The Martells and the Tower of Joy

[EggBlue]

6 hours ago, Groo said:

 

Ned, party of 9! Your duel is ready. If you'll come this way, please, we have a lovely, secluded tower for you.

6 hours ago, Groo said:

 

I'm trying to wrap my head around the idea that the Dayne's would both know about Lyanna's child and be hiding Aegon. That's two big and potentially conflicting secrets to be keeping. They could exercise a lot of power just be deciding which secret(s) to tell, when to tell them, and to whom.

why conflicting?! 

[Groo]

16 hours ago, EggBlue said:

why conflicting?! 

Two heirs to the throne from two different mothers? How many times has that been a problem in Targaryen history? It isn't automatically a problem which is why I said potentially conflicting.

On a side note, if Ashara Dayne is going to all this trouble to protect Elia Martell's child, then why has she never told the other Martells about it?

I do think your theory is quite plausible about who, in general, was helping Ned. Clearly, Ned and Howland had help and it had to be someone they had a reason to trust.

[EggBlue]

2 hours ago, Groo said:

Two heirs to the throne from two different mothers? How many times has that been a problem in Targaryen history? It isn't automatically a problem which is why I said potentially conflicting.

First of all, what two heirs?! Lyanna did not have the child yet; the consensus is that Rhaegar wanted a daughter.  Whether Lyanna's child was ever going to be in the line of succession or not, we can be sure he would be younger than Aegon. I assume the trouble with Two heirs would only arise if the boys were each being raised as Rhaegar's heir in different households learning to hate each other. Besides, if anyone had thought about the problem of two heirs, they would advise Rhaegar not to sire a child or at least wouldn't help him in his very noble endeavors in the first place! 

2 hours ago, Groo said:

On a side note, if Ashara Dayne is going to all this trouble to protect Elia Martell's child, then why has she never told the other Martells about it?

There are a couple of possibilities:

1. Whatever Elia and/or Rhaegar had planned with Varys had not extended to the Martells.

2. the more plausible one: Ned gave her the option he gave to Cersei

or both of those things.

 

[Loose Bolt]

In my head canon Rhaegar gained ToJ as dowry when he married Elia and major reason why he went there with Lyanna was that he wanted to make both Martells and Starks hate him.

[Mourning Star]

The Tower of Joy likely get's it's name from the Joyous Guard, the castle of Lancelot in Arthurian myth, and where he took Guinevere.

Ned had pulled the tower down afterward, and used its bloody stones to build eight cairns upon the ridge. It was said that Rhaegar had named that place the tower of joy, but for Ned it was a bitter memory.

Both before and after Lancelot's time of happiness there the Joyous Guard was called the Dolorous Guard.

"Would that bones could talk," the Old Bear grumbled. "This fellow could tell us much. How he died. Who burned him, and why. Where the wildlings have gone." He sighed. "The children of the forest could speak to the dead, it's said. But I can't." He tossed the skull back into the mouth of the tree, where it landed with a puff of fine ash. "Go through all these houses. Giant, get to the top of this tree, have a look. I'll have the hounds brought up too. Perchance this time the trail will be fresher." His tone did not suggest that he held out much hope of the last.
Two men went through each house, to make certain nothing was missed. Jon was paired with dour Eddison Tollett, a squire grey of hair and thin as a pike, whom the other brothers called Dolorous Edd. "Bad enough when the dead come walking," he said to Jon as they crossed the village, "now the Old Bear wants them talking as well? No good will come of that, I'll warrant. And who's to say the bones wouldn't lie? Why should death make a man truthful, or even clever? The dead are likely dull fellows, full of tedious complaints—the ground's too cold, my gravestone should be larger, why does he get more worms than I do . . ."

Who did Dolorous Ned, sorry Dolorous Edd, squire for?

The only use of "dolorous" I could find in the series that isn't referring to Squire Tollett:

The first faint hint of dawn was visible in the east, and the Red Keep's own bells were ringing now, joining in the swelling river of sound that flowed from the seven crystal towers of the Great Sept of Baelor. They had rung the bells when King Robert died, she remembered, but this was different, no slow dolorous death knell but a joyful thunder. She could hear men shouting in the streets as well, and something that could only be cheers.

[Curled Finger]

12 hours ago, Loose Bolt said:

In my head canon Rhaegar gained ToJ as dowry when he married Elia and major reason why he went there with Lyanna was that he wanted to make both Martells and Starks hate him.

To what gain though?

[Loose Bolt]

17 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

To what gain though?

Almost whole lifetime of Rhaegar Westeros has been ruled by a man who both looked and behaved like a troll. So R tried to outtroll his father.

[BalerionTheCat]

I don't think the Martels new. I don't think they would have agreed to it.

But I think the Daynes could know. Could even have provided the logistic and some servants. By Arthur or Ashara.