Jump to content

The allegory of the Last Hero


three-eyed monkey
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Mourning Star said:

Not that it matters at all, but I'm a he.

I would point out that Howland Reed also sought magic, but he looked to the Isle of Faces, not North of the Wall.

"The lad knew the magics of the crannogs," she continued, "but he wanted more. Our people seldom travel far from home, you know. We're a small folk, and our ways seem queer to some, so the big people do not always treat us kindly. But this lad was bolder than most, and one day when he had grown to manhood he decided he would leave the crannogs and visit the Isle of Faces."
"No one visits the Isle of Faces," objected Bran. "That's where the green men live."
"It was the green men he meant to find. So he donned a shirt sewn with bronze scales, like mine, took up a leathern shield and a three-pronged spear, like mine, and paddled a little skin boat down the Green Fork."

 

A thousand pardons, Ser.  Perhaps the difference is in the type of guidance they sought?  Perhaps proximity?  Howland sent Bran's escort so perhaps it was the little Crannogman who determined where Bran should go.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Curled Finger said:

A thousand pardons, Ser.  Perhaps the difference is in the type of guidance they sought?  Perhaps proximity?  Howland sent Bran's escort so perhaps it was the little Crannogman who determined where Bran should go.  

No worries! I expanded on the post above to briefly outline my thoughts on the possibility of two factions of Children.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

@three-eyed monkey, is it your feeling then that the eventual heroes reenacting the Battle for Dawn will represent all the 7 Kingdoms and the Iron Islands?  

No, I don't think battle will win the dawn at all. The key is in forging the sword, in particular the tempering of the blade. This is how the Last Hero and Azor Ahai (same guy if you ask me) won the day. That's why the sword was called Lightbringer, it brought back the light. That's why the Others could not stand against the Last Hero's dragonsteel blade, it brought back the light, the touch of the sun the Others hate.

It is the dawn that defeats the night, the spring that defeats winter. Not swords or dragons, the inevitable attempts to defeat the Others this way will fail. It's the process of tempering of the blade, and all that involves, that will bring back the dawn and end the Long Night.

1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

Another thing that caught my eye reading through, and it is a very good read, should have mentioned that in the 1st post, is an old idea that Bran was already the Last Hero.  Again, I have to credit @Lost Melnibonean with that idea.  Geez, he sure has influenced my thinking a lot.  Not to take anything away from the OP, but to add perhaps dimension to this conversation, the old idea went something along the lines that Bran has already encountered most of his companions.  He's lost Osha and Rickon and the Liddle, I think.  Jojen doesn't look long for the world (of course this is the guy who helped developed Jojen Paste).  Summer appears to have joined another pack.  Perhaps he will be kind enough to drop the archived piece in here as the explanation is much better than I can do it justice.  The point in conjunction with this Last Hero conversation is that the story may not be epic in the way we understand it to be.  Bran's companions all appear to be Northern whereas like the OP, I do expect the original hero companions were from all over the entire realm.  We understand TLH's companions to have died where we see Bran's companions have not all died but gone elsewhere for...reasons.  The OP proposes TLH and his companions were kings where on the surface no one in Bran's tale is a king--yet.   TLH is a very complicated tale not to be diminished by it's simplified telling.  You have to understand that going in as the OP has done in uncovering some lovely arcane connections. 

Sure, Bran's horse Dancer died, gets you thinking that the dog might be Summer, etc. I bet we could name twelve companions that die along the way too. Bran did find the children so on the surface it makes sense that he must be the Last Hero, except the rest doesn't really add up.

The symbolism of honor and oaths and truth and kingship are more appropriate to Jon's character arc in my opinion. Jon is the one who dreams of wielding a flaming sword. I believe Jon, not Bran, will be the one who forges the dragonsteel sword. I think Jon will be the one faced with a choice of becoming the Night's King or the Last Hero. 

And while Jon hasn't found the children, he doesn't need to because Bran will find him. This has already happened when Bran was in a weirwood and Jon was wearing the skin of Ghost. Jon will skinchange Ghost again soon.

