Jump to content

Guy Gavriel Kay


Werthead
 Share

Recommended Posts

21 hours ago, 3CityApache said:

Funny, I always assumed both Song for Arbonne and Tigana take place in the same world as most of the others, apart from Fionavar and Ysabel of course. The world with two moons, you know.

I believe that maybe Kay once said that Tigana and A Song for Arbonne do take place on the same planet, but Tigana is in the southern hemisphere, as evident by the fact that north of the Palm is a desert-like environment and to the south is a colder one. But for narrative purposes these two novels have nothing to do with each other.

 

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

All of the books take place in the same universe, but not the same world/timeline. Fionavar is set in the First of All Worlds, and there are some hints that both Tigana and A Song for Arbonne take place in remote regions of the same planet. However, they could also take place on a different planet, or each in their own individual worlds.

The Sarantine Mosaic, Under Heaven, River of Stars, The Lions of Al-Rassan, The Last Light of the Sun and Children of Earth and Sky all "appear" to take place on the same alternate Earth. I'm pretty certain this world is 100% an alternate version of our world, and the maps appear slightly different because Kay is going for the same simplified style of the particular periods.

One issue with this is that the planet is noted as having only one moon in Under Heaven (I can't remember if this is still the case in River of Stars), compared to the two of all the other books. This is anomalous as the setting for UH and RoS, Khitai, is mentioned in many of the other books in this world and some of the western nations are mentioned in UH and RoS, so they seem to be the same planet. The one moon may either be a mistake or confirming that UH and RoS take place in a parallel universe version of the same planet.

The mention of the one moon in Under Heaven I took as a direct sign that it's not the same planet as the other novels, and it's referenced again in River of Stars that there's one moon. I also don't remember there being references to Kitai in the other novels, or references to stuff like Karch or Esperana or Sarantium in the Kitai novels. One anomaly I do remember is that in Lord of Emperors there is a mention of "arimondan leather", but Arimonda is the spain-like country from A Song for Arbonne, so I assume that was just a mistake on Kay's part.

 

 

45 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

I am liking this one more than the previous one with the Asian setting, River of Stars, which ranks as the worst Kay novel for me.

Really? What didn't you like about it? I thought the ending wasn't really as strong as his tend to be, but the overall writing was among his best and the characters are quite great too.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Found it very hard to get into to start with, and just didn't connect with the characters in it the way I usually can with Kay's excellent novels. River of Stars seemed quite dull in comparison.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have to agree about River of Stars. The characters were flat and fairly one dimensional, the writing was overly purple and Kay completely indulged in some of his worst tendencies by constantly interrupting the narrative to tell the reader what he wants your takeaway to be. Sometimes his editor really needs to rein him in and tell him to focus on telling a story, not telling us why storytelling is important or how legends arise out of events. It's not my least favourite Kay book (I'm really not a fan of the Fionavar trilogy) but it was a big disappointment for me. I'm excited to hear that the new one is supposed to be much stronger.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just finished Lord of Emperors, and really enjoyed it.  It's unusual for an author to portray Justinian and Theodora as sympathetic, rather than very sinister, figures (probably thanks to Procopius).

The highlights for me were the chariot race, the assassination of the Emperor (the Emperor very nearly succeeds in playing off his assassins against each other) and the final conversation between Crispin and Styliane (her fate was truly appalling, but she did bring it on herself).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/16/2016 at 8:05 AM, Chaircat Meow said:

I'm reading my first Kay book, A Song for Arbonne, now. It is ok, but I haven't got very far, so we'll see how it goes.

I'm interested in Children of Earth and Sky for the historical backdrop (I'm crazy about all things Byzantine).

It's probably not much Byzantine as the backdrop is the 16th century and the Ottomans have long renamed Constantinople Istanbul.  The standins for the Ottomans are making their first try at Vienna.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/14/2016 at 7:16 PM, felice said:

As far as we can remember, anyway.

