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Succession final season (spoilers)


Mark Antony
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There are so many vicious and unhinged characters in this show that one gone isn't even noticed.  His legacy, thereby himself, remains and will forever.

Edited by Zorral
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9 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

I'm feeling the absence of Logan/Cox more than I expected.  The last couple of episodes not jazzing me too much, the writing is still great, but the story is not so engaging without the father as the center, even if he still exerts pressure on things after death.

Have to say I have enjoyed the last couple of episodes a lot,  I thought I’d be bummed out by the death but I think it’s brought the kids characters out a lot more.

First episode of this season I was genuinely worried the show was just treading water and repeating itself with nowhere to go. Now I’m totally back on board with everything.

The high point of Succession for me was during Ken’s manic moments and he’s been so subdued for a while it’s good to see him go insane again. I find his character incredibly fascinating, often treading the line between seeming inspirational and competent and a lunatic who hasn’t got a clue what he’s doing.

Im also starting to really focus on Shiv a lot more. Previously I’ve just disliked her, that sarcastic face just grated, but now she is really displaying her vulnerability, even if she doesn’t want to. Those scenes with Tom in that last episode I thought were very well acted from her as she is constantly contorting her face to hide her emotions and not give anything away. Her defensive snark is starting to break down and again it’s fascinating.

 

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How can Tomganz have had sex with his wife, Shiv, and not notice she's pregnant?

In the previous ep, Lukas offers Shiv both coke and whisky/scotch (not sure what it was), but the photography was limitlessly coy as to whether she actually consumed any liquor ... iirc she turned down the coke.

 

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10 hours ago, Heartofice said:

Have to say I have enjoyed the last couple of episodes a lot,  I thought I’d be bummed out by the death but I think it’s brought the kids characters out a lot more.

First episode of this season I was genuinely worried the show was just treading water and repeating itself with nowhere to go. Now I’m totally back on board with everything.

The high point of Succession for me was during Ken’s manic moments and he’s been so subdued for a while it’s good to see him go insane again. I find his character incredibly fascinating, often treading the line between seeming inspirational and competent and a lunatic who hasn’t got a clue what he’s doing.

Im also starting to really focus on Shiv a lot more. Previously I’ve just disliked her, that sarcastic face just grated, but now she is really displaying her vulnerability, even if she doesn’t want to. Those scenes with Tom in that last episode I thought were very well acted from her as she is constantly contorting her face to hide her emotions and not give anything away. Her defensive snark is starting to break down and again it’s fascinating.

 

Kendall is hard for me to watch, I can feel that anxiety seeping through the screen.  It's why I can never binge this show, I feel like I need a couple of xanax after watching 2 back to back eps.  

The family drama with Logan alive kept me more interested than the family drama+c suite procedurel has done the last 2 episodes.  I still love the show, don't get me wrong, but it is very clear they couldn't have gone a full season beyond Logan's death, they may have even been better off killing him a little later, but it depends on how everything ultimately plays out.

 

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2 hours ago, grozeng said:

Every single word out of his mouth is just jargon and makes no sense. 

It's hard to read Kendall  in part because he has a specific mission: plausibly inflate the future prospects of of Waystar RoyCo's finances so high that Matsson will back out because $192 a share is his final and he can't go higher. There's definitely some manic madness to what he was doing -- "Build me a Living+ house, with clouds, in a day" which is then abandoned -- but underlying that seems to be a dedication to the goal of just keeping Waystar from being sold and his just having some grandiose sense of theatricality to try and sell this notion that Waystar could make a ton of cash. The fact that the immediate buzz after the presentation was positive is why everyone turned on a dime to applaud him, with many of them not realizing that he's trying to goose the value of Waystar out of Matsson's price range and doesn't care about the inevitable backlash when Living+ turns out to be a mirage.

Note that he himself never directly states that Living+ will double the revenue of the parks and recreation division. He puts the words (quite literally) in the mouth of the dead former CEO, his father. The writing is definitely trying to show him walking the knife edge of making the financial world believe that Waystar is on the verge of a monumental revenue gain while trying to foist the claims on others (his father, pointing out Karl, etc.) to insulate himself.

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13 hours ago, Ran said:

It's hard to read Kendall  in part because he has a specific mission: plausibly inflate the future prospects of of Waystar RoyCo's finances so high that Matsson will back out because $192 a share is his final and he can't go higher. There's definitely some manic madness to what he was doing -- "Build me a Living+ house, with clouds, in a day" which is then abandoned -- but underlying that seems to be a dedication to the goal of just keeping Waystar from being sold and his just having some grandiose sense of theatricality to try and sell this notion that Waystar could make a ton of cash. The fact that the immediate buzz after the presentation was positive is why everyone turned on a dime to applaud him, with many of them not realizing that he's trying to goose the value of Waystar out of Matsson's price range and doesn't care about the inevitable backlash when Living+ turns out to be a mirage.

Note that he himself never directly states that Living+ will double the revenue of the parks and recreation division. He puts the words (quite literally) in the mouth of the dead former CEO, his father. The writing is definitely trying to show him walking the knife edge of making the financial world believe that Waystar is on the verge of a monumental revenue gain while trying to foist the claims on others (his father, pointing out Karl, etc.) to insulate himself.