The Last Hero searched for the children in the hope that their magic might win back what the armies of men had lost. The result was his dragonsteel sword. The children are not smiths, but they still knew the secret of tempering the blade. That is the magic that is needed to bring back the dawn. And Bran will learn that, as I think he has already seen it when he looked into the heart of winter. I believe Azor Ahai and Nissa Nissa took place in front of a weirwood, and that's what the heart of winter is. Jon will learn the secret from Bran, once Bran learns to make sense of what he saw.

I don't know how it went down last time, I'm not even sure if the Last Hero ever found the children, but it seems he did learn what was needed to win back what the armies of men had lost. That's all he really needed. Whether he learned it face to face with the children or through a greenseer, who knows? We know a greenseer is important to the process, that's why the Three-Eyed Crow told Bran he must live - because winter is coming. It doesn't mean the greenseer is the Last Hero.

4 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

I didn't throw Bran in here to muddy waters.  As stated, he's only brought in to add dimension to the existing conversation which is fascinating.

Bran's important to this and the waters are muddy already, thanks to GRRM.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, three-eyed monkey said:

That's why the sword was called Lightbringer, it brought back the light. That's why the Others could not stand against the Last Hero's dragonsteel blade, it brought back the light, the touch of the sun the Others hate.

I'm not convinced that Azhor Ahai and his flaming sword made by killing his love represent the good guys in this tale.

"Now do you see my meaning? Be glad that it is just a burnt sword that His Grace pulled from that fire. Too much light can hurt the eyes, my friend, and fire burns."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Mourning Star said:

I'm not convinced that Azhor Ahai and his flaming sword made by killing his love represent the good guys in this tale.

Well, the point of the legend is really the self-sacrifice of Nissa Nissa. Self-sacrifice is the only form of true sacrifice, as Stannis will soon learn. It was Nissa Nissa's courage and strength that went into the blade, these are key ingredients if you ask me. People who have the strength and courage to sacrifice themselves for others are good guys, surely.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, three-eyed monkey said:

Well, the point of the legend is really the self-sacrifice of Nissa Nissa. Self-sacrifice is the only form of true sacrifice, as Stannis will soon learn. It was Nissa Nissa's courage and strength that went into the blade, these are key ingredients if you ask me. People who have the strength and courage to sacrifice themselves for others are good guys, surely.

Right and there is already plenty of sacrifice and self sacrifice among the many heroes in this tale.  All the Stark children, Danaerys, Tyrion, Jamie, Brienne, The Hound, Dondarion, Thoros, Catelyn (endless list here) have lost whether by sacrifice or fate.  How much more is needed for this forging and what exactly is to be forged?  Surely not a real sword blade of any sort of steel?  Will Dawn light up?  Is all the gods' thirst for suffering finally sated when Jon falls on a sword for the last time?  Bring this down to my not great with symbolism level.  You know I enjoy this, help me understand it better.  I think we discussed previously that I never understood the AA prophecy beyond a tale of murder and kinslaying without getting too woo woo here.  I'm not good with symbolism.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, three-eyed monkey said:

Well, the point of the legend is really the self-sacrifice of Nissa Nissa. Self-sacrifice is the only form of true sacrifice, as Stannis will soon learn. It was Nissa Nissa's courage and strength that went into the blade, these are key ingredients if you ask me. People who have the strength and courage to sacrifice themselves for others are good guys, surely.

So I agree with the sentiment, but I'm not sure it represents the breadth of the stories we have here.

After all, I think this story gives us room to consider that the hero one day might be the villain the next. Or the villain to some might be the hero to Others. And the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Or as Virgil would say, the decent to hell is easy.

Let's say the last hero forged his blade in the heart of his beloved.

Let's say he defeated the White Walkers.

What would he be willing to sacrifice to bring back his love? Would he plunge the world into darkness?

Did the Last Hero end the Long Night, or did he cause it? Was it the Others who stayed true and were trying to stop him?

What had the armies of men lost?

