HBO Orders A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms: The Hedge Knight

[Mithras]

This can only work if a full feature movie about the 1st Blackfyre Rebellion is made as a prologue and then the rest of them is absorbed into this D&E series. But still, yet another series about GRRM's unfinished material. With 2 years of wait between seasons, only to see a handful of episodes, I am not looking forward to it. In fact, since these long waits became the norm, I don't start watching any new series.

[The Bard of Banefort]

Surprised this hasn’t been posted yet: https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/

Lots to unpack here:

The first season is only adapting The Hedge Knight. It will probably be six episodes in length. HBO has already greenlit the entire first season.

The pilot was written by Ira Parker, but the rest hasn’t been written yet. George only refers to himself as a producer, not a screenwriter.

All the other spin-offs are still on the table, but are several years off at least.

GRRM says he plans to write more DnE after Winds. This may include a story about Dorne set after THK. He doesn’t want the show to lap the books. (Since no one else will, I’ll say it: focus on DnE instead of Winds, George. It’s already been twelve years).

 

[The hairy bear]

Yeah, very interesting post by George.

Some thoughts:

• Although I'm must confess that I loath having another unfinished saga spoilered by an inferior tv show (I would have hoped that they would have chosen Nymeria or the Sea Snake instead), the fact that they are only adapting one novella per season and that George is entertaining the idea of interweaving the Dornish travel in there sweetens the deal.
• Not a fan that this new show is run by Ryan Condal and other guys from the writing staff of HotD. I feel that they are already have enough pressure to produce one good season of their own show, and it's nice to see some variety too. I hope Condal doesn't become the Dave Filoni of Westeros.
• George makes it clear that he'll be involved, that this material (unlike house of the Dragon) doesn't allow for much room for new inventions, and that they will stay true to the material. All of that seems to indicate that this adaptation will be extremely faithful to the original material.
• I think it's telling that George mentions Avery's and Miller's comic adaptation. That one was also a very faithful adaptation that was presented in six chapters/issues. For reference, the cliffhangers for each of the issues are: (1) Egg joins Dunk, (2) Manfred refuses to vouch for Dunk, (3) Aerion kills Ser Humfrey Hardyng's horse, (4) Baelor suggests to Dunk to demand a trial by battle, and (5) Baelor reveals that he is joining Dunk's team. I suspect that we will have a similar structure, even though the first three episodes will certainly seem a little bit slow.

Edited April 14, 2023 by The hairy bear

[The Dragon Demands]

Ah, new update confirms “Sworn Sword” is season 2.

Six episodes in season one…will it all just be on the tournament? He mentions their Dorne adventure…but for season one or two?

[Ran]

Yeah, Ben Avery did a fine job adapting it.

 

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

I think they’ll try to build out the world a bit more. Maybe add some characterization to characters that don’t have any. Like Daeron the Drunk, Daeron II, Maekar, Matarys, and Valarr.

[The Dragon Demands]

I think a better cliffhanger to end the season on is the outbreak of the Great Spring Sickness…but they could do that in all of five minutes at the end of the last episode.

then season two could back up a bit the first two episodes as basically long flashbacks showing “this is what they were doing in Dorne at the time”

 

[The Dragon Demands]

Just now, King Maegor the Cool said:

 Like Daeron the Drunk, Daeron II, Maekar, Matarys, and Valarr.

Two years from now, we’ll have three live action Daerons. 
 

and 3 to 4 Aegons

[The Bard of Banefort]

Is Daeron older than Valarr? Maybe Jena took a while to conceive, but it’s kind of strange that the youngest son was married and having kids around the same time as oldest son. Clearly Maekar inherited Grandpa Aegon’s virility.

[Padraig]

Huh.  6 episodes revolving around tHK.  With an apparently very faithful episode 1.  They obviously can expand the story a little as the episodes progress but still, fascinating.

