The Silver Queen and the Weirwolves

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

The Silver Queen versus the weirwolves is one of A Song of Ice and Fire's motifs.  Silver is the one element which reliably kills werewolves.  It follows and reinforces the more obvious theme of Fire and Ice battling each other.  Opposing elements, opposing families, fighting each other. 

Daenerys Targaryen rides the Silver horse, has silver-blonde hair.  She is the Silver Lady in the early pages of A Game of Thrones.  Roose Bolton betrayed Robb Stark for silver.  Silver will be the downfall of the Starks.  Weirwood is the antagonistic elemental to the dragons.  Since the Valyrians ruled the western end of Essos it is understandable why they would cut down all of those weirwoods.  Humans relocated to Westeros and felled the weirwoods. 

The Starks are slowly accepting their primitive, brutal history.  In my opinion, the Starks will be Direwolves in the end.  DW are the more primitive of the wolves. 

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

So full of assumptions today aren’t we? 

[Craving Peaches]

4 hours ago, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

The Silver Queen versus the weirwolves is one of A Song of Ice and Fire's motifs.

Where is this coming from?

Also direwolves are not werewolves, and there is no indication they are especially vulnerable to silver.

4 hours ago, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

The Starks are slowly accepting their primitive, brutal history.

Bit like Daenerys accepting her primitive, brutal history of burning people to death with dragons then?

4 hours ago, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

Since the Valyrians ruled the western end of Essos it is understandable why they would cut down all of those weirwoods. 

Did weirwoods even grow in Essos?

Honestly I don't really get what the post is trying to say... Daenerys is associated with the colour silver so will kill the Starks? There is nothing to say the Starks are vulnerable to silver. Roose didn't betray Robb for silver (money), he betrayed him for power. Silver might have been a part of the deal but the main motivation was clearly the elevation in status. If silver was all it took Tywin could have bought him out before. Overall I don't think this premise makes much sense. And there are no quotations or anything to back it up...

[Springwatch]

8 hours ago, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

Silver will be the downfall of the Starks.

This is the only bit with a basis to it, and it's the weakest possible, one of the rumours Arya heard about Tywin: He'd bought a ton of silver to forge magic swords that would slay the Stark wargs.

I like to think everything has a bit of truth in it, but it's hard here because other rumours include destroying Roose and making a peace with Lady Stark. 

ETA

The Starks themselves don't feel any problem with silver. irrc, Bran has a silver clasp to his cloak, and Arya loves her silver fork. The direwolves sing to the moon, and Dany is likened to the moon. So that's all fine. I still expect a hostile/suspicious first encounter though.

Edited May 31, 2023 by Springwatch

[Frey family reunion]

I dunno, I think that there is something to this.

The catspaw assassin was paid with a bag of silver.

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“He had ninety silver stags in a leather bag buried beneath the straw.”

Sansa wore a silver necklace when she lied about what happened when Joffrey was bitten by Nymeria.  Later this leads to Lady’s death.

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His eldest daughter stepped forward hesitantly.  She was dressed in blue velvets trimmed with white, a silver chain around her neck.

The silver pin that Bran wore, was what the wildlings keyed in on when they attempted to rob and kidnap him.

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“Good day to you,” he said nervously. One look, and Bran knew they were neither foresters nor farmers. He was suddenly conscious of how richly he was dressed. His surcoat was new, dark grey wool with silver buttons, and a heavy silver pin fastened his fur-trimmed cloak at the shoulders. His boots and gloves were lined with fur as well.

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“Your guard, is it?” a second man said. Grey stubble covered his gaunt face. “And what would they be guarding, my little lord? Is that a silver pin I see there on your cloak?”

Ned’s service as the King’s Hand was what got him killed, and it was symbolized with his silver badge:

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Ned unfastened the heavy clasp that clutched at the folds of his cloak, the ornate silver hand that was his badge of office. He laid it on the table in front of the king, saddened by the memory of the man who had pinned it on him, the friend he had loved.

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    Robert stood up, grasping one of the bedposts to steady himself. “The gods are seldom good, Ned. Here, this is yours.” He pulled the heavy silver hand clasp from a pocket in the lining of his cloak and tossed it on the bed. “Like it or not, you are my Hand, damn you. I forbid you to leave.”
        Ned picked up the silver clasp. He was being given no choice, it seemed. His leg throbbed, and he felt as helpless as a child.

