Silent Arya

[SeanF]

16 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

I’m very much looking forward to reading your posts when RamRam dies screaming by whoever’s hand. I’m sure they’ll be full of understanding and compassion and totes heartfelt, all sympathy for poor, unjustly killed hero Ramsay Bolton. Because if you’re “demanding justice” for a non-character who was screwing widows and orphans, and a nasty, cowardly deserter w/ hints of paedophilia, I can only imagine the outrage when it’s Ramsay or Walder or others who are also epitomes of good and just and moral behaviour. 
 

I’ve said before that I don’t get when people are willing to come across as someone who doesn’t understand the text just b/c “boohoo I don’t like character x”. 
There’s something else I don’t understand, perhaps you can help me. I don’t get how or why one would rather make statements aligning themselves w/ the vilest characters in the books b/c, again, “boohoo I don’t like character x”. 
So my question to you is, are these ridiculous arguments just something you’re spewing w/o conviction just b/c “boohoo yadda yadda yadda”, or are these pathetic arguments representative of your beliefs? 
 

I understand the concept of “death of the author”, but any such argument needs to have *some* basis in the text.

In fact, the text must be treated as sacrosanct.  It requires close reading, critical skills, and placing each character’s words, thoughts, and actions in their proper context.

One can’t make things up, ignore textual evidence to the contrary, and invent bad motives, for good actions, for characters one does not like.

There is simply no critical interpretation , offered in good faith, that allows one to view people like Tywin, Walder Frey, the slavers, the Boltons, as heroic, or people like Ned, Catelyn, or Jon as villainous.

There is plenty of room to debate whether Ned’s, Catelyn’s, Jon’s actions were counter-productive or wise, or whether they are flawed.  But, none to debate if they are villains.

Edited March 29, 2023 by SeanF

[kissdbyfire]

3 hours ago, SeanF said:

I understand the concept of “death of the author”, but any such argument needs to have *some* basis in the text.

In fact, the text must be treated as sacrosanct.  It requires close reading, critical skills, and placing each character’s words, thoughts, and actions in their proper context.

One can’t make things up, ignore textual evidence to the contrary, and invent bad motives, for good actions, for characters one does not like.

Yes x 1,000.

3 hours ago, SeanF said:

There is simply no critical interpretation , offered in good faith, that allows one to view people like Tywin, Walder Frey, the slavers, the Boltons, as heroic, or people like Ned, Catelyn, or Jon as villainous.

There is plenty of room to debate whether Ned’s, Catelyn’s, Jon’s actions were counter-productive or wise, or whether they are flawed.  But, none to debate if they are villains.

Unless of course one actually holds certain beliefs or shares some of the… proclivities these vile characters have for evil, cruelty, and any number of horrible traits.
Which brings me back to the point I made: are these terrible arguments made in defence of the indefensible something these “readers” do just for shits and giggles or do they actually believe what they’re saying? I honestly don’t know. 

Edited March 29, 2023 by kissdbyfire

[Moiraine Sedai]

Arya is a vigilante who doesn’t understand nor cares to understand what justice is.  Dareon didn’t receive any justice. At least here we are talking of justice when it comes to punishing Arya.  

[kissdbyfire]

35 minutes ago, Moiraine Sedai said:

Arya is a vigilante who doesn’t understand nor cares to understand what justice is.  Dareon didn’t receive any justice. At least here we are talking of justice when it comes to punishing Arya.  

Pardon my French, but give me a fucking break. I have never seen you and your mates show any interest whatsoever in actually engaging w/ others in real debates about the books. All you do is spew ridiculous and moronic “arguments” aimed at dissing characters/houses you don’t like. That’s all you lot ever do, end of.
Trying to disguise any argument as a “demand for justice” or whatever doesn’t fly b/c even the freshest nOObs are already onto you guys and your MO; in fact, I think new members probably catch on this dumb af behaviour within 10 minutes of joining. But since this is all you seem to be capable of doing to “contribute”, have at it. And those of us who see clearly what you’re doing will keep shooting these idiotic claims down. 

[Craving Peaches]

3 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

MO

Modus operandi makes it sound more advanced than it actually is. Anyone is capable of spewing such tripe with no preparation whatsoever.

[kissdbyfire]

13 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said:

Modus operandi makes it sound more advanced than it actually is. Anyone is capable of spewing such tripe with no preparation whatsoever.

Yeah, good point. I’ll leave as is, throw them a bone as it were. 

[GZ Bloodraven]

12 hours ago, James West said:

Just right if her only crimes are what she has done so far.  Much too light if she continues to murder.  I am predicting Arya will commit the mass murder of King's Landing to get to her enemies.  There is no punishment stiff enough for that level of crime against life.  