[Frey family reunion]

HOTD did a good job fleshing out the F&B storyline.  If they can get writers of similar quality, I’ll be excited to see what they can do for the D&E series past Mystery Knight.  Personally, I doubt GRRM will ever get around to finishing the series himself, and I’m intrigued to see the story progress.

It should also be a much cheaper series to make and shouldn’t have the two year turnarounds that HOTD requires.

Edited April 14, 2023 by Frey family reunion

[The Dragon Demands]

I don't consider it "unfaithful" if in ADDITION to the text, they decide to show on-screen some other events that were happening in this time period. Fleshing it out more.

I mean, after introducing all the Targaryens at the tournament, then actually follow some of them back to King's Landing, to see the outbreak of the Great Spring Sickness through their eyes. 

[Ran]

9 hours ago, The Dragon Demands said:

I don't consider it "unfaithful" if in ADDITION to the text, they decide to show on-screen some other events that were happening in this time period. Fleshing it out more.

I mean, after introducing all the Targaryens at the tournament, then actually follow some of them back to King's Landing, to see the outbreak of the Great Spring Sickness through their eyes. 

The whole narrative force of "The Hedge Knight" lies in its ending, though, so I think you have to think about what's the best way to adapt the story to the screen that maintains the point of the story.

[James Arryn]

I’m hearing there are mixed reactions to this news. Why?
 

This is good news! 
 

Or is it just ‘an announcement that isn’t WoW’? I didn’t see the build up so never got that false hope, but if it’s that it’s understandable. Otherwise, though, yes, Dunk! Just re-read the first two D&E’s the other day and realized that while he is not nearly the character I find most interesting, Dunk is rivalled only by Ned in terms of how close to my heart/affectionate they make me feel. Edit: Alright, I kinda fixed it. 
 

Edit2: I do have to voice a general grumble with the developing pattern of requiring a new subscription with each new show I want to watch. Why is maintaining audiences not a thing anymore?

Edited April 15, 2023 by James Arryn

[The Bard of Banefort]

A while ago, I speculated that rather than follow their entire lives up to Summerhall, a DnE show might only cover the early years of their lives. George’s update makes me think that’s a real possibility. He doesn’t seem certain that this show will run from start to finish.

[The Bard of Banefort]

1 hour ago, James Arryn said:

I’m hearing there are mixed reactions to this news. Why?
 

This is good news! 
 

Or is it just ‘an announcement that isn’t WoW’? I didn’t see the build up so never got that false hope, but if it’s that it’s understandable. Otherwise, though, yes, Dunk! Just re-read the first two D&E’s the other day and realized that while he is not nearly the character I find most interesting, Dunk is rivalled only by Ned in terms of how close to my heart/affectionate they make me feel. Edit: Alright, I kinda fixed it. 
 

Edit2: I do have to voice a general grumble with the developing pattern of requiring a new subscription with each new show I want to watch. Why is maintaining audiences not a thing anymore?

I think for casual fans, it’s more “what’s a Dunk and Egg?” It sounds like a wafflehouse. You can’t even really put it in context beyond “Daenerys’ and Brienne’s great-grandpas.” The most you could probably say to excite people is that it’s like A Knight’s Tale in Westeros.

For book fans, I think we’re mostly just wary of adapting another unfinished book series. And TV shows can’t fill the gap left by half a decade of no new material (FnB came out almost five years ago now).

Edited April 15, 2023 by The Bard of Banefort

[James Arryn]

17 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I think for casual fans, it’s more “what’s a Dunk and Egg?” It sounds like a wafflehouse. You can’t even really put it in context beyond “Daenerys’ and Brienne’s great-grandpas.” The most you could probably say to excite people is that it’s like A Knight’s Tale in Westeros.

For book fans, I think we’re mostly just wary of adapting another unfinished book series. And TV shows can’t fill the gap left by half a decade of now new material (FnB came out almost five years ago now).

