What is Arya Stark's Great Role?

[YeniAy_Ottoman]

Selam, hello,

I want to talk general ideas about Arya's endgame. Of course, I would like to exchange ideas on the effect of the story rather than what will happen to Arya when the story ends (Don't forget to read the links that I will put in the article).

It is clear that Arya, as one of the big fives, had an important and influential role in the upcoming war, as in other big league children. GRRM carefully avoids answering questions about Arya's role.

In general, because Arya's role is unpredictable, something that is not considered much by the readers (except her fans). This inadvertently causes their mind to become a secondary character of Arya because they are just looking at what is currently; A young girl who dreams of revenge and is training become a FM.

Many fans underestimate Arya's story. Such approaches subconsciously reduce the character to the secondary character level. So if someone comes out and declares that Arya is the ice champion, some readers can see this as an "exaggeration". This theory may not be true, but it's not what's important, the thing is; "We do not think Arya will have such an important role." There are people with this psychology. Dany might be AA, Jon is either AA or maybe the Prince Who Promised and Bran is the Last Hero or something. Tyrion is a master mind who is planning everything. But Arya can not have such a role? She cannot be the queen, she cannot be the ruler, she cannot be the champion / hero of something. What could she be? Will Arya be a character that only supports Jon? Is she his protection? Or she is just a character who will kill three or five unnecessary villains?

But the reason for the big fives being the big fives is not the throne games but the upcoming war and the actions that will affect the fate of the realm and change its environment. So we should not to wait for Arya's endgame to kill three or five unnecessary people.

Well, it has been a very long introduction, let's get to the subject.

Nymeria and Foreshadowings

We know that the names given to wolves are a foreshadowing for their owners. Arya's wolf's name is Nymeria.

Nymeria is a Rhoynar warrior witch queen (her official title princess). The Rhoynar people are famous for their water spells and used these spells when fighting dragon lords. Nymeria also fought against the dragon lords of Valyria, her enemy; she brought Dorne to save her people and led her people.

It is famous for GRRM to repeat character parallels and history. Of course, this is not exactly the same, never happens. Otherwise we would have read the same stories and characters and it wouldn't make any sense. The parts we need to focus on here are the "main skeleton" What are those?

"Fighting against dragon lords", "Water magic", "Warrior queen/princess", "protecting her people"
 

• We have a leading female character, the official title of which is a princess, but is known by everybody as a "queen," said to be a witch because of her water magic.

Arya's official title is "princess" and Arya has very strong references to water. It may be possible to say that she's learning magic (FM). And also our she wolf can be called figuratively the Wolf Queen in the future.

 

• Fighting against to dragon lords and protecting people.

Arya also has strong references to dragons. Most Arya fans tend to see these references as a positive effect, but not me, I used to be, but I don't see it anymore. Why?

I have been studying Arya's story like a puzzle for years, when I combined many pieces, I have reached a single point. Of course, there may be a completely wrong way, after all, I am not writing this book. Nymeria's story and her position against dragons are just one of these puzzle pieces.

When I mentioned in the water reference, the Braavos and Water title on the subject in the link I added is another piece.

I do not want to go into detail, if you read it, you will learn more, but if I need to present a general summary, Braavos was also founded as a water city by moon singers. This city and FM are completely anti-Valyria and anti-dragon lords, and Arya is currently (probably) trained by FM(Arya and Valkyrie)... Valyria's greatest enemy. It is an accepted theory among fans that Valyria doom is made by FM.

So we have two references to dragon lords that are against Valyria; Nymeria and Braavos (FM). Arya is a character associated with two anti-dragon sides. So I do not see Arya's dragon references for a completely positive relationship in the future.

I will recommend a few more links for this topic. Battle of Ice and Fire , The Song Ice and Fire "Three Heads", Red Comet and Direwolves, Stark Threat and final... my champion theory. Her skills

As a result, while we have two dragons who claim the throne and want 7 kingdoms, it is obvious that the north will not escape their attention. Waiting for the north to kneel is also a big mistake. The Arya and Stark family may find themselves in battle with dragons. Looking at Arya's references(and my champion theory), it is not impossible.