Ned’s guards all wore a silver hand brooch, and later they were all killed by the Lannisters, perhaps the silver hand brooch was what identified them to be killed.

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A hand of beaten silver clutched the woolen folds of each cloak and marked their wearers as men of the Hand’s household guard.

The blacksmith that broke Ice in two wore a silver necklace.

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He wore a black velvet coat with hammers embroidered on the sleeves in silver thread. Around his neck was a heavy silver chain and a sapphire as large as a pigeon’s egg.

Petyr Baelish loved his silver:

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He had a little pointed chin beard now, and threads of silver in his dark hair, though he was still shy of thirty. They went well with the silver mockingbird that fastened his cloak. Even as a child, he had always loved his silver.”

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by Frey family reunion

[Aerodimas]

The last book was going to be named a time for wolves, i doubt that all the starks will die.

 

[Aerodimas]

BTW Sansa no longer has a direwolf.

[LongRider]

22 minutes ago, Aerodimas said:

BTW Sansa no longer has a direwolf.

She is still a warg, as GRRM has noted.

[Aerodimas]

Yes but se hasn't formed a new bond. Maybe she will with a dog (or even wolf), but not a direwolf.

[Springwatch]

Sansa's got a ghost wolf big as mountains. When the time for wolves comes, she'll be there.

[Springwatch]

6 hours ago, Frey family reunion said:

Sansa wore a silver necklace when she lied about what happened when Joffrey was bitten by Nymeria.  Later this leads to Lady’s death.

Lady died because Cersei was freaked out by the direwolves ("They are dangerous. I will not have any of them coming south with us."). And because Joffrey was bitten by a direwolf. And because Robert thought Lady was a 'savage beast ' who would attack Sansa eventually. And because Ned let it happen.

The lie was nothing either. It did happen fast. She wouldn't remember completely.

Apart from all that, maybe there is something dangerous about silver. Hard to pin down though. Starks don't seem to like gold very much; I can't remember any.

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

19 hours ago, Frey family reunion said:

I dunno, I think that there is something to this.

The catspaw assassin was paid with a bag of silver.

Sansa wore a silver necklace when she lied about what happened when Joffrey was bitten by Nymeria.  Later this leads to Lady’s death.

The silver pin that Bran wore, was what the wildlings keyed in on when they attempted to rob and kidnap him.

Ned’s service as the King’s Hand was what got him killed, and it was symbolized with his silver badge:

Ned’s guards all wore a silver hand brooch, and later they were all killed by the Lannisters, perhaps the silver hand brooch was what identified them to be killed.

The blacksmith that broke Ice in two wore a silver necklace.

Petyr Baelish loved his silver:

 

Very good.  Yes silver is harmful to the weirwolves-weirstarks. 

[Evolett]

Judging by these quotes and the magical properties attritubted to silver and its power to overcome werewolves, it appears silver is a bad omen for Starks.

I however propose a different line of logic. It is not what it seems to be.

If you take a close look at the North, you will find its prominent symbols closely associated with silver. This includes the Wall and the weirwoods as well as less obvious symbols such as silver clasps etc. particular to the Starks. Somewhere in the text, it is mentioned that the predominant currency in the North is silver as opposed to gold. This is probably because the Lannisters are the main generators of gold in the south, through the mines at Casterly Rock, while such a source appears to be missing in the North. In Westeros, silversmiths are only mentioned at White Harbour. When Lord Manderly talks of minting new coin, he mentions silver being held back by the customs officers, silver that should have been paid to the King in the North:

 

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As windy as he was vast, he began by asking Winterfell to confirm the new customs officers he had appointed for White Harbor. The old ones had been holding back silver for King’s Landing rather than paying it over to the new King in the North. King Robb needs his own coinage as well,” he declared, “and White Harbor is the very place to mint it.”

 

I would argue that rather than silver symbolizing a means to eliminate Starks (or werewolves as the OP portrays it), the silver metal stands in opposition to gold and is a representation of the Stark/Lannister feud. This becomes evident when you consider that much of the misfortune to befall our silver-associated Starks and Tullys (silver trout) has come about on account of Lannister aggression and greed. Golden Lions were behind Bran’s fall from the tower, the attack on Bran’s life thereafter, the attack on Ned and his subsequent execution, the marriage of Sansa to Tyrion, the ravaging of the Riverlands ruled by Tullys of the silver trout, Robb Stark’s assassination, together with his mother and thousands of his Northmen.