In actual political history the Prussian, Austrian and Russian alliance that disappeared Poland from the map, also did their best to eradicate Polish as a language and all the culture.  it was even illegal for woman to sing cradle songs in Polish and use their special Polish grain grinding boards.  This situation lasted until the re-establishment of Poland as a nation.

The rest of Tigana employs a great deal of Italian history and folklore.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

In actual political history the Prussian, Austrian and Russian alliance that disappeared Poland from the map, also did their best to eradicate Polish as a language and all the culture.  it was even illegal for woman to sing cradle songs in Polish and use their special Polish grain grinding boards.  This situation lasted until the re-establishment of Poland as a nation.

The rest of Tigana employs a great deal of Italian history and folklore.

 

Don't forget Carthage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a standalone. They all are, pretty much, excepting the duology and trilogy. So giver. And, unlike many, I personally wouldn't rank Last Light amongst the lower tiered of his forays. I quite liked it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Darth Richard II said:

OK, so, I haven't tried to read any Kay since the 90s, but I have Last LIght of the Sun sitting here, because, VIKINGS. Is that book ok to read by itself first, kinda like Banks Culture, or do I need to read them in publication order?

Last Light is certainly not a bad book at all, but it's not amongst his best (which would probably be The Lions of Al-Rassan).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, anyone else finished with Children of Earth and Sky? What did you think about it?


I loved it, as I expected to. His books have yet to disappoint me. Still not sure where I'd put it in regards to his other novels, because it's still so fresh, but I'm thinking somewhere among the better works like Lions and Sarantine.

Spoilers for Children below.
 

Spoiler

Was anyone else really surprised by how happy the ending was, compared to his other works? The Osmanlis invasion doesn't succeed, Cemal is exposed, Orso Faleri becomes the Duke, Leonora and Pero fall in love and live long, fulfilled, loving lives, him becoming a renowned painter and her an accomplished Eldest Daughter of Jad, same thing with Marin and Danica, and they have children too, he becomes a successful banker and she reunites with Neven, her brother.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Lautrec said:

So, anyone else finished with Children of Earth and Sky? What did you think about it?


I loved it, as I expected to. His books have yet to disappoint me. Still not sure where I'd put it in regards to his other novels, because it's still so fresh, but I'm thinking somewhere among the better works like Lions and Sarantine.

Spoilers for Children below.
 

  Hide contents

Was anyone else really surprised by how happy the ending was, compared to his other works? The Osmanlis invasion doesn't succeed, Cemal is exposed, Orso Faleri becomes the Duke, Leonora and Pero fall in love and live long, fulfilled, loving lives, him becoming a renowned painter and her an accomplished Eldest Daughter of Jad, same thing with Marin and Danica, and they have children too, he becomes a successful banker and she reunites with Neven, her brother.

 

I've only read The Sarantine Mosaic so far, (I plan to read others of his) but that had a broadly happy ending as well. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, SeanF said:

I've only read The Sarantine Mosaic so far, (I plan to read others of his) but that had a broadly happy ending as well. 

Does it really?

 

Spoiler

I'd say it's bittersweet, with maybe leaning on sweet a bit more, but the moment when Crispin finds out that his mosaic will be torn down is heartbreaking, not to mention the death of Valerius II, and what happens to Styliane, while she is no heroine, is also very brutal. Then there are all of the goodbyes Crispin makes as he leaves Sarantium. I guess the very ending is sweet because he makes a great mosaic and reunites with Alixana, but, there is an element of tragedy there as well.

Spoiler below for Children
 

Spoiler

We find out in Children that no one remembers who the artist who made the Varena mosaic is. So while Crispin's mosaic stands and is admired, he is forgotten.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Lautrec said:

Does it really?

 

  Hide contents

I'd say it's bittersweet, with maybe leaning on sweet a bit more, but the moment when Crispin finds out that his mosaic will be torn down is heartbreaking, not to mention the death of Valerius II, and what happens to Styliane, while she is no heroine, is also very brutal. Then there are all of the goodbyes Crispin makes as he leaves Sarantium. I guess the very ending is sweet because he makes a great mosaic and reunites with Alixana, but, there is an element of tragedy there as well.