 

• Water/Magic and Witch

Since Braavos and Water thread will explain the magic and water issue, I will not repeat here. We know that FM use magic and teaching Arya, too ... (Witch queen / princess )
 

• I expect Arya to return to the North in the 6th book. For me, the wall will be the first place to go because Arya can leave without completing her education only after Jon hears her death. An Arya who has not completed her education has no reason to leave Braavos. It takes years to become an FM.

She will probably be with Jon in the winterfell war in the north. There are many references and signs for this; There are NW references since the first book, even in Braavos she met NW members, and she killed one of them and hid his boots (the magic of changing her look?) and more ... With the worst possibility (even if she doesn't go to the wall) she will join this war in the north.

Years ago, GRRM stated that he wanted to use Nymeria(for something) and wanted a fight between direwolves and Ramsay's greyhounds. This suggests that GRRM intends to somehow bring the wolves to the war in the north. Why should Nymeria be there if Arya is not in the north? She wouldn't. So Arya will in any way be one of those who get Winterfell back (with Jon).

When Arya finally meets with Jon and takes back her house, our Targaryens will already appear.

And the last 7th book; Battle of Ice and Fire and Dance 2.

You know my "champion" theory for the Battle of Ice and Fire, I will not repeat. One possibility is that Dance 2 is likely to be intertwined with this war (because there is no time in the last book to process the two separately).

If Arya is going to defend her house against dragons if she is an ice champion or something similar or not a champion of anything ... Then, what will happen? What could be the great move of Arya?

Arya may be the one to kill Dany. Yeah. You have read all the links I have gave and also my champion theory too ... And this is next link. If the conditions were normal, Arya and Dany are in harmony with the character who can be very good friends (Okay, this is the last link, but not all parallel and similar points have been added in this thread, there is more). But when the conditions are abnormal, this harmony tends to turn into a serious conflict ... There are now such conflicting conditions ...
 

• Sweets...

According to the sweet peach theory, it is possible to expect Dany's death from a woman's hand. In addition, according to the sweet theory, the blue flower emitting ice and sweet scent that Dany sees shows that the death will be directly or indirectly due to Jon. While Jon does everything for Arya, Arya does everything for Jon ... it should not be forgotten.
 

• Tad’s MEMORY, SORROW, AND THORN series.

I don't know if anyone did not heard of this series, but GRRM's greatest inspiration for writing books came from them.

Quote

 

Definitely. I was a huge fan of Tad's MEMORY, SORROW, AND THORN -- in fact, I doubt I would ever have written my own series without the inspiration his provided.

There are a number of other "nods" to my favorite fantasy authors buried in the books as well. - GRRM, SSM 1999

 

Our big fives(also some other characters) are inspired by these books. In these books, the characters corresponding to Arya and Jon are also in love (You can see some similarities here).

There is a prophecy like AA in the series, but then it turns out that this person has experienced a corruption of power in time and has turned into a dark path, is a dangerous person, and returns to the body of another (girl's father, i guess) (there is also a bit of Sauron breeze) and this girl, then this character killing with her sword… You can make the connection with ASOIAF.

If GRRM is also inspired by this part, Arya will kill Dany.

GRRM's favorite line in the books is often repeated (denoting its importance later on) a line Jon tells Arya when they last meet, "Stick 'em with the pointy end." << This line comes up several times in both Jon & Arya's POVs.

He must have a reason to love that line, and indeed it must be an important sentence because this kind of recurring line marks the psychology and future of those characters. To whom will Arya stick with the pointy end?

The repetition of this sentence not only in Arya's, but also in Jon's POV is another important detail, paying attention to what I mentioned in the "sweet" passage.

In general, my thoughts are like this ... thank you for reading.

A small request; some people write with the psychology of "you wrote like this because you hate her" just because we assume their character will end badly. This why some writes badly things. If you are going to write it this way, don't write it at all. This is a fictional universe, don't overdo your love for the characters. We are real people with emotions, not them. Be aware of this, please. If you disagree, state this nicely with arguments. Thank you.

BONUS: You may also be interested in reading these other threads about Arya.

An Analysis About A Game Of Thrones “Winterfell Scenes”

Theory: Arya's Return to Westeros... To Where?

