The ASOIAF wiki thread

[Vaith]

14 hours ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

Hi, I started to edit some page on the Wiki for the first time today and I saw afterward that people changed it back to what it was before my edit. I'm wondering why ?

For Example, @Vaith you deleted the family tree I added to Medrick Manderly. Can I know why ? Was my edit unnecessary ?
Thanks for the clarification. Good day to all.

I do not remember deleting this family tree, Thomaerys. Looking at the history, I made an edit a few weeks ago (Jan 8) to probably change the death date or location or something like that, and the most recent edits have been yours.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

With so many new users on the wiki lately, I figured it would be a good idea to update our Manual of Style. I've reshuffeled the information that was present and added some items by describing the way such things have been done and agreed upon over the past few years.

What other items should still be added? Do you feel some items could benefit from some expansion? Please share your thoughts

[Thomaerys Velaryon]

@Rhaenys_Targaryen

For the Karstark family tree, I added "daughters" to Arnolf Karstark and changed from 3 to 6 grandsons because of this quote from ADWD:

Quote

"Arnolf Karstark is an old man with a crooked back, and even in his youth he was never the fighter Lord Rickard was. The rigors of the campaign may well kill him."

"He has heirs," Stannis snapped. "Two sons, six grandsons, some daughters. If Robert had fathered trueborn sons, many who are dead might still be living."
ADWD, Jon IV

I'm new to the wiki editing and I don't know how to respond directly via the wiki yet, so Rhaenys I answer you here. (I hope this is ok)

Edited January 27 by Thomaerys Velaryon

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

4 minutes ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

@Rhaenys_Targaryen

For the Karstark family tree, I added "daughters" to Arnolf Karstark and changed from 3 to 6 grandsons because of this quote from ADWD:

I'm new to the wiki editing and I don't know how to respond directly via the wiki yet, so Rhaenys I answer you here. (I hope this is ok)

Thanks! I'll add the reference to the House Karstark page!

And no worries, replying here is fine

 

Btw, replying to talk pages can be done the same way as editing a page, simply by hitting the "edit" button. When you do add something to a talk page, don't forget to add your signature (by typing --~~~~)!

[The Grey Wolf]

Lord Butterwell needs to be added to the "defected to the Greens" section and Ser Roger Corne removed from the "Men of the Reach" section since he's actually a Crownlander.

Also, a page should be made (and included in the Wars of Conquest section) on the Ironborn civil war/Targaryen invasion of the Iron Isles.

[Thomaerys Velaryon]

Hey guys, I was wondering how to best present the conflicts during Aegon III's regency. Should we create a template with all them like for the Dance ? Or shoud we simply add them on the page about the regency ?

 

Off the top of my head, these conflicts are:

* The failed attack on Harrenhal by Ser Regis Groves and Ser Damon Darry (132 AC)

* Cregan Stark vs Sylas the Grim (133 AC)

* Alyn Velaryon and the Velaryon fleet against the fleet of the Sealord of Braavos (133 AC)

* Westerlands/Ironborn conflict (130-134 AC)

* War of succession after the death of Lord Dalton Greyjoy (133-134 AC)

* War of succession after the death of Lady Jeyne Arryn (134-135 AC)

* The "Secret Siege" (135 AC)

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

14 hours ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

Hey guys, I was wondering how to best present the conflicts during Aegon III's regency. Should we create a template with all them like for the Dance ? Or shoud we simply add them on the page about the regency ?

 

Off the top of my head, these conflicts are:

* The failed attack on Harrenhal by Ser Regis Groves and Ser Damon Darry (132 AC)

* Cregan Stark vs Sylas the Grim (133 AC)

* Alyn Velaryon and the Velaryon fleet against the fleet of the Sealord of Braavos (133 AC)

* Westerlands/Ironborn conflict (130-134 AC)

* War of succession after the death of Lord Dalton Greyjoy (133-134 AC)

* War of succession after the death of Lady Jeyne Arryn (134-135 AC)

* The "Secret Siege" (135 AC)

Hmm.. the page currently deals with issues directly related to the king and his regents, and that is not something that applies to each of these events described here, I think (but I am not sure, as I cannot check the text at the moment). Nor are all conflicts related to the same main conflict (as is the case for all the struggles during the Dance), so at the moment I would be inclined to say that a template is not the best option.

Of course, the information for these struggles should be mentioned on the text the  pages where they are relevant. (The struggles surrounding Dalton's succession on the pages of House Greyjoy and all those involved, for exampl). If the relevance allows for it, separate pages can be created.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

In some Family sections, where the family trees are displayed, we now have in text an explanation of the family tree.

Is this something we want to do? Or is that more or less repeating what is said elsewhere on the page, as history sections state who a character was married to and how many children they had?

[Thomaerys Velaryon]

On 1/31/2019 at 8:06 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

In some Family sections, where the family trees are displayed, we now have in text an explanation of the family tree.

Is this something we want to do? Or is that more or less repeating what is said elsewhere on the page, as history sections state who a character was married to and how many children they had?

Personally I prefer family tree rather than text because I'm more a visual type of person.

 

 

I had the idea of creating a wiki page about all the namesakes in ASOIAF but I'm not sure if I grasp this concept correctly (English is not my first language). From what I understand, George used it for two different meaning:

* Meaning 1: Someone or something (generally ships) who is specifically named after someone else.

* Meaning 2: Two characters who share the same first name.