So as cold and death filled the earth, the last hero determined to seek out the children, in the hopes that their ancient magics could win back what the armies of men had lost. He set out into the dead lands with a sword, a horse, a dog, and a dozen companions. For years he searched, until he despaired of ever finding the children of the forest in their secret cities. One by one his friends died, and his horse, and finally even his dog, and his sword froze so hard the blade snapped when he tried to use it. And the Others smelled the hot blood in him, and came silent on his trail, stalking him with packs of pale white spiders big as hounds—"

Was there a time before the Long Night, before the Wall, when the White Walkers existed? Were they a threat before the Long Night?

I'm obviously just speculating, but we have tales of Symeon Star Eyes and Serwyn of the Mirror Shield, which I think may represent White Walkers in Westeros before the Wall. Not seemingly representing them as evil either.

Were the White Walkers all Others? Were the Others all White Walkers? Are they the same thing or is one a part or faction of the other?

How the Long Night came to an end is a matter of legend, as all such matters of the distant past have become. In the North, they tell of a last hero who sought out the intercession of the children of the forest, his companions abandoning him or dying one by one as they faced ravenous giants, cold servants, and the Others themselves. Alone he finally reached the children, despite the efforts of the white walkers, and all the tales agree this was a turning point. Thanks to the children, the first men of the Night's Watch banded together and were able to fight—and win—the Battle for the Dawn: the last battle that broke the endless winter and sent the Others fleeing to the icy north. Now, six thousand years later (or eight thousand as True History puts forward), the Wall made to defend the realms of men is still manned by the sworn brothers of the Night's Watch, and neither the Others nor the children have been seen in many centuries.

History is written (or expunged) by the victor, and all crows are liars.

Was the Night's King the "thirteenth man to lead the Night's Watch", the same as the Last Hero and his twelve companions?

The gathering gloom put Bran in mind of another of Old Nan's stories, the tale of Night's King. He had been the thirteenth man to lead the Night's Watch, she said; a warrior who knew no fear. "And that was the fault in him," she would add, "for all men must know fear." A woman was his downfall; a woman glimpsed from atop the Wall, with skin as white as the moon and eyes like blue stars. Fearing nothing, he chased her and caught her and loved her, though her skin was cold as ice, and when he gave his seed to her he gave his soul as well.
He brought her back to the Nightfort and proclaimed her a queen and himself her king, and with strange sorceries he bound his Sworn Brothers to his will. For thirteen years they had ruled, Night's King and his corpse queen, till finally the Stark of Winterfell and Joramun of the wildlings had joined to free the Watch from bondage. After his fall, when it was found he had been sacrificing to the Others, all records of Night's King had been destroyed, his very name forbidden.

What if this is the same tale as the Bloodstone Emperor?

When the daughter of the Opal Emperor succeeded him as the Amethyst Empress, her envious younger brother cast her down and slew her, proclaiming himself the Bloodstone Emperor and beginning a reign of terror. He practiced dark arts, torture, and necromancy, enslaved his people, took a tiger-woman for his bride, feasted on human flesh, and cast down the true gods to worship a black stone that had fallen from the sky. (Many scholars count the Bloodstone Emperor as the first High Priest of the sinister Church of Starry Wisdom, which persists to this day in many port cities throughout the known world).
In the annals of the Further East, it was the Blood Betrayal, as his usurpation is named, that ushered in the age of darkness called the Long Night. Despairing of the evil that had been unleashed on earth, the Maiden-Made-of-Light turned her back upon the world, and the Lion of Night came forth in all his wroth to punish the wickedness of men.

I have lots of questions, and my heart is filled with doubt.

Edited by Mourning Star
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Mourning Star said:

As one can see from the quote above, the Children are not inherently peaceful or against war, they fought the First Men in the Dawn Age. I would suggest that those Children who kept to the pact might be found on the Gods Eye, where those that did not would live beyond the Wall. I do not think Bloodraven is the Three Eyed Crow.

This!  Are Leaf and friends allies of men?  Did they capture BR or did he agree to marry a tree?  They have their own greenseers hooked to trees, how many do they need?  Is Benjen hooked to a tree as well?  
I hope Bran and crew can find the back door if they need to get out. 
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

Or perhaps Brandon the Builder?  Sword of the Morning?  (Take a look above, I was going to tag you)

This

I think the last hero was Brandon the Builder. The last hero went looking for the CotF, so did Brandon the Builder.