Arya Stark's Dreams

Arya Stark's Green Fork scene and Daenerys' Dream

Thank you.
 

 

[chrisdaw]

I agree she has a great role to play in the war for the dawn and the final battle. She is the Last Hero, the dog is Sandor and the sword that will snap Needle, and she is the grey girl of Melisandre's visions fleeing a marriage, they're the same thing. I'm confident she'll be pregnant while on the journey and have some form of greyscale and she'll have escaped Jon's captivity. I assume she will be serving Bran as the Last Hero's journey related to the COFT.

The Narrow Sea will empty and during the TWFTD the people of KL and perhaps more of humanity will flee to the dried seabed and make their last stand there (the gullet), I believe Arya will play a role in or maybe even instigate the migration, Nymeria's story is foreshadowing it and Nymeria exists to parallel Arya. This may be related to the Last Hero's Journey or not, I'm not sure.

The series will finish with Arya as queen of the Seven Kingdoms, but that doesn't necessarily relate to her doings during TWFTD.

[Darth Sidious]

Arya has a clearly defined but very tragic role. We already saw from the five books released so far. She is the revenge mechanism for the Starks. She is consumed and will be consumed by revenge. She will die before the end of A Dream of Spring after killing Ramsay.  Happiness and glory are not in the cards for Arya. She chose death and it will come to embrace and take her. 

[Nevets]

As I've said before, Arya's story is one of the hardest to figure out, especially in the near future.  It can go in many directions.

I think she will leave Braavos fairly soon.  It looks like Martin might be setting the stage in the preview chapter for conflict with the FM and a subsequent departure, or a shift to something else in Braavos (maybe spend time with a courtesan, learn how to wield power as a female, for example).  

If she meets Jeyne Poole and learns how anxious the Northerners are for a Stark, that could inspire her to go to Westeros.  In the main series, Nymeria is presented as a Queen who led her people to a new home.  That suggests a leadership role.  Lady Stark.  Yes, I know she doesn't want to be a lady.  Which, given how Martin treats his characters, makes that all the more likely.

So, I anticipate her possibly ending up as ruler of the North.  Or given her youth and inexperience, co-ruler with her consort, possibly like William and Mary of England.  Though I'm not sure who would play William.  Most of the good candidates are nearly as young and inexperienced as she is.  Another possibility would be leading Northern refugees to a new home.  In any event, I see serious leadership potential in her.

[Sandy Clegg]

Great read, it’s nice to see fresh perspectives and Arya’s story to come is certainly the one I’m looking forward to the most. I like the overall idea of her having an ‘anti-dragon’ arc due to Nymeria too.

[Hippocras]

Arya is the queen of the strays. I did not see that mentioned above. She is both the leader herself of a band of orphans, as well as the leader in wolf form of the hungry wolves of the Riverlands (via Nymeria). Queen Nymeria herself was also a leader of those who lost their home, so the pattern fits historically as well.

I think it is plausible that Arya will kill Dany for Jon's sake, but not because Jon wants her to. I think she will simply be able to see that Dany is dangerous and leading Jon down the wrong path. She will do it for love of Jon but he will not love her back for it. I think she is likely to end the story in exile, perhaps leading a sellsword company or other kind of band of fellow exiles and strays.

[James Arryn]

I suspect Arya’s original role was part of the ~ Columbus narrative, probably being the one to arrive in Ashai from the east, and then ‘leading’ Dany’s army back across the Sunset Sea to the west coast of Westeros. I also think she was the hinge/link between Dany and Jon, and having spent the longest time with Dany (of the Starks, at least) was to be the first to grow apprehensive of her and her dragons. She may even have been responsible for eliminating or at least being part of an attempt to eliminate w/e dragons were left once they had played their role against the Others**. I think becoming part of the FM for much longer (5 year gap) and rising within it was how she/we were supposed to learn about their role in the Doom, which may also have been the foundation for her apprehension about them.

In that scenario she would also be the one to put Jon on the horns of dilemma…she is clearly the character he loves the most, well she and Robb, but Robb is dead…until Dany, and thereby putting his heart in the conflict with itself, either directly if/when she kills a dragon or is caught trying to do so and possibly being killed herself, leading to Jon’s ultimate sacrifice of Dany for the greater good, or indirectly by counselling Jon about the danger Dany/dragons represents to order once Ice has been defeated, or some combination thereof. 

