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Exercise and Fitness VI


Greywolf2375

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Because we just keep going.

The BIG boss's assistant just stopped me and commented on my weight. (she also wanted to make sure I was ok since she knew about the cancer testing)

Wearing clothes that fit is very nice. :D I really like that people I barely talk to have noticed the changes.

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Great progress Lany. The pics in the old thread really show that you have come a long way. Keep it up. The random compliments from strangers should help!

I didn't do enough yesterday. I skipped my lunch time workout and in the evening I tried to run with the dog, but had a really tough time. It is weird how one day working out can feel great and you have energy, and then another it is torture. I could tell my poor dog wanted to do much more, but I just didn't have it in me.

Oh well, today is another day.

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What is everyone's opinion here on static workouts vs. dynamic workouts? This can refer to stretching, weight lifting, or bodyweight stuff like planks or yoga poses. I think it might be an interesting topic, as there seems to be a lot of confusion around them.

When it comes to the whole "is stretching good for you or bad for you, and when" debate, I don't really know what to think since there are so many different opinions out there, as well as different studies out there which apparently find different things. I have seen a lot of stuff about how if you stretch without warming up at all you are prone to injury. I have also seen stuff about how if you stretch (not sure if this deals with static or dynamic stretches) before a workout your muscles will be x% weaker. This variable seems to vary from study to study. But then you have other people saying that stretching prevents injury, particularly pulls and tears. Then there are a lot of articles and things which seem to say you should stretch after a workout, not only to prevent/lessen that 'tight' feeling, but also to lessen the soreness you feel from the workout. Also I can't shake the feeling that I've read somewhere that static stretching is better for you than dynamic stretching, but I might just be making that one up tbh. Blah, that's the problem with this stuff. Too much conflicting information is out there!

Personally, I don't stretch anymore before workouts. It is really more of a time-constriction thing than anything else, but I also feel like warming up is good enough. And most times I don't stretch after I exercise either, usually because of time again and just because I am too damn tired.

As for static/dynamic workouts, I read a research paper awhile back that was specifically on this topic. What a great find eh? The problem is that I can't find it again, lol. I did however find this from a google search, it isn't the paper I read before but it seems to be saying something similar.

http://books.google.com/books?id=SRptlOx7y...lt&resnum=1

Forgive the long link, but I don't know how to put a link into a word like you guys and gals do with those pictures and stuff. Anyway, the paper I read said that static (isometric) workouts give you greater strength in the position that you hold the weight, and some of this strength translates to an extended ROM but not much. I will use crunches as my example exercise because I feel it is a common enough exercise that everyone knows what it is. For example, if you do a crunch and hold your position at the top of the crunch INSTEAD of doing continuous crunches then you will gain a lot of strength at the top of the crunch and be able to hold that position longer but you will not be able to do many more crunches because of that. On the other hand, the paper said that for dynamic exercises the muscles involved gain strength throughout the entire ROM and some of that translates to static exercises. So for example, if you do crunches continuously this will help you get better at doing crunches. You should also be able to hold yourself at the top of a crunch longer, but you will not see as much of a gain there as you would just holding the crunch. I seem to recall the paper suggesting that, due to its findings, in most cases the dynamic exercise would be the better choice.

I don't use any static workouts in my routine now that I think about it, in fact I don't even take a second or two to wait at the top (or bottom) of a movement, like holding myself above the bar for a pullup, for example. I think I am going to start doing that, hopefully I will remember the next time I workout ( Thursday, frowns, damn you school!)

Now granted, I read this paper awhile ago so I may be misremembering or I may have misread it. But I'm pretty sure this is what it said. But I am putting this out there so everyone can see it. So, has anyone read/experienced anything that agrees/totally conflicts with this? How do you use each of these stretches/workouts in your routine? What are your thoughts on this?

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Seastarr will probably be able to give way more info about stretching than me. However, from the studies I've read, the current consensus is that you should never stretch cold and that static stretching before a workout has at best no effect and at worst a negative effect. If you stretch at all before a workout it should probably be after your cardiovascular warm-up and be composed of dynamic active stretches. Passive static stretching and isometric stretching are best saved for post-workout.

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If you stretch at all before a workout ...composed of dynamic active stretches.

This is the only part I don't necessarily completely agree with, because like I said before I have the feeling I've read that dynamic isn't ever good for you. Everything else seems to be the general consensus.