Ned who wore the silver Hand’s clasp was eventually replaced by Tywin who wore a chain of gold hands and whose golden grandson was responsible for Ned’s death. To me, all this is an indication of clear symbolism pointing to silver versus gold.

When Sansa is married to Tyrion, this is what her attire looks like:

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The dress: The smallclothes were all silk, but the gown itself was ivory samite and cloth-of-silver, and lined with silvery satin.

The cloak: Cersei Lannister ignored the question. “The cloak,” she commanded, and the women brought it out: a long cloak of white velvet heavy with pearls. A fierce direwolf was embroidered upon it in silver thread. Sansa looked at it with sudden “Your father’s colors,” said Cersei, as they fastened it about her neck with a slender silver chain. A maiden’s cloak. Sansa’s hand went to her throat. She would have torn the thing away if she had dared.

 

Sansa is very much the Silver Princess here. Even the direwolf is embroidered in silver. And she is just being married off so that the golden Lannisters can lay claim to Winterfell in the future.

Sansa very much highlights the contrast and antagonism between the silver (Starks) and gold (Lannisters). Riverrun of  the Silver Trout has been lost to Lannisters as well.

As the Silver Queen, Dany falls into the silver-category herself. Her father is killed by a golden lion. Like Sansa, she is married off against her will to a man thought of as barbarous or monstrous. That Silver Dany stands in opposition to gold is also evidenced by the golden Lannister occupation of the Iron Throne. She will also be up against fAegon and the Golden Company. An argument can be made for Robert Baratheon’s association with the gold faction through his banner and marriage to Cersei. Robert swept the Targaryens away and wanted Dany dead. There is also the prophecy about the Gold of Casterly Rock bringing down the Valyrians and silver Dany is the last official true born ancestor of that empire.

We are not looking at a case of silver in terms of silver bringing down wargs or the silver-associated. On the contrary, the essence here is a Gold vrs. Silver motif and like the Starks, Dany belongs in the silver faction.

Edited June 1, 2023 by Evolett

[Craving Peaches]

Also, from a heraldic perspective, the Starks are 'allied' with silver. Their sigil is argent, a direwolf cendrée. The tincture Argent represents silver and white, there was not a seperate tincture for each. So given the Stark direwolf is running on a silver field, why would the Starks be vulnerable to silver? It is one of their House colours...

[Lady Stonehearts Simp]

21 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said:

Also, from a heraldic perspective, the Starks are 'allied' with silver. Their sigil is argent, a direwolf cendrée. The tincture Argent represents silver and white, there was not a seperate tincture for each. So given the Stark direwolf is running on a silver field, why would the Starks be vulnerable to silver? It is one of their House colours...

[kissdbyfire]

21 hours ago, Aerodimas said:

Yes but se hasn't formed a new bond. Maybe she will with a dog (or even wolf), but not a direwolf.

Says who? 
Anyhoo… OP, I wish I could at least say “nice try”. Sadly, I can’t since your “theory” is just another laughable attempt at twisting stuff that’s not even in the text in order to push your silly and infantile anti-Stark agenda. 
 

[LongRider]

4 hours ago, Evolett said:

We are not looking at a case of silver in terms of silver bringing down wargs or the silver-associated. On the contrary, the essence here is a Gold vrs. Silver motif and like the Starks, Dany belongs in the silver faction.

Well said!  Enjoyed the post, nice to read you again.   

[Aerodimas]

4 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

Says who? 
 

We are in her head. If she had a warg bond we would know it.

And there are not direwolves south of the wall.

Edited June 1, 2023 by Aerodimas

[LongRider]

18 minutes ago, Aerodimas said:

And there are not direwolves south of the wall.

Nymeria would like a word. 

Wargs can also skin change other animals, and there has long been speculation that Sansa may skin change a bird.  Who can say, but don't count her out.  

[Lilac & Gooseberries]

It's astonishing how nothing about your theory is supported by text. 

On 6/1/2023 at 6:23 PM, LongRider said:

Nymeria would like a word. 

Wargs can also skin change other animals, and there has long been speculation that Sansa may skin change a bird.  Who can say, but don't count her out.  

Also Skagos is a part of the Seven Kingdoms.