enough competence to lead and govern in her absence? Ending slavery is a massive feat that requires more than a lifetime of work, especially in a place as large as Slaver's Bay. She's accomplished an incredible feat already in disrupting some of the slavers' power. I believe the best we can hope for is a slave revolt, and we will never find out how it goes.

I'm sure there will be a slave revolt, just as I'm sure about the fall of Volantis. But as you say: It would not mean that the work is finished, so I don't see Daenerys leaving for Westeros because of news about Aegon or what else Tyrion might tell her. That's nothing urgent compared to the situation in Essos.

57 minutes ago, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

Who will reach out to her about the coming ice threat, and how long will it take to convince her to join in the war?

Well, Marwyn is on his way (with or without Gilly, we will see), Moqorro's mission is not known to us, but it might be the Red Priests of Volantis have seen things in their fires, too. And we will see what the Dosh Khaleen will say to her - we have been told that the grass is dying, it's autumn in the Grass Sea.

57 minutes ago, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

If she were to forgo the Iron Throne (even temporarily), then that means she'll have turned her attention to The Others. It's going to cause her and her army more grief, and more pain. [...] The trek to the Wall or even Winterfell will be costly, and it will test her. The harsh terrain and weather will be unpredictable and only grow stronger the further North they travel. She will have to worry about food shortage, broken wagons, putting down horses that are ill equipped for Northern terrain, her men freezing to death.

If the Others are really breaching the Wall in TWoW, I don't think we can expect anyone fighting near Winterfell - it's horribly cold now, and Stannis' men are freezing. I don't think anyone could fight the Others and their zombies in such a weather, but Daenerys had a dream about her fighting on the Tringent:

Quoted from the Citadel, because I'm lazy, there it is III:310:

Quote

That night she dreamt that she was Rhaegar, riding to the Trident. But she was mounted on a dragon, not a horse. When she saw the Usurper's rebel host across the river they were armored all in ice, but she bathed them in dragonfire and they melted away like dew and turned the Trident into a torrent. [...]

 

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42 minutes ago, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

This is actually something I'm very curious about. Is stability a real possibility for Meereen in such a short amount of time? I don't find it realistically possible. What lengths would she have to go to in order to achieve it? Who would she leave in charge of Meereen? There are too many schemers in her service alone already. And don't forget the bloody flux is taking people out left and right. Does she have anyone with enough competence to lead and govern in her absence? Ending slavery is a massive feat that requires more than a lifetime of work, especially in a place as large as Slaver's Bay. She's accomplished an incredible feat already in disrupting some of the slavers' power. I believe the best we can hope for is a slave revolt, and we will never find out how it goes.

We know that there will be a slave revolt in Volantis, which will take out the Big Brother that the masters of Slavers Bay can call upon.

I expect that someone like the Shavepate would be the best person to leave in charge when she goes.

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