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This morning's thoughts on stretching are: go by what feels good. Develop an intimacy and intuition with your body and become your own best guide and teacher for what to do with it. When science gives you conflicting information and results that are not definitive, it can open the door to your intuition. Stretching and intuition go hand in hand. That is the practice of yoga asana. Since I work in a field that is all about stretching, both dynamic and static, I am not afraid that stretching is going to hurt me, or the others that I work with, because I can see and feel the benefit on a daily basis. You may need the guidance of an experienced teacher at first, to develop your skill at stretching. Consider it its own thing. I do not recommend doing it as part of a different kind of workout. If you are lifting, lift. If you are running, run. If you are stretching, stretch. Let it be an equally important aspect of your care for your body, not an afterthought. Do it in the morning, or the evening, or when you have a clear mind and some free time. You will begin to develop and understanding of when your body needs to stretch, just like you can feel when you need to drink water or eat. Do you consult research to know when to eat? ( there's a can of worms waiting to be opened....)

I work with people from age four to age 80. I work with professional athletes, pregnant women, and people who have had their spines crushed, necks broken, ligaments torn from sports activity, and just regular folks. My personal experience has been: stretching has been beneficial for every single one of my clients.

The sports-men and -women who come in with injuries and lots of fear about not being able to keep doing their sport, are often too tight for the kinds of motions they are expecting their body to go through during their sport. Often times this tightness is combined with a corresponding weakness--a really common one I see is tight as hell hamstrings and glutes and a weak lower back that then compensates for range that the hamstrings and glutes ought to be absorbing. That's a recipe for back problems, because it puts too much strain and load on the lower back, and forces it to try to do motions it is not capable of. If you lift weights, you understand the importance of the stability of the pelvis and lumbar spine during a dead lift or a squat. True pelvic stability is not possible unless the hamstrings and glutes are supple enough to open as you bend down and allow the sitz bones to swing back and away (sticking out the butt). If the hamstrings drag on the lower side of the pelvis, it will tuck under and the curve of the lumbar spine is compromised.

So there is also an issue of balance here---the muscles need a good balance of strength and flexibility to function well, and there needs to be a good balance between opposing muscle groups for your joints to perform over the years. Invariably, activities like running, cycling, sports, sitting for long periods of time, ballet---anything you do a lot---create imbalances in flexibility and range that need to be addressed via stretching and targeted strengthening.

My two gurus are 60 and 90 years old. Both began studying the art of yoga before they were adults. They are examples of a lifetime of stretching. If you can tour the world at age 90 teaching yoga and doing backbends most 30 year olds cannot do, there's something to that system.

This is probably not the kind of advice you are looking for, since you are focused on a more western scientific perspective, but do recall that the yogis have over 800 years of stretching experience contributing to their art, and that experience contains a great deal of information, too.

I say, stretching is good. Do it when you can. Let your own sensations be a guide to you. Develop your ability to distinguish good sensation from bad sensation. Breathe!

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This is the only part I don't necessarily completely agree with, because like I said before I have the feeling I've read that dynamic isn't ever good for you. Everything else seems to be the general consensus.

Are you sure you're not thinking of ballistic stretching? Ballistic stretching is either "bouncing" into a stretch or doing a dynamic stretch without control and using momentum. Dynamic active stretching is by definition done with full control of the movement.

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Are you sure you're not thinking of ballistic stretching? Ballistic stretching is either "bouncing" into a stretch or doing a dynamic stretch without control and using momentum. Dynamic active stretching is by definition done with full control of the movement.

That IS what I was thinking of! Good call man! Ha, thats why I brought up this topic, to clear up confusion and such. That actualy just clarified a lot for me.

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If you lift weights, you understand the importance of the stability of the pelvis and lumbar spine during a dead lift or a squat. True pelvic stability is not possible unless the hamstrings and glutes are supple enough to open as you bend down and allow the sitz bones to swing back and away (sticking out the butt). If the hamstrings drag on the lower side of the pelvis, it will tuck under and the curve of the lumbar spine is compromised.

this is exactly the reason I cranked my back two months ago. Not listening to seastarr.

Breathe!

my most common advice to friends in time of stress, "Don't forget to breathe."

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this is exactly the reason I cranked my back two months ago. Not listening to seastarr.