As long as I read the book first, no movie or tv show can ever ruin it for me, I don’t think. I get being wary, but the risk is not that we’ll lose anything, it’s just that we might not gain an experience we’re hoping for. At worse we’re where we were before it got made. I think maybe the experience of the first show has people thinking that if it doesn’t help form the current zeitgeist it’s somehow a failure, but that’s more about sharing our experiences rather than having them. 
 

There’s an opp. cost I suppose, but imo everything’s gonna get redone, so even if you don’t like this one, wait 5 years. Dunk is gonna be hard to cast without CGI, though. Most likely they’ll cast someone ~ half a foot shorter. I think we’d better be prepared for that. 

[The Bard of Banefort]

The guy that played Harwin is pretty skinny in real life, but they managed to make him look much bigger. Same with casting normal-sized guys to play dwarves in LOTR. They can make Dunk look taller than he is.

The idea of Jacob Elordi with a Dunk wig was hilarious to me, but I found a picture of him with long-ish hair and it looked pretty good! That said, they’ll probably hire a relative unknown. (He probably has some kind of non-compete clause from Amazon, but I could see the guy who played Sauron on Rings of Power making a pretty good Dunk, as funny as that may sound).

I’ve always been surprised that Alexander Skarsgard hasn’t popped up in one of these shows, since he’s had such a prodigious HBO career. He could probably make a good Maekar, but the problem is he actually is really tall, so Dunk would have to be even bigger than him.

It wouldn’t surprise me if they hired a big name to play Baelor in order to lure in more people, ala Sean Bean in S1.

 

Edited April 15, 2023 by The Bard of Banefort

[Lord Varys]

On 4/14/2023 at 5:21 PM, The Bard of Banefort said:

Surprised this hasn’t been posted yet: https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/

Lots to unpack here:

The first season is only adapting The Hedge Knight. It will probably be six episodes in length. HBO has already greenlit the entire first season.

Six episodes makes it very likely they will add some material. There is not enough dialogue for six one hour episodes in THK.

Although they could do more scenery and stuff ... or make shorter episodes, like some being only about 30 minutes.

On 4/14/2023 at 5:21 PM, The Bard of Banefort said:

GRRM says he plans to write more DnE after Winds. This may include a story about Dorne set after THK. He doesn’t want the show to lap the books. (Since no one else will, I’ll say it: focus on DnE instead of Winds, George. It’s already been twelve years).

Talk about the Dornish story indicates he would like to make the second season about that as to have more time finishing some later stories. Hopefully he gets to writing and publishing that novella before they bring the story on screen.

Such a novella wouldn't just be about the Red Mountains and Lady Vaith but also, one hopes, about a visit to Sunspear and the Planky Town and a meeting between Egg and grand-aunty Daenerys who most likely would still be alive by then (although Prince Maron could already be dead). It would be also very interesting to meet the Water Gardens and the children there. In fact, seeing that and being introduced to the Dorne-Daenerys doctrine of ruling that came from that could also be a crucial lesson for Dunk and, especially, Egg.

Hell, Egg could go missing while visiting the shadow city, being invited to visit the Water Gardens and meeting Daenerys there as 'Egg' first.

On 4/14/2023 at 5:45 PM, The hairy bear said:

I think it's telling that George mentions Avery's and Miller's comic adaptation. That one was also a very faithful adaptation that was presented in six chapters/issues. For reference, the cliffhangers for each of the issues are: (1) Egg joins Dunk, (2) Manfred refuses to vouch for Dunk, (3) Aerion kills Ser Humfrey Hardyng's horse, (4) Baelor suggests to Dunk to demand a trial by battle, and (5) Baelor reveals that he is joining Dunk's team. I suspect that we will have a similar structure, even though the first three episodes will certainly seem a little bit slow.

Going by that structure is likely what they will do. But as I said, not enough dialogue for sticking to novella material. They would have to add something. I've tossed around some more radical ideas above, but there is also a lot of potential to just add material between scenes and flesh out things about Dunk & Egg more.

I'd imagine they also do explore some secondary characters more. Baelor and Maekar should get a scene together, for instance. Ditto Valarr, Daeron and Aerion.