Note that the fandom writes the last hero with capitals as "The Last Hero", but in the novels and the world book, he is not. It is not a name used to identify someone unknown as with the Night's King (which is written with capitals in the novels). By using "the last hero" it comes across as if the tales talk about someone who is known by name to history, and he was the last of the age of heroes.

There is no official demarcation between the Battle of the Dawn and the arrivals of the Andals as an era name, but it's quite clear that culturally a lot changed after the Long Night: the rise of petty kings instead of warlord chieftans of clans, and stone castles, isntead of the ringforts. It's an era of building and construction, and typically tied to Brandon the Builder... except he is also identified as a hero of the age of heroes. He's a bridging character.

On top of that he already was a helpful character, said to be a boy when he helped Durrandon with Storm's End, who only later in life became known as Brandon the Builder.

The nickname the Builder and the claims of his architectural achievements are a distortion of his true talents. Winterfell proves that Brandon the Builder was not an architect, and never was. In the chapter where Bran Stark climbs the walls of Winterfell and describes the castle, its walls and its grounds to us (aGoT, Bran II), he tells us that the grounds are not levelled. That is the detail that proves to us we should not regard Brandon the Builder to be an architect. Someone with the architectural knowledge to build the stone Hightower and the large drum structure of Storm's End (as a boy no less) and its curtain walls would know to level the grounds. A boy who can help build a castle that withstands storms, or a stone tower as high as that of Hightower, would not later in life end up building a mere humble round tower (albeit with gargoyles) on unleveled grounds.

I do think there's some truth though in Brandon's involvement with Storm's End and the Hightower, but it has nothing to do with architecture, but everything with helping to create a magical ward. We know that Storm's End has an ancient warding magic that prevents shadows from passing. The same is true for the Wall. For the Wall though it's stipulated that the CotF provided the magic spells, not Brandon. So, I'm inclined to believe that Brandon was involved in convincing CotF to create a warding spell for Storm's End, functioned as a middle man between Durrandon and the CotF, and instructed Durrandon on how to seal the spell.

But if Brandon the Builder did this mediation as a boy, then this means he went in search for the CotF "to learn their language" also as a boy, during the Long Night, and remained with the CotF for several years to "learn their language". Bran Stark opines that no human can actually learn the language of the CotF, but I bet they could communicate in other ways, via imagery, especially if he was a greenseer.

So, now we have a greenseer boy searching for CotF to be taught by them to be a greenseer, and remaining with them, and acting as a mediator to acquire their help in helping men such as Durrandon during the Long Night. That is very much like Bran Stark. And on top of that we also have the tale of the "last hero" who also went in search of the CotF to get their help against the Others, losing his horse, dog, companions, breaking the sword, facing ghouls and Others, which also is similar to Bran's story. So, for me the last hero = Brandon the Builder, who was not an architect, but a greenseer who helped Uthor Hightower and Durrandon in mediating with the CotF to cast a warding spell, how to seal it, remotely (via ravens and trees), as well as with the huge warding wall that goes from east to west entirely across the continent, and this Wall he sealed with his own blood. He "gifted" his blood seal "for the Watch" and settled north, to remain close if needs be, but enough physical distance so the seal could not be undone by slaying him. He chose a location where he could be warm (because there are several hints that not only did he have greenseer blood, but also proto-Valyrian dragonblood), and endure the cold, and built a round tower for his family.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, LongRider said:

This!  Are Leaf and friends allies of men?  Did they capture BR or did he agree to marry a tree?  They have their own greenseers hooked to trees, how many do they need?  Is Benjen hooked to a tree as well?  
I hope Bran and crew can find the back door if they need to get out. 
 