I think one of the show's great strengths is that it's pretty hard to read Kendall at times. It's possible the guy is partly genius who picked up a thing or two from his dad, but is also hindered by a series of self destructive character traits to cause him to fuck everything up. It's also possible he's a total moron who just occasionally gets lucky, swings big and sometimes hits.

Having said that, Logan was also far from perfect and had a number of character traits that were net negative to his business dealings, it's just that he bullied his way to the top and his mistakes get forgotten, which seems to be pretty common with any business.
 

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Agree he has a manic personality, probably a disorder of some kind. I think his sense of self is paper thin and he is extremely reliant on external validation to determine his own feelings about his own competence. Thats why he can go from high highs to low lows in the space of seconds. Probably the opposite of Logan who literally couldn't give a shit what other people thought of him.

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5 hours ago, Heartofice said:

Agree he has a manic personality, probably a disorder of some kind. I think his sense of self is paper thin and he is extremely reliant on external validation to determine his own feelings about his own competence. Thats why he can go from high highs to low lows in the space of seconds. Probably the opposite of Logan who literally couldn't give a shit what other people thought of him.

I think he did in one sense at least though. Unless I'm reading the "Kerry wants to be a new anchor" thing wrong. I don't think he liked thinking people were laughing at him, or thought he was foolish. 

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18 hours ago, Madame deVenoge said:

Shiv is not a slender lady….but still?!

Her breasts definitely give it away to less intimate onlookers who have seen her frequently before, even onscreen, as we, the audience, have seen the actress before, who is now pregnant.  I knew she was even before the narrative line told us she was! 

It's kind of astonishing how very quickly one's breasts say, "pregnant." :thumbsup:

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7 hours ago, RumHam said:

I think he did in one sense at least though. Unless I'm reading the "Kerry wants to be a new anchor" thing wrong. I don't think he liked thinking people were laughing at him, or thought he was foolish. 

That plot line had a bit of a Citizen Kane vibe - of course, Logan was one much more likely to cut his losses and move on. 

I agree with others that I wouldn't have thought I would be as engaged in the show post-Logan, but... it's working for me. 

So, who's going to come out on top here? If history is any guide, it won't be any of the Triumvirate of Kendall, Roman, and Shiv. 

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10 hours ago, Aemon Stark said:

who's going to come out on top here? If history is any guide, it won't be any of the Triumvirate of Kendall, Roman, and Shiv. 

I've got Shiv and Tom on my bingo card. 

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1 minute ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

I think Greg’s fucked. He’s been disowned by his grandfather, Logan’s dead, and Tom’stheonky one who has any time for him.

i dunno, ever since Lukas went at him the kids have been "nicer" to him.

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7 hours ago, Relic said:

I've got Shiv and Tom on my bingo card. 

Shiv won't.  Their conversation in the last episode is 100% indication that Tom is going to sell her out.

To me seeing as how Ken has effectively let Roman shoot himself in the foot, all the while seeming to back him up and be loyal.  Roman will cop to listening to Shiv and so abandoning Ken in the presentation. Then Ken will promise Tom everything at ATN bla bla to get dirt on Shiv and then Tom will tell Ken about Shiv and Mattsen.  

To answer the earlier question I think it will appear that Ken is going to come out on top but then he will get brought down by insider trading stuff.  Who do I think will win?  Frank, Karl, and Gerri.

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3 minutes ago, Slurktan said:

Shiv won't.  Their conversation in the last episode is 100% indication that Tom is going to sell her out.

To me seeing as how Ken has effectively let Roman shoot himself in the foot, all the while seeming to back him up and be loyal.  Roman will cop to listening to Shiv and so abandoning Ken in the presentation. Then Ken will promise Tom everything at ATN bla bla to get dirt on Shiv and then Tom will tell Ken about Shiv and Mattsen.  

To answer the earlier question I think it will appear that Ken is going to come out on top but then he will get brought down by insider trading stuff.  Who do I think will win?  Frank, Karl, and Gerri.

Yeah, I can't see any of Logan's children "winning." They each have their particular talents, but they are too fundamentally flawed to not self-destruct in some way. It's one of the many qualities that makes this show so fascinating and entertaining.

They're all a bunch of Connors who think they are Logan.

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2 hours ago, Slurktan said:

Shiv won't.  Their conversation in the last episode is 100% indication that Tom is going to sell her out.

To me seeing as how Ken has effectively let Roman shoot himself in the foot, all the while seeming to back him up and be loyal.  Roman will cop to listening to Shiv and so abandoning Ken in the presentation. Then Ken will promise Tom everything at ATN bla bla to get dirt on Shiv and then Tom will tell Ken about Shiv and Mattsen.  

To answer the earlier question I think it will appear that Ken is going to come out on top but then he will get brought down by insider trading stuff.  Who do I think will win?  Frank, Karl, and Gerri.

That's not bad. We'll see in 4 weeks =) 

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