On 4/14/2023 at 6:00 PM, The Dragon Demands said:

Ah, new update confirms “Sworn Sword” is season 2.

Six episodes in season one…will it all just be on the tournament? He mentions their Dorne adventure…but for season one or two?

If Sworn Sword is season 2, then they would have to cram Dorne in at the end of season 1 and/or at the beginning of season 2. Would prefer to have a season for Dorne since there is a lot of potential there, especially if we close out at Oldtown with our first glimpse at young Aemon.

On 4/14/2023 at 6:04 PM, King Maegor the Cool said:

I think they’ll try to build out the world a bit more. Maybe add some characterization to characters that don’t have any. Like Daeron the Drunk, Daeron II, Maekar, Matarys, and Valarr.

Seeing Matarys, too, would be great. They might name-drop him, but that would be a waste since he will die soon. Valarr has a plot purpse, Matarys is literally a dead name.

On 4/14/2023 at 11:29 PM, The Dragon Demands said:

I don't consider it "unfaithful" if in ADDITION to the text, they decide to show on-screen some other events that were happening in this time period. Fleshing it out more.

I mean, after introducing all the Targaryens at the tournament, then actually follow some of them back to King's Landing, to see the outbreak of the Great Spring Sickness through their eyes. 

That could be a great addition as a kind of Epilogue. I have a scene in my head where a stricken Bloodraven tells Daeron and Myriah about Baelor's death. They could turn Ashford into something that heralds a larger catastrophe. Say we have the scene were the king and queen are informed about Baelor's death ... and then somebody starts coughing, and another, another, and then also Daeron II. Bloodraven and Myriah or Aerys exchange a concerned look ... and then we go to the credits.

If the Dornish story is included somehow then they would definitely show how the Great Spring Sickness ravages other places and court.

I'd say that Aerion should be completely gone from things with his exile, but Maekar, Daeron, and Bloodraven could show up in some fashion in season 2.

Also, as I already said, an adaptation of THK has to include Blackfyre Rebellion talk. There must be some former Blackfyre loyalists at Ashford and there has to be some tension beneath the scenes, although not that much while Baelor is still around and expected to succeed his father.

I'd expect that the entire show could profit from including costly and well-made flashback scenes to the Blackfyre Rebellion. We could first see ailing Ser Arlan tell Dunk about the Redgrass Field, we could have a singer at Ashford praising Baelor and Maekar, respectively, at an evening in Ashford (either in the great hall or more informal, on the tourney grounds around a huge camp fire), we could then later have Ser Eustace give his speech, have Gormon Peake and the second Daemon Blackfyre add other pieces so that by the time TMK is over we have a pretty good grip of the backstory and also a much more detailed picture of Bittersteel (from flashbacks) than we got from the books at this point.

If they go to Dorne and give us Daenerys and/or have them visit Aemon in Oldtown the former could talk about her connection to Daemon Blackfyre and the war as she interpreted it as well as the importance of the Dornish union - that could be part of her lesson to Egg, in fact - whilst Aemon might enlighten Dunk about some historical issues.

There is a lot of potential here for very effective additions that stay true to the source material in spirit.

Edited April 15, 2023 by Lord Varys

[The Bard of Banefort]

I suppose they could change it on the show, but if GRRM writes about their adventure in Dorne, I don’t think we’ll be seeing Daenerys or the Martells. Egg mentions in TSS that the only highborn woman they met in Dorne was Lady Vaith.

I think they’ll probably add in a few female characters, since it’s basically just Tanselle (maybe Shiera will show up in TSS). The easiest way to do this would be to have Egg’s sisters tag along to Ashford Meadow. I could see one being a perfect Targaryen princess (since audiences seem to love that) and the other being an Arya/Lyanna-esque tomboy who wants to joust with the boys. 

Realistically, a lot of noblewomen should be jonesing to marry one of the many eligible Targaryen princes. (As far as we know, the only one who’s betrothed to a sister is Egg). That could make for some fun comic relief.