I think you can be at ease on this.  Bran is our only guy on the inside with any of this valuable skill and knowledge.  For better or worse, he is the good guys' connection to all the weirnet and those time banks.  When he's done there he will have more power than your basic COTF for he will be one of their greenseers.  What the OP is getting to is Bran is part of the TLH story, not the whole thing.  Jon will be the physical hero while Bran will be the psychic and I suspect there will be someones representing other aspects of this hero as well.  It is a big old dance of many.  If Jon or Theon or any other character is able to draw from Bran it makes sense he will be able to draw from others if needed.  We shall see.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, LongRider said:

I hope Bran and crew can find the back door if they need to get out.

I would suggest that the underground river flows all the way under the Wall (possibly what formed part or all of Gorne's Way) to the crypts of Winterfell. And the "back door" to Bloodraven's Lair may be important if someone has to come back, to, I don't know, finish the job.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, Mourning Star said:

 the Stark of Winterfell and Joramun of the wildlings had joined to free the Watch from bondage

You know one of the 1st things that confused the heck out of me reading ASOIAF was the difference between the White Walkers, Others and Wights.  That was hard.  Good on you for picking up on that one.  Then the Nissa Nissa, Nights Queen.  My big take away is both stories have women in them.  That bit above made me sit up straight though.  I bet I've red that passage a hundred times.  I bet I've bolded it a hundred times.  The Stark in Winterfell.  So, is this another piece of the puzzle too? Does Winterfell need be vacant of its Stark to exact a good ass whipping of The Others?   Or must The Stark join with the wildlings.  Jon's never been The Stark.  This is an interesting bit of writing here.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

You know one of the 1st things that confused the heck out of me reading ASOIAF was the difference between the White Walkers, Others and Wights.  That was hard.  Good on you for picking up on that one.  Then the Nissa Nissa, Nights Queen.  My big take away is both stories have women in them.  That bit above made me sit up straight though.  I bet I've red that passage a hundred times.  I bet I've bolded it a hundred times.  The Stark in Winterfell.  So, is this another piece of the puzzle too? Does Winterfell need be vacant of its Stark to exact a good ass whipping of The Others?   Or must The Stark join with the wildlings.  Jon's never been The Stark.  This is an interesting bit of writing here.  

Why do you call him the Stark in Winterfell unless there is another Stark? (If it's unclear, I'm insinuating the Night's King)

He brought her back to the Nightfort and proclaimed her a queen and himself her king, and with strange sorceries he bound his Sworn Brothers to his will. For thirteen years they had ruled, Night's King and his corpse queen, till finally the Stark of Winterfell and Joramun of the wildlings had joined to free the Watch from bondage. After his fall, when it was found he had been sacrificing to the Others, all records of Night's King had been destroyed, his very name forbidden.
"Some say he was a Bolton," Old Nan would always end. "Some say a Magnar out of Skagos, some say Umber, Flint, or Norrey. Some would have you think he was a Woodfoot, from them who ruled Bear Island before the ironmen came. He never was. He was a Stark, the brother of the man who brought him down." She always pinched Bran on the nose then, he would never forget it. "He was a Stark of Winterfell, and who can say? Mayhaps his name was Brandon. Mayhaps he slept in this very bed in this very room."

Is the last bit from Nan talking about the Night's King or the man who brought him down?

Who was Joramun?!?! Was he a white walker? Was he a Stark?

Archmaester Fomas's Lies of the Ancients—though little regarded these days for its erroneous claims regarding the founding of Valyria and certain lineal claims in the Reach and westerlands—does speculate that the Others of legend were nothing more than a tribe of the First Men, ancestors of the wildlings, that had established itself in the far north. Because of the Long Night, these early wildlings were then pressured to begin a wave of conquests to the south. That they became monstrous in the tales told thereafter, according to Fomas, reflects the desire of the Night's Watch and the Starks to give themselves a more heroic identity as saviors of mankind, and not merely the beneficiaries of a struggle over dominion.

What if Fomas has it backwards, and the tales of Joramun of the Wildlings is a tale of the Others?