Spoiler below for Children
 

  Hide contents

We find out in Children that no one remembers who the artist who made the Varena mosaic is. So while Crispin's mosaic stands and is admired, he is forgotten.

 

 

Well, compared to quite a lot of the fantasy fiction I read. 

What was done to Styliane was ghastly, I agree.  OTOH, what she had planned for Alixana if she caught her was even worse

Edited by SeanF
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I finished Children of Earth and Sky earlier today. I really liked it, I think the obvious comparison out of his other books is the Sarantine Mosaic (which I also liked a lot), not just for the many references to the earlier series but also for the structure of how it interweaves the lives of the characters with some major events of that world's history but keeps the focus more on the individuals than on the world-shaking events. I think my only major criticism might be that it took over a hundred pages to really get going, there are a lot of introductions to various characters going on but once the plot did pick up momentum I thought it became a very compelling story. It doesn't have a huge number of action scenes in it but when action is required there were some very tense scenes, and Kay does a good job of showing how suddenly violent incidents could occur in their world. I particularly liked...

The Senjani raid on the Dubravan ship (I think this is where the book really start becoming interesting), the battle between Skandir and the Osmanis and the Senjani fighters raiding the main army.

10 hours ago, Lautrec said:

 

  Hide contents

I'd say it's bittersweet, with maybe leaning on sweet a bit more, but the moment when Crispin finds out that his mosaic will be torn down is heartbreaking, not to mention the death of Valerius II, and what happens to Styliane, while she is no heroine, is also very brutal. Then there are all of the goodbyes Crispin makes as he leaves Sarantium. I guess the very ending is sweet because he makes a great mosaic and reunites with Alixana, but, there is an element of tragedy there as well.

Spoiler below for Children
 

  Hide contents

We find out in Children that no one remembers who the artist who made the Varena mosaic is. So while Crispin's mosaic stands and is admired, he is forgotten.

 

 

I think Crispin might be OK with that, I think he'd consider his work being appreciated more important than people giving him credit for it.

In general I'd agree with you that The Sarantine Mosaic was a fairly bittersweet ending.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, SeanF said:

Well, compared to quite a lot of the fantasy fiction I read. 

What was done to Styliane was ghastly, I agree.  OTOH, what she had planned for Alixana if she caught her was even worse



You must read really depressing fantasy then :P 

 

 

51 minutes ago, williamjm said:

I finished Children of Earth and Sky earlier today. I really liked it, I think the obvious comparison out of his other books is the Sarantine Mosaic (which I also liked a lot), not just for the many references to the earlier series but also for the structure of how it interweaves the lives of the characters with some major events of that world's history but keeps the focus more on the individuals than on the world-shaking events. I think my only major criticism might be that it took over a hundred pages to really get going, there are a lot of introductions to various characters going on but once the plot did pick up momentum I thought it became a very compelling story. It doesn't have a huge number of action scenes in it but when action is required there were some very tense scenes, and Kay does a good job of showing how suddenly violent incidents could occur in their world. I particularly liked...

 

  Reveal hidden contents

The Senjani raid on the Dubravan ship (I think this is where the book really start becoming interesting), the battle between Skandir and the Osmanis and the Senjani fighters raiding the main army.

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

I think Crispin might be OK with that, I think he'd consider his work being appreciated more important than people giving him credit for it.

In general I'd agree with you that The Sarantine Mosaic was a fairly bittersweet ending.

 

Spoiler

Well maybe he would be fine, but I was very sad because I really like him :P .Probably my favourite of Kay's protagonists.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

I am taking a small break from reading Children at the moment.  For the third time, the plot has been advanced by some of the central characters getting into a new situation/confrontation, only to the same main character kill someone.  It's a teensy bit repetitive.  

Apart from that, the quality of the writing is GGK at his best, and it's always fun to read his books and identify all the historical comparative events.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...