But when George scrapped the Columbus parallel, her role became more ambiguous and probably more tragic. I think George still intends to use her to put Jon’s heart in conflict with itself, but it won’t be as clearly defined and won’t be as a result of her experience with her while leading Dany’s fleet to Westeros. I don’t know if there will be a romantic aspect to this triangle as originally planned…I hope not, but by virtue of their being cousins, not siblings, and by having in many ways the most Ygritte-like personality, it’s still possible*.

So I do think her primary role has been redefined, and I think her role as Agent of Death/Nemesis will be heightened to ~ compensate for having lost her Odyssey around the globe. I am afraid she is destined for death, but the one glimmer of hope is that instead of the Columbus role playing a major role in the main story, she might survive to instead, after all the death dealing/vengeance fuelling the Jon/Dany conflict, fulfill the Columbus role by implication, setting off to see what’s west of west at the end much like in the show. I do however think this is less likely, and the probability is that her council about Fire and subsequent death at the hands of Dany or her dragon(s?) will serve as the catalyst for his killing Dany.

So I think since scrapping the 5 year gap and Columbus angle, George has been struggling to retain aspects of her intended role, and the Nymeria element might be reduced to a combination of leading the Riverlands Wolfpack and possibly the ~ show ending. And arguably replacing one nautical analogy with another, ie the Ferryman. Meantime, though I realize her strongest supporters (coupled with those just generally more comfortable with characters killing people for very dubious reasons/child killers) reject this very strongly, she has been the most heart-breaking character to me. Originally vying for top spot in my favourite character list, she now just saddens me, as do those ‘9 year old casual killers is fine/Daeron deserved it, etc.’ readers. 

** or possibly more, serving to heighten the conflict narrative.

*I think if that ‘sister’ to lover transition happens now it’s more likely with Sansa, especially after deciding to avoid her intended villain/betrayer role, though I think I’d put the odds at either very low. 
 

 

Edited May 23, 2023 by James Arryn

[Angel Eyes]

She will jump out of a tree and kill the Great Other.

[Only 89 selfies today]

Arya was always going to mislead Jon Snow from his tasks at the wall.  She was always the temptation which causes him to break his vows and soil what little honor he has.  Jon is the NK and Arya will be his Ice Queen.  They will rule over ice wights, for thirteen years before finally taken down.  Dragonfire will finally kill them. 

[Lost Melnibonean]

Arya, not Sansa, is the maid that will slay Littlefinger, the savage giant. 

[BlackLightning]

I think Arya is GRRM's version of Eowyn from Lord of the Rings

[The Sleeper]

My best guess is that she is going to get cought up in the conflict between Aegon and Dany. Probably on Dany's side.

Her name and heritage would give her political relevance in that war, which she would also further gain if Stoneheart crown's her with Robb's crown, as she intends.

I also think Braavos itself will have a more central place to the story. It is a port which gets information from everywhere in the world and from there one could likewise go anywhere in the world. Part of the reason there are so many possibilities for Arya is her current location. Furthermore the Iron Bank has involved itself with Stannis and undoubtedly Braavos itself will play a role in Dany's invasion of Westeros, whether facilitating or hindering it. 

I also don't think the House of Black and White is just a pit stop. In the west there are the weirwoods associated with Bran and Jon while in the east we have the trees that produce shade of the evening which are associated with Dany and Euron. Both are connected with visions and extending life after death. Between them, geographically and thematically, is the House of Black and White whose candles have the same effect as weirwood paste and shade of the evening and who consider themselves the arbiters of life and death. Considering Arya's association with death and the mystical aspects of the story, I think she will delve quite a bit more into their mysteries. 

[Angel Eyes]

On 5/24/2023 at 2:30 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

Arya, not Sansa, is the maid that will slay Littlefinger, the savage giant. 

Well who'd have thought this happened in the show.

[Bowen Marsh]

She is the discomfort added to the plot.  Arya is very polarizing.  Most hate or love and little in between when it comes to Arya.  We read about the ugly side of revenge after it has corrupted the heart through Arya. 