Edited by Mourning Star
Link to comment
Share on other sites

40 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

So, now we have a greenseer boy searching for CotF to be taught by them to be a greenseer, and remaining with them, and acting as a mediator to acquire their help in helping men such as Durrandon during the Long Night. That is very much like Bran Stark. And on top of that we also have the tale of the "last hero" who also went in search of the CotF to get their help against the Others, losing his horse, dog, companions, breaking the sword, facing ghouls and Others, which also is similar to Bran's story. So, for me the last hero = Brandon the Builder, who was not an architect, but a greenseer who helped Uthor Hightower and Durrandon in mediating with the CotF to cast a warding spell, how to seal it, remotely (via ravens and trees), as well as with the huge warding wall that goes from east to west entirely across the continent, and this Wall he sealed with his own blood. He "gifted" his blood seal "for the Watch" and settled north, to remain close if needs be, but enough physical distance so the seal could not be undone by slaying him. He chose a location where he could be warm (because there are several hints that not only did he have greenseer blood, but also proto-Valyrian dragonblood), and endure the cold, and built a round tower for his family.

Specifically for Bran, his "companions" can be more symbolic: Ned, Robb, Catelyn, Luwin, Rodrik, Theon kind of, Osha and Rickon, Jojen, eventually Meera, Hodor (his horse), Summer (his dog), maybe Dark Sister (his sword).

And Brandon the Builder, depending on how long he lived and truly how much he did, probably himself was or appointed the first Lord Commander, sought the Children of the Forest with some of his brothers and the CotF, with the Night's Watch help, ended the Long Night. I'd say the parallels line up more with Bran than Jon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Curled Finger and @three-eyed monkey

What connects Brandon the Builder as last hero to Jon, is that mixture of greenseer with dragonblood. There are only two people (still) alive in aDwD who had a similar mixture of blood: Bloodraven and Jon. Bran Stark does not have 50/50 green/dragonblood. Both have kingsblood (Targ blood), both were LC of the Wall, both have a Valyrian Steel sword. And though Jon is not a greenseer, he can skinchange. Both represent this blood seal I propose on the magical ward.

The cave with BR also has a ward (albeit a much smaller one), and BR likely knows how that ward is created and what is required to seal it and what could break that blood seal. And not only did BR prolong his life in search for a new greenseer in that cave, he basically removed himself and Dark Sister from the Wall.

We get some particular interactions between BR and Jon:

  • twice he enters Jon's dreams to wake him up: a wolf dream and a Wall dream. Greenseers seem to be the sole ones who are able to enter into someone else's dream. Jojen used to wake up Bran from his wolf dreams, but Jon has no Jojen to watch over him dreaming when he wargs. BR does it for Jon in aDwD. But not just with the wolf dream, also with that Wall dream. I think that's actually also a skinchanger dream, but not of an animal but of the magical wall. And in that dream, BR doesn't just peck at his chest as raven and calls his name as a dream-moon, he actually grabs Jon by the shoulder with his gnarled arm. 
  • As BR-raven he also is against Jon swapping the babes. Mance's son is a hostage, and hostages are wards, and sending your wards away could backfire. I believe BR foresaw some connection to the swapping of the babes and the Pink Letter and the assassination attempt on Jon's life, whose blood would spill and would break the warding spell of the Wall. And when Jon claims there's no power in Mance's blood, or king's blood or brigand's blood, the raven screams "blood". We know brigand's blood has power, because the outlaw Beric can put a regular sword aflame with his own fire-kissed blood.
  • I also think that's why BR is trying to help out Stannis together with Bran: to prevent the Pink Letter from being sent (but well you and I agree at least that Ramsay was not the author of that letter)

We should expect to witness how the ward of BR's cave ends up being broken. I suspect this happens timeline wise between Jon's Wall dream and the day of the Pink Letter. I'm certain that BR is dead by the time of Jon's last chapter of aDwD. 

There's no need to forge "lightbringer". The swords already exist. It's the type of blood that runs across the blade that creates a lightbringer. As for the last hero's sword: that was likely Dawn. Created from a meteor, but likely imbued with proto-Valyrian bonecoal when it was laid on the pyre of a dragonblooded Dayne, and the next, and the next. That's imo what makes VS: not steel with regular coal, but bonecoal of dragonblooded people. Imo Brandon the Builder was a bastard son of a Dayne daughter, and was recognized as kin and thefore as having the right to wield the sword. Once he chose to remain north, he had Dawn sent back to Starfall.