If she goes Aerys II, we can crown her queen of the Seven Kingdoms and finally get a full First Man on the throne. 

Edited March 29, 2023 by GZ Bloodraven

[Here's Looking At You, Kid]

On 3/22/2023 at 3:34 AM, The Lord of the Crossing said:

A lot of talk on the appropriate punishment for Arya Stark for the crimes of foul murder.  Specifically, the murders of Dareon and the Insurance Underwriter.  She is guilty of many more murders but some are claiming those others acts of self-defense.  The old witch saw many more murders in Arya's short future but we can only judge and sentence for crimes already committed.  There is no justice in punishing somebody for what they might do or what they are predicted to do.  And this is about justice. 

Arya has no objections to handing the dead.  A fair punishment for crimes already committed is a life time of servitude to the Silent Sisters.  There obviously has to be a method to keep Arya from running away.  And we can further speculate on how that might be accomplished.  Perhaps a magic binder that will keep Arya bound to the Silent sisters or something of the like. 

This is fair in my opinion.  At least she is given a chance for redemption even though she feels no guilt. 

Comment below and let me know if you consider this too light of a sentence.  Too light or just right? 

It isn't in Arya's personality to conform to the rigidity of the silent sisterhood.  There is only one place for Arya and that is with a pack of wild direwolves.  I believe she will die and live as a direwolf with Jon.  Better yet just send her to the grave if we require guarantees.  Arya is too big a danger, human or wolf, and too out of control. 

Edited March 29, 2023 by Here's Looking At You, Kid

[kissdbyfire]

1 minute ago, Here's Looking At You, Kid said:

It isn't in Arya's personality to conform to the rigidity of the silent sisterhood.  There is only one place for Arya and that is with the Wildlings.  Better yet just send her to the grave if we require guarantees.  Arya is too big a danger and too out of control. 

Defending the  execution of a traumatised child says more about you than said child, but don’t let me stop you from making a nasty and dumb argument. *YAWN*

[X-Buster]

On 3/22/2023 at 3:34 AM, The Lord of the Crossing said:

A lot of talk on the appropriate punishment for Arya Stark for the crimes of foul murder.  Specifically, the murders of Dareon and the Insurance Underwriter.  She is guilty of many more murders but some are claiming those others acts of self-defense.  The old witch saw many more murders in Arya's short future but we can only judge and sentence for crimes already committed.  There is no justice in punishing somebody for what they might do or what they are predicted to do.  And this is about justice. 

Arya has no objections to handing the dead.  A fair punishment for crimes already committed is a life time of servitude to the Silent Sisters.  There obviously has to be a method to keep Arya from running away.  And we can further speculate on how that might be accomplished.  Perhaps a magic binder that will keep Arya bound to the Silent sisters or something of the like. 

This is fair in my opinion.  At least she is given a chance for redemption even though she feels no guilt. 

Comment below and let me know if you consider this too light of a sentence.  Too light or just right? 

It will never work for Arya.  The girl can't commit to anything and she is bad at obeying rules.  Arya can't be trusted to stay with the sisters because her mental condition will worsen over time. 

[GZ Bloodraven]

21 hours ago, X-Buster said:

It will never work for Arya.  The girl can't commit to anything and she is bad at obeying rules.  Arya can't be trusted to stay with the sisters because her mental condition will worsen over time. 

She can commit to killing the people she wants to kill.... 

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

On 3/29/2023 at 2:38 PM, kissdbyfire said:

Pardon my French, but give me a fucking break. I have never seen you and your mates show any interest whatsoever in actually engaging w/ others in real debates about the books. All you do is spew ridiculous and moronic “arguments” aimed at dissing characters/houses you don’t like. That’s all you lot ever do, end of.
Trying to disguise any argument as a “demand for justice” or whatever doesn’t fly b/c even the freshest nOObs are already onto you guys and your MO; in fact, I think new members probably catch on this dumb af behaviour within 10 minutes of joining. But since this is all you seem to be capable of doing to “contribute”, have at it. And those of us who see clearly what you’re doing will keep shooting these idiotic claims down. 

[Only 89 selfies today]

On 3/22/2023 at 3:34 AM, The Lord of the Crossing said:

A lot of talk on the appropriate punishment for Arya Stark for the crimes of foul murder.  Specifically, the murders of Dareon and the Insurance Underwriter.  She is guilty of many more murders but some are claiming those others acts of self-defense.  The old witch saw many more murders in Arya's short future but we can only judge and sentence for crimes already committed.  There is no justice in punishing somebody for what they might do or what they are predicted to do.  And this is about justice. 

Arya has no objections to handing the dead.  A fair punishment for crimes already committed is a life time of servitude to the Silent Sisters.  There obviously has to be a method to keep Arya from running away.  And we can further speculate on how that might be accomplished.  Perhaps a magic binder that will keep Arya bound to the Silent sisters or something of the like. 

