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Alternate History: The Dance of the Dragons is Avoided


Lady Stonehearts Simp

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3 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

 

One big thing both George and HotD fail to address is why the hell Alicent and Otto never pushed for Rhaenyra to marry a Hightower. That could have avoided the war. Rhaenyra could have married one of Alicent's brothers or, perhaps even better, (the future) Lord Ormund Hightower of Oldtown.

 

You think Rhaenyra would willingly step down from her position as heir apparent to become Mrs Hightower? 

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3 minutes ago, EggBlue said:

from what we know of pre-conquest Targs, the eldest brother married the eldest sister. it is not clear how the power structure within the island and Targaryen household worked. considering Aegon's shared rule with his sisters despite adapting Andal customs,  it's quite reasonable to think the lord and lady of Dragonstone shared power equally. it's most likely that the nobles in the mainland saw the lord as the real power due to the projection of their own culture . we've seen the same thing in book 1 when Joffrey Baratheon calls for Doran and his eldest son to swear fealty despite the fact that according to AGOT's appendix Arianne was Doran's heir. 

We don't know the specifics, of course, but one Dragonstonian couple - Aegon and Elaena - are mentioned as having ruled together, so the historians there knew enough about Valyrian customs and the situation on Dragonstone to recognize when there was a Lord of Dragonstone sharing the rule with his sister-wife - and when this wasn't the case. Which it apparently was with Aenar, Gaemon the Glorious, Maegon, Aerys, Aelyx, Baelon, Daemion, and Aerion.

Also, while we know that custom told Aegon to marry his elder sister, it isn't clear whether this means - not why this was custom, nor whether it means an elder sister if one has one, or merely the eldest of whatever younger sister one might have.

I'm with you that projection may have played some role in how Aegon was perceived - but he really seems to have been the one in charge as his decision to make peace with Dorne makes clear (Visenya was against that, after all).

But it doesn't really matter why people brought up Aegon being lord instead of Visenya - it is a fact that they did, and that, in turn, undermined the case for Rhaenys.

3 minutes ago, EggBlue said:

of course, he does. but as Many-Faced Votary said, passing over Rhaena and Aera was a unique situation. besides, Rogar Baratheon's influence on Jaeherys's coronation should not be dismissed. Rogar , as he later showed, wanted his own monarch. obviously, the boy he had under his roof was the better candidate than a woman he did not know or a child he did not have access to. seems to me Jaeherys' gender only became an asset for Rogar to satisfy Andal nobles and do what was best for him. 

Rogar really didn't have any principles at all, as his later decision for Aerea shows.

3 minutes ago, EggBlue said:

of course it was. they were Andals , Baelon was an adult and he was popular. that is not to say Jaeherys couldn't just as easily name Rhaenys his heir . she would have been accepted because there was no precedent against her position ( instead of Aera who again was in a unique situation) . also, having Corlys, another adult popular and powerful man, by her side and the Baratheon support would have helped her position better . 

But the thing with precedents is that the context doesn't really matter.

3 minutes ago, EggBlue said:

yes, but it's not about what Alyssane preferred. it's about what Jaeherys and Alyssane could pull off. Jaeherys and Alyssane seem to be one of the more Westerosi-conventional Targaryens (unless it comes to incest!) . and one would assume living in Baratehon household between the ages of 10-14 (for Alyssane , 8-12) without any influence from Targaryens could be an explanation. notably, although Rhaena doesn't seem to like Queenship and whatever it entails, she is still the one to believe she or at least her daughter should have been queen instead of Jaeherys ; and she is the only one among her siblings who was raised by Aegon and Aenys. 

It seems clear to me that Jaehaerys and Alysanne could have established themselves as co-rulers. Nobody could have stopped them if they wanted to. Alysanne could have also sat the Iron Throne in Jaehaerys' absence if they wanted her to do it. Nobody could have denied her that, either. How it came to be that the queens no longer did that is something we don't really know. I had expected that Alysanne would have been the last queen to do it, since I thought Alyssa Velaryon may have also sat the Iron Throne while she was serving as Queen Regent. I guess Alyssa would have had little opportunity to do it since Aenys and his family didn't really live in the Red Keep during his brief reign - their KL court was in the manse on Visenya's Hill but mostly they seem to have lived on Dragonstone.

2 hours ago, Floki of the Ironborn said:

You think Rhaenyra would willingly step down from her position as heir apparent to become Mrs Hightower? 

Why should she do that? My point is that Otto/Alicent and the Hightowers in general would have had no problem with a Queen Rhaenyra if her husband was a Hightower and her heir and successor the child of a Hightower and thus their grandson, nephew or other pretty close relation.

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3 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

But the thing with precedents is that the context doesn't really matter.

That is actually debatable, but what we're discussing is that no real precedent was set at the time of Jaehaerys's reign because of how early it was in the dynasty and due to the unique circumstances of succeeding Maegor. He could easily have named Rhaenys his heir after Aemon died, and made it clear that the general precedent for the inheritance of the Iron Throne would become akin to the Andal law of male-preference primogeniture. This seems like the obvious move, especially for someone devout in the Faith of the Seven.

Why he named Baelon his heir is immaterial here, and the lords being pleased that the man was named heir over the woman is neither surprising nor a point in the act's favor. Nor did he bother to accompany it with a pronouncement that Rhaenys would be Baelor's heir, to mark it as a concern of age and experience rather than sex, something he could have done.

By disinheriting Rhaenys not just once but twice, Jaehaerys not only indirectly caused the Dance, but he also made all but made civil war inevitable in the absence of a royal male line of descent.

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Multiple Daeneryses who are actually trained with the use of their dragons running(or flying) around with many more dragons, wiping out not just small city states but entire nations until nothing but ashes remain for them to rule. They then breed on those ashes to produce many more inbreds and kill each other en masse(at this point there would be hundreds if not thousands of those inbreds) after the breeding ceremony.

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