And yes, the NK comes into this, but not as a "choice". It's quire clear that Jon refuses every NK scenario presented to him with each woman that is even remotely a stand-in for the corpse queen: Gilly, Mel and even Val. I argue that the NK events took place a few centuries after the Battle for the Dawn. The corpse queen stand ins have something in common - they all are smuggled beyond a warded wall. Remember that Mel didn't need anyone to smuggle her into Renly's camp (a green king) to slay him with a shadow. It was an "open field". Before the Wall, the white shadows could go wherever they pleased, except for CotF (who most likely sheltered behind wards). Once the Wall existed, they could not pass. So their magical monstrous mother needed to be smuggled south of the Wall to birth her sons/Others there, just like Mel needs Davos to smuggle her beyond the walls of SE. It was under her influence that he proclaimed himself king and began to sacrifice to the Others, giving her "his seed". Seed is not just used to refer to semen, but to offspring - dragonseed, etc. So, the NK was sacrificing "his blood" to the corpse queen and the Others. I do think the desire or aim here was to cause the seal of the magical ward to break. But the NK was at the wrong location (the Nightfort) and not actually sacrificing his own blood. He had no dragonsteel sword. And even if he was a Stark, his dragonblood may have been dilluted too much already to be a mirror/echo of Brandon's. However, Brandon the Breaker and the NW had enough info to suspect what the intent was - the breaking of Brandon's blood seal. They therefore did not just destroyed his name from the records to punish the NK, but to prevent other people from figuring out part of  "the recipe". It worked for milennia.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, GZ Bloodraven said:

Specifically for Bran, his "companions" can be more symbolic: Ned, Robb, Catelyn, Luwin, Rodrik, Theon kind of, Osha and Rickon, Jojen, eventually Meera, Hodor (his horse), Summer (his dog), maybe Dark Sister (his sword).

And Brandon the Builder, depending on how long he lived and truly how much he did, probably himself was or appointed the first Lord Commander, sought the Children of the Forest with some of his brothers and the CotF, with the Night's Watch help, ended the Long Night. I'd say the parallels line up more with Bran than Jon.

He actually lose his horse Dancer - died in the WF fire.

I don't think Dark Sister will break. The boy Brandon the Builder and last hero went in search of the CotF with a regular sword, which broke, and so would the swords he took from the WF crypts. But the last hero ended up fighting with Dawn, just as Meera will protect Bran with Dark Sister (and it not breaking).

But I agree: the loss of his friends, family, etc is not necessarily always loss in death, but also the loss of their companionship, and Bran started to lose those in aGoT already.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Mourning Star, I removed the reaction after you elaborated.  No offense intended.  I thought you were being a wise guy.  Now I get where you are coming from.  Do you believe this?  

@sweetsunray, yes, the bloodlines are hugely important and that should be clear from AGOT.  You are far more well read than I as to Martin's other writing.  I've only read Fevre Dream outside this universe.  Is all this complicated warding a thing he does normally?  Is Martin that smart?  I know YOU are.  Is he?  

Upfront, I have harbored a secret thought that TLH was indeed a Dayne bastard because it fit my ideas about bloodlines and the way things I don't know about ought to go, because duh, Dawn.  Doesn't get much easier than that, does it?  As the OP puts forth all these unfortunate things that befall TLH are symbolic (of...hoping to get there!)  The dog dying is the loss of the hero's ability to tell the truth from a lie, the loss of his horse is the loss of his honor and so forth.  I think this is really a bitchen idea.  May have no foundation at all but it resonates and I dig it.  Particularly where I consider Bran receiving intercession from the Children.  Dang that's cool.  

So, my esteemed mavens of symbolism and all things heady and difficult to understand, is it possible the legend of the last hero isn't a literal but metaphorical tale?  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

I removed the reaction after you elaborated.  No offense intended.  I thought you were being a wise guy.  Now I get where you are coming from.  Do you believe this?  

Sorry, not sure exactly what you are referencing. I'm terrible about posting then reading it and adding/changing over the next few minutes. That's 100% on me!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...