GZ Bloodraven Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 32 minutes ago, Aldarion said: I know I'm not Bloodraven, but - entirety of Africa and the Middle East. Europeans divided the map by drawing lines on the map, while completely ignoring the ethnic/tribal composition of these areas. So you have the situation where each state has multiple tribes in it, while at the same time some tribes are divided by artificial borders. Result being that Africa is full of dysfunctional states. They wanted me to talk about another example in fiction, but I wasn't talking about other examples in fiction. But this is a good example of people who thought they were white saviors with superior weapons "stopping tribal violence and slavery" and making the problem worse in many senses. 4 hours ago, the trees have eyes said: So you are projecting the Iraq war and rise of ISIS onto Slaver's Bay. That's a rather crude, even facile, comparison. Assuming anti-war George was not considering the war that was happening from 2003-2011 in influencing the events in Meereen seems intentionally ignorant. It's not one-to-one, frankly none of the real-world allegories are one-to-one that's the point of a fantasy series, but it is definitely influencing it. Slaver's Bay is also, as others mentioned, influenced by the confederacy and KKK, what with the slave state and all. There, you could argue, that George is talking about the importance of an effective reconstruction. Which is essentially what I am talking about: after a leader deposes an unjust system, how do they stabilize that system? It's a timeless political question, one that George is clearly discussing. 17 hours ago, Lord Varys said: The slaves in Slaver's Bay are just slaves - they are not racialized slaves, they come in all colors - like the runaways slaves who founded Braavos. It is a wrong take on the setting to equate the slaves in Slaver's Bay with PoC. Just as it is wrong to view the Westerosi as 'white' when they most obviously don't view themselves - nor are they viewed - as the rulers/most powerful people of the world ... nor have they ever been a colonizing force. Hell, even Valyria is more the American Empire than the British Empire in the sense that they didn't really try to colonize, say, Sothoryos. They did establish some military outposts and the like, but they didn't act like the British and took over huge countries. This is a good point, but Dany, a Valyrian, is white, and the Ghiscari, largely, are POC. As @Nathan Stark said, the show did a lot to create this view, and obviously the white savior critique wouldn't be accepted in-universe because they don't really do skin-color race. It can only be levied because of the metatextual reading that Dany, a white woman, saves mostly POC people, the slaves, and we are told about this from her perspective alone. For me it's as simple as that, and it's a white savior narrative. Again, I'm not saying that this is bad or bad storytelling: I actually think part of why the Meereen stuff is compelling (I mean for most people it isn't that compelling, but putting that aside) is because of Dany's limited white (Valyrian, if you'd prefer) savior perspective on what the hell to do now that she did a regime change. Like, what next? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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