This is fair in my opinion.  At least she is given a chance for redemption even though she feels no guilt. 

Comment below and let me know if you consider this too light of a sentence.  Too light or just right? 

Aray won't get redemption.  She thinks she's right.  Redemption is not deserved for Arya. 

[Only 89 selfies today]

Arya Stark is on the receiving end of a lot of dislikes and criticisms because she is guilty of terrible crimes.  It is not trolling to attack Arya Stark.  She deserves it.  Rickon gets very little hate because he has done nothing to earn it.  Arya has.  This  excuse from some of her defenders that attacks on Arya is trolling is not valid. 

 

[Only 89 selfies today]

On 3/30/2023 at 11:28 PM, X-Buster said:

It will never work for Arya.  The girl can't commit to anything and she is bad at obeying rules.  Arya can't be trusted to stay with the sisters because her mental condition will worsen over time. 

Placing Arya in a convent is not effective.  Only escape-proof jail will contain her.  Containment or execution are the only viable options for dealing with Arya Stark.

7 hours ago, GZ Bloodraven said:

She can commit to killing the people she wants to kill.... 

GZ has a valid point.  Arya can focus and she is "committed" to killing.  Take note that compulsion is a better word to use in Arya's example.

Arya will not stop killing.  Arya's insanity compels her to kill and kill repeatedly.

[kissdbyfire]

7 minutes ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

Arya Stark is on the receiving end of a lot of dislikes and criticisms because she is guilty of terrible crimes.  It is not trolling to attack Arya Stark.  She deserves it.  Rickon gets very little hate because he has done nothing to earn it.  Arya has.  This  excuse from some of her defenders that attacks on Arya is trolling is not valid. 

 

As usual, 100% certified bollocks. Because the “dislike and criticisms” she is getting are coming exclusively from the same crowd of usual suspects who do nothing but repeat the same ridiculous arguments in their attempts to paint the Starks as the villains of the story.
Rickon doesn’t get it as bad as the other Starks because he’s barely appeared and he’s 3, so maybe even you guys are struggling to vilify him. I’m sure that will change the second he has a more active role in the story. 

[Craving Peaches]

29 minutes ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

Arya's insanity compels her to kill and kill repeatedly.

What definition of insanity are you using? Because if it is the legal one, Arya gets off the hook...so make up your mind. Arya cannot be an evil mass murderess who must be punished but also carry out all of those murders due to her 'insanity'... because if that is the case she would be not guilty.

40 minutes ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

It is not trolling to attack Arya Stark.

It is when it is done with zero evidence in irrelevant threads by the same people all the time who have nothing to back it up as usual and just want an excuse to bash the character. I don't know why this thread was even opened when there was already a thread to bash Arya in. I assume because that one was reaching the page limit.

[GZ Bloodraven]

10 hours ago, Only 89 selfies today said:

GZ has a valid point.  Arya can focus and she is "committed" to killing.  Take note that compulsion is a better word to use in Arya's example.

Arya will not stop killing.  Arya's insanity compels her to kill and kill repeatedly.

Jesus christ, I give you a bone and you run a mile with it. Arya is an assassin now, it's her profession, her insanity doesn't compel her to kill, her trauma and misunderstanding of effective retribution does. She's like 11 years old. People watched that movie James Gunn made about the psycho superhero kid and now think all 11 year old murderers are all the same serial killers, sheesh. 

[TheLastWolf]

7 hours ago, GZ Bloodraven said:

Jesus christ, I give you a bone and you run a mile with it. Arya is an assassin now, it's her profession, her insanity doesn't compel her to kill, her trauma and misunderstanding of effective retribution does. She's like 11 years old. People watched that movie James Gunn made about the psycho superhero kid and now think all 11 year old murderers are all the same serial killers, sheesh. 

They mistook you for one of their alts, too numerous to keep track of. So let's cut them some slack. You can be sure that right now they're ruffling through their documents to find if an alt account has been hacked or sth.

[Nevets]

7 hours ago, GZ Bloodraven said:

Jesus christ, I give you a bone and you run a mile with it. Arya is an assassin now, it's her profession, her insanity doesn't compel her to kill, her trauma and misunderstanding of effective retribution does. She's like 11 years old. People watched that movie James Gunn made about the psycho superhero kid and now think all 11 year old murderers are all the same serial killers, sheesh. 

Arya's not an assassin and isn't going to be.  She's a trainee, and I doubt she'll get much further.

Other than that, I basically agree.  Her actions are very much influenced by her wartime experiences.  I may disagree with some of her actions, but they are definitely not irrational.  They make perfect sense, especially to an 11-year-old.