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Can I be a feminist and 'one of the guys'?


Datepalm

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I agree with what many people have said. You were not out of line, this guy was behaving like an ass. His jokes were not funny, offensive, and annoying. What you described, I probably would have flipped out on him sooner.

On the other hand, wheres the line? By letting one risque joke pass, or heaven forbid, telling one, am I now signalling acceptance of anything and everything?

On this, I work with all men myself and I have found it easier to just not tell any potentially off color jokes or allow them around me. There is a fine line and many people do not know when they are crossing it. It makes things easier for me, and my work place more pleasant if no one is joking in a sexual manner. It might make me seem uptight, but it leaves out possibilities of unintentional sexual harassment.

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Sadly what Nicole said is true, I had this office girl almost sue one of our warehouse workers because they were making jokes about vaginas in her hearing. Pretty stupid, had to fire 2 people because of it. But overall in a office work environment any decent manager would jump on anyone being an idiot and making that kind of jokes. But a lot of times people just don't learn especially when you have new employees is hard to beat it into them if their younger and just joined the workforce form highschool. The best thing is to make sure to keep mixing the gender population to a minimal.(all female in office and all male in the warehouse)

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Sadly what Nicole said is true, I had this office girl almost sue one of our warehouse workers because they were making jokes about vaginas in her hearing. Pretty stupid, had to fire 2 people because of it. But overall in a office work environment any decent manager would jump on anyone being an idiot and making that kind of jokes. But a lot of times people just don't learn especially when you have new employees is hard to beat it into them if their younger and just joined the workforce form highschool. The best thing is to make sure to keep mixing the gender population to a minimal.(all female in office and all male in the warehouse)

Your employment discrimination defense lawyer of the future is going to just bang her head against the wall for an entire afternoon over this one.

And tell me this: when you say you fired two people, was that the offensive warehouse worker and the "girl" who complained?

If so, be glad I'm not licensed in New York or I'd be tempted to internet stalk you down, find your old employees, and file a discrimination suit against you on their behalf. Pro bono. :P

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Eh I do what I have to plus our few male salesmen are all working on out of state accounts so I dont keep em in offce.

and we only have 3 female workers anyways 2 clerks 1 sales. and there are 13 warehouse workers.

And i'm the only manager I cant hang out in the back and tell them to shut up everything they say something vulgar.

But yeah is not a good thing Ill redeem it when I convince the boss we need more filers and sales people :P and have her hire another manager.

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Nope two warehouse workers. the girl left. dont know why really she was pissed but i told her ill fire the dude and give warning to other people but she just called and said he wasnt coming in and to sent the last check.

is a small company if it was huge then ill be in trouble but we can barely afford a full-time accountant on retainer

@ Nichole they work fine together but somethings the girls would complain about grab-assing and name calling. I hire very very cheap warehouse workers that I fire and hire on a weekly basis.

Don't know why all this heat on me all of a sudden. lol I see a lot of crappy managment being done in my kind of industry(Import & export)

the problem is your mixing under-paid uneducated people, is not easy in this environment to keep things in check.

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Is sad that we have things like rape culture, but I think is mostly built into our social structure. Not saying is good just saying is going to take time to lessen its hold, dont think we're ever going to make sexist tensions go away.

Read my link. The point is that rape culture is our social structure, which means that we can change it. There is nothing biologically built into us that says, "If someone tells a rape joke, you can't tell them that is unacceptable."

Re: men and women having to work separately; that is an insult to everyone who actually isn't a total asshole to their coworkers of the opposite sex.

Also, it's insulting to all the underpaid people without a lot of education to imply that that's what turns them into jerks. Guess what? Rich people can be total assholes, sexual harrassers, and enablers as well.

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"Grabassing" is not normally "working".

Other than that it would be totally unproductive, print out that entry Kat linked to, and post it up.

LOL we have a big sexual harrssment poster in the freakin break area, is as likely to work as the 'NO SMOKING ANYTHING' poster I put up in the bathrooms. you dont even want to know how many times I caught 18-20 year old kids rolling a blunt right under the smoke detactor.

EDIT:for some funny reason any older and they get smarter do it outside by the shady area next to the parking lot.

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Amicoa,

You're just one lawsuit away from adopting better hiring practice.

Think of it this way, if the workplace isn't so hospitable, and if you could retain more qualified staff for longer period of time by paying them better wages, then you wouldn't have to waste so much time, effort and resources for hiring and training new staff every other week.

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Cant help it, is either them for 8.5/hr or spending 12/hr on better workers. And all we need them to do is load unload containers, the shit isnt even worth stealing. This is the same reaction I got when I told a bunch of my old college buddies about my work, lol every girl was looking at me all pissed and telling me I can't do this. If I dont have to I wouldn't but we all gotta do what we were paid to, I was paid to make this company profitable and I'm doing my job, sorry if it isn't up to a certain standard, but sadly the world revloves around money not social standards.

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Eh I do what I have to

Clearly, you do not. This is 'doing what you have to':

The best thing to do is teach people how to behave in a professional manner when in the workplace and fire them if they can't manage it.

Of course, we clearly mean different things by 'what you have to do'. I mean 'what you have to do legally in most civilised countries, and what you are have to do morally as a decent manager with any pretensions to being professional and diligent at all'. You appear to mean 'what you have to do to avoid doing anything difficult, like protecting your employees'.

LOL we have a big sexual harrssment poster in the freakin break area, is as likely to work as the 'NO SMOKING ANYTHING' poster I put up in the bathrooms.

Could this be because if the management's attitude extends to sticking up a poster that even they regard as a token effort that won't work, the employees are going to conclude that management aren't serious about the issue?

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Amicoa,

You're just one lawsuit away from adopting better hiring practice.

Think of it this way, if the workplace isn't so hospitable, and if you could retain more qualified staff for longer period of time by paying them better wages, then you wouldn't have to