:kiss: You finally got my name right. I've been waiting...I hate that big S. (There really is a Superman cult, you know)

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two r's, small 's'. duly noted. ;)

what the heck is the superman cult??? Now I need to know.

on a related topic, I've been thinking it would be fun to wear a cape when riding the fastbike. Like when you see guys riding down the freeway with their unbuttoned shirt billowing out behind them, why not just take it to the logical next step and get a big red cape happening?

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I'll see what I can dig up for "before" pics, although I might have to just start with where I'm at now.

Ended up not going to the gym today. Arms and shoulders are moderately unhappy right now (including hands/forearms) and it just didn't seem worth it. I'll probably take a brisk walk in the park later to get the blood flowing, though, as soon as the Yellow Eye is not at peak intensity.

Lany and Stego -- you guys have made some awesome frickin' progress and I cannot wait to see the results in person.

I need to remind Mr. X to ask about post-surgery massage and how long I'm supposed to wait. I really want to get some of these knots worked out of my upper back.

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Stretching:

Basically, what Liffguard said.

Personally, I work on the basis of dynamic pre-training or playing, static post-training (maybe a bit of PNF too, depending on time), PNF stretching done separately from training, and ballistic stretches never because I don't know what I'm doing when it comes to ballistic stretching.

In other news, I'm basically off crutches now and the physios are very pleased with the progress. Knee flexion is at 125 degrees, I'm almost hyperextending, proprioception is really good, and I'm doing (very light) dual and single leg presses and swiss ball wall squats among other things.

And I had a bit of a breakthrough this morning while doing my knee slides. The bit of scar tissue that kept blocking or inhibiting that movement seemed to break off or break away during one of the reps and the movement is now much smoother. Yay for things that go clunk all of a sudden!

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X-Ray, when asking about massage, be specific! You can get massage lying face down, face up, on your side, or seated. Not knowing the details of your surgery or anything, I'd guess that face-down might be difficult, as it often causes the sinuses to have problems draining (going against gravity and all). Face up can't get to some of the muscles you probably want worked ("upper back"), so side position or seated might be best for you. Also ask about general massage vs. specific massage types. (I'd imagine you DO NOT WANT any of the inside-the-mouth-or-nose types of soft tissue manipulation, and may even want to avoid the over-the-top on the face/forehead as well, but your doctor will know best.) Make sure you communicate all that to your massage therapist when you get one!

I have a treadmill in the house now. My brother moved in and it came with. It's taking up the space we were saving for the elliptical (that we're saving for...). I threw in about 10 minutes on the treadmill today as a warm-up for my exercise DVDs. I did an aerobic one and then about 15 minutes of pilates. Feeling pretty good. Working on staying hydrated throughout, as I think that might be part of the reason I don't really like to exercise (except dance!). Not sure if it's making a difference.

Out of curiosity, I maxed out (kinda--I think I could maybe have done more, but didn't want to be too sore) on bench press with a coworker yesterday. I can do 115. I wish there was a way (is there a way?) to max out on some sort of rhomboid exercise, to make sure my pecs aren't totally overpowering my back.

And, along the stretching--I would be VERY hard-pressed to find an American over the age of about 15 who can't benefit from a good pec strech, on each side, 30 seconds a day.

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Autumn, that is an amazing number for a female. My wife works out, she's very strong, and she can't come close to that. I dated a competitive bodybuilder years back, and she could bench about 135.

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Autumn, that is an amazing number for a female. My wife works out, she's very strong, and she can't come close to that. I dated a competitive bodybuilder years back, and she could bench about 135.

wow. I had no idea. I can do 100x5 right now, but it is on a machine. My goal is to do 150. Maybe that is a bit too much :uhoh: but I will see how far I can get.

So how many squats should a beginner do (without weights)? I have done 4 sets of 10. I might be able to manage one more, or most of one more.

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A machine and free weights are very, very different. I was talking about Olympic barbell bench press.

I was wondering what the difference was? I remember from before (like 22 yrs ago) my right arm was stronger than the left and lifting evenly was very hard. (I did 120 back in my army days, but that was a lifetime ago)

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I was wondering what the difference was? I remember from before (like 22 yrs ago) my right arm was stronger than the left and lifting evenly was very hard. (I did 120 back in my army days, but that was a lifetime ago)

On a machine, I can rep 110 on each side rather easily, (in that I can do two sets, 8 reps at least, and this was even back before I got stronger), which is 220 total, and I am doing about 160-170 using the bar (though I'm just easing back into using the bar, so I haven't hit my upper limit quite yet). So yeah, there's a significant difference.

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