[Lost Melnibonean]

17 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

Well who'd have thought this happened in the show.

But for my old theory to work Arya needs to do the deed disguised as Sansa. 

Edited May 26, 2023 by Lost Melnibonean

[Fist of the Dragon]

On 5/25/2023 at 6:43 PM, BlackLightning said:

I think Arya is GRRM's version of Eowyn from Lord of the Rings

They are not similar in terms of personality, but I think you are referring to the role each of them play in their world. For example, Éowyn killed Witch-king of Angmar in Lord of the Rings and played a big role. Is it possible that Arya will also play such a big role in the war with others? For example, killing Great Other' champion (not necessarily Great Other himself).

[BlackLightning]

On 5/26/2023 at 12:57 PM, Fist of the Dragon said:

They are not similar in terms of personality, but I think you are referring to the role each of them play in their world. For example, Éowyn killed Witch-king of Angmar in Lord of the Rings and played a big role. Is it possible that Arya will also play such a big role in the war with others? For example, killing Great Other' champion (not necessarily Great Other himself).

I'm sorry; I should've elaborated

Well, they are a bit similar in terms of personality. The main reason Arya is a tomboy is because she negatively compares herself to Sansa and the other girls (but mainly Sansa); she considers Sansa (and by default, her mother) "good" at "being a lady" and knows that she is bad at the ladylike things that Sansa does. So Arya's insecurity and pride leads her to chase more boyish pursuits. Arya would rather chase the unobtainable (she also views boyish pursuits as easier and more exciting) instead of sitting around and looking stupid.

Much like Éowyn. Both Éowyn and Arya are infamous for their heroically disobedient behavior.

I think Arya will play a big role in both the war with the Others and the Dance of the Dragons. But I think that Arya's experiences in the last book will be both so uniquely traumatic and catharic/transformative/healing that she "retires"from warfare at the end of the tale. A lot like how Éowyn's triumph over the Witch King is a Pyrrhic victory (i.e. she almost dies)

Arya will end up "accidentally" becoming a lady (and probably redefining what it means to be a lady) with a respectably powerful lord husband, a household full of lordling children and her own castle to manage. Just like Éowyn set down the sword and shield, gave up on pursuing Aragorn (Aragorn also doubling as symbol of the life of a warrior-queen) and ended up becoming a dutiful lady wife to Faramir. Plus, it makes more sense for the Faceless Men (and by default, the Iron Bank) to want to establish some sort of offshore headquarters in adult Arya's castle with adult Arya's coin. The main thrust of Arya's training is not to become an assassin but some kind of broker and middlewoman.

Arya has spent the ENTIRE story looking for unconditional acceptance and appreciation in a pack and a den of her own. Why roam the world when the only thing she ever wanted is right there in Westeros...Nymeria, her siblings, etc.

I don't know who the endgame husband for Arya will be but it will certainly not be a Bolton or a Frey. Maybe Ned Dayne or a legitimized Gendry or some other guy.

In my opinion, it is Sansa who probably ends the series as a single, childfree woman. 

 

[Evolett]

On 5/18/2023 at 6:29 PM, YeniAy_Ottoman said:

Many fans underestimate Arya's story. Such approaches subconsciously reduce the character to the secondary character level. So if someone comes out and declares that Arya is the ice champion, some readers can see this as an "exaggeration". This theory may not be true, but it's not what's important, the thing is; "We do not think Arya will have such an important role."

Actually, I do believe Arya will play a significant role in the future. All that training you summarized so well in your previous thread must amount to something, or else what is it good for?  Probably not just to bump off some inconsequential characters and not necessarily just to complete her list. 

 

On 5/18/2023 at 6:29 PM, YeniAy_Ottoman said:

So we have two references to dragon lords that are against Valyria; Nymeria and Braavos (FM). Arya is a character associated with two anti-dragon sides. So I do not see Arya's dragon references for a completely positive relationship in the future.

Nymeria may be a clue to anti-dragon sentiments but I'm not too sure about the FM and Braavos. Dany has just freed thousands of people in Slaver's Bay and may continue on this course in Essos before she reaches Westeros. Slavery has been one of the main concerns of the Braavosi and the FM so why would they want to assassinate her? The question also is, do the FM only act on contract or do they at times pursue their own agenda? 