Exemples

1) In ASOS, Catelyn III: We learn that Lord Rickard Karstark was named after Lord Rickard Stark. -> Meaning 1

2) In ADWD The Turncloak: When Theon is in the crypt in Winterfell and sees the statue of King Theon "The Hungry Wolf" Stark, Theon thinks of him as his namesake. -> Meaning 2, I don't think Balon Greyjoy named his son specifically after a Stark King, they just happen to have the same first name.

So my question is this: Are "named after" and "namesake" interchangeable ?

Thank you.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

9 hours ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

Personally I prefer family tree rather than text because I'm more a visual type of person.

 

 

I had the idea of creating a wiki page about all the namesakes in ASOIAF but I'm not sure if I grasp this concept correctly (English is not my first language). From what I understand, George used it for two different meaning:

* Meaning 1: Someone or something (generally ships) who is specifically named after someone else.

* Meaning 2: Two characters who share the same first name.

Exemples

1) In ASOS, Catelyn III: We learn that Lord Rickard Karstark was named after Lord Rickard Stark. -> Meaning 1

2) In ADWD The Turncloak: When Theon is in the crypt in Winterfell and sees the statue of King Theon "The Hungry Wolf" Stark, Theon thinks of him as his namesake. -> Meaning 2, I don't think Balon Greyjoy named his son specifically after a Stark King, they just happen to have the same first name.

So my question is this: Are "named after" and "namesake" interchangeable ?

Thank you.

The definition of "namesake" is "a person or thing that has the same name as another." English is not my first language either, but from that definition I take it that everyone who is named after someone is that person's namesake. However, the other way around it is not interchangeable (like in your Theon example, Theon Greyjoy is Theon Stark's namesake, but he was not named after Stark).

 

I'm curious, what kind of information would go on such a page? Do you already have something in mind?

[Thomaerys Velaryon]

On 2/7/2019 at 8:39 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

I'm curious, what kind of information would go on such a page? Do you already have something in mind? 

No really. It's just an idea I had while editing some pages and seeing several examples of characters and ships named after other people. I guess it would be a compilation.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

13 hours ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

No really. It's just an idea I had while editing some pages and seeing several examples of characters and ships named after other people. I guess it would be a compilation.

So multiple lists of characters with the same or a similar name?  We already have that in the sense of disambiguation pages, which can all be found under Category:Disambiguation pages

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

@Ran,

There seems to be a problem with the wiki: edits can no longer be saved (it states there has been a loss of session data), and pages have great trouble loading.

Edited Sunday at 03:37 PM by Rhaenys_Targaryen

[Ran]

16 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

@Ran,

There seems to be a problem with the wiki: edits can no longer be saved (it states there has been a loss of session data), and pages have great trouble loading.

Try now. Restarted some things that may have helped. 

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

4 minutes ago, Ran said:

Try now. Restarted some things that may have helped. 

Seems to work! Thanks!

[Gonzalo]

On 1/27/2019 at 9:24 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

With so many new users on the wiki lately, I figured it would be a good idea to update our Manual of Style. I've reshuffeled the information that was present and added some items by describing the way such things have been done and agreed upon over the past few years.

What other items should still be added? Do you feel some items could benefit from some expansion? Please share your thoughts

I think the "Members of the small council" infobox has become too cumbersome - and will invariably become even more when F&B II comes out - so maybe the spot for each king should also become collapsible.

As we have created infoboxes for monarchs, consorts, hands of the king, we should also created templates for each position in the small council

On another subject, in "Under the Regents - The Hooded Hand" it is mentioned that Elenda Naratheon sent hjer daughters to the coronation of Aegon  III, but it is later mentioned that all Three Widows departed King's Landing shortly after the coronation.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

@Gonzalo

No comments on the current contents of the manual of style itself?

 

17 hours ago, Gonzalo said:

I think the "Members of the small council" infobox has become too cumbersome - and will invariably become even more when F&B II comes out - so maybe the spot for each king should also become collapsible.

I can take a look at making it collapsible per king this weekend.

 

17 hours ago, Gonzalo said:

As we have created infoboxes for monarchs, consorts, hands of the king, we should also created templates for each position in the small council

We have no intoboxes for Hands of the King, if I'm not mistaken? Or do you mean template boxes used at the bottom of the pages?

 

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

On 1/31/2019 at 8:06 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

In some Family sections, where the family trees are displayed, we now have in text an explanation of the family tree.

Is this something we want to do? Or is that more or less repeating what is said elsewhere on the page, as history sections state who a character was married to and how many children they had?

 

On 2/6/2019 at 10:59 PM, Thomaerys Velaryon said:

Personally I prefer family tree rather than text because I'm more a visual type of person.

Any other opinions on this?

[Nittanian]

On 2/14/2019 at 10:22 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

No comments on the current contents of the manual of style itself?

Looks great, excellent job!

Regarding articles which have been moved, it's more important to fix "double redirects" than it is to update links within other articles. That can be done, of course, but it shouldn't necessarily be a priority.  Also, articles should be moved using the "Move" option which preserves edit history, rather than copy-and-pasting into a new article.

On 1/31/2019 at 2:06 AM, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

In some Family sections, where the family trees are displayed, we now have in text an explanation of the family tree.

Is this something we want to do? Or is that more or less repeating what is said elsewhere on the page, as history sections state who a character was married to and how many children they had?

Do you have an example handy for comparison?

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

42 minutes ago, Nittanian said:

Do you have an example handy for comparison?

For example Maegor I Targaryen, Rogar Baratheon, Qoren Martell