If Dany should commit a series of atrocities in Westeros after landing, then it's possible some might want to get rid of her, but I do not see this as Arya's role. Arya could play a role in hampering Dany's war effort though. I'm thinking of Nymeria and her pack amid the Dothraki horse lines. That would put the Dothraki calvary in disarray again and again, rendering them ineffective as a fighting unit. Arya need not even be anywhere near the pack. We've seen her run with and guide Nymeria through her wolf dreams from far away Braavos. 

I think GRRM is saving Euron for Arya. Aside from the Others, Euron strikes me as the biggest menace and threat to Westeros and someone will have to do him in. With his VS-Armor and the possible acquisition of a VS-Sword plus all that sorcery in the background, I doubt anyone will be a match for him in a normal combat situation. Arya is a stealth assassin. All elements of her training will become super important and relevant if she's to go against a foe as formidable as Euron. 
ETA: The anti-dragon hints apply to Euron as well. 

 

17 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

But I think that Arya's experiences in the last book will be both so uniquely traumatic and catharic/transformative/healing that she "retires"from warfare at the end of the tale.

I agree with this but not that she will end up a lady of some powerful lord's household. I think Arya will have become too used to her independence to settle down in the traditional fashion. I don't really see her sailing off around the world either but can imagine her for instance championing the rights of women who feel inclined to depart from traditional female roles. How about creating an institution where martially inclined girls and women can  officially learn the skills of warfare, or even to defend themselves? Or founding an institution of learning for women? Though that may be something Tyrion might consider. 

 

Edited May 30, 2023 by Evolett

[the trees have eyes]

On 5/23/2023 at 7:45 AM, James Arryn said:

I think George still intends to use her to put Jon’s heart in conflict with itself, but it won’t be as clearly defined

I would say he has already done this by working in (F)Arya's marriage to Ramsay and the grey girl on a dying horse.  It's possible he could return to the theme but I think his initial romantic angle morphed into a close sibling bond and Jon's heart has already been in conflict (as it was when he learned of Ned and Robb's fates).

Arya is more of a wildcard now, totally unscripted in her arc and potential course of action.  She's well positioned to learn of Jon's promotion to LC and to travel back across the Narrow Sea to The Wall but I think that ship sailed with Sam and Aemon. 

The more interesting but more distant (for now) interaction is with Dany as Arya has her heart set on justice for the murdered smallfolk - The Mountain's Men, Lorch, Weese all make it on to her list because of the brutality they inflict on the people of the Riverlands - and this has a parallel with Dany's "Mysha" persona.  As with Dany's crucified slave masters it can lead to brutal consequences but it comes from the same place - fury at their behaviour and a determination to see them punished for it.  Whether Arya sees in Dany a benevolent protector of the smallfolk and righteous punisher of the wicked or another player in The Game of Thrones, more interested in her claim on the IT and vengeance than in the smallfolk depends both on how Dany's arc progresses and how Arya's sojourn with the FM develops. 

Then again with the arrival of any refugees from Hardhome she could be drawn into a more "Northern" plot line.

GRRM being a gardener at heart, this is wide open.

[BlackLightning]

50 minutes ago, Evolett said:

I agree with this but not that she will end up a lady of some powerful lord's household. I think Arya will have become too used to her independence to settle down in the traditional fashion. I don't really see her sailing off around the world either but can imagine her for instance championing the rights of women who feel inclined to depart from traditional female roles. How about creating an institution where martially inclined girls and women can  officially learn the skills of warfare, or even to defend themselves? Or founding an institution of learning for women? Though that may be something Tyrion might consider. 

First of all, Tyrion is not altruistic. With him, strings are always attached.

But back to Arya...yes, I can see Arya creating an institution or order for women and girls. Like a BwB type of police force. Her Braavosi connects will likely support such an arrangement. But I think that Arya can do that out of her own castle. Kinda like Lady Smallwood was an ally and sponsor of the BwB. Her lady wife status can be a cover...

I feel like Sansa will end up being the single, childfree one...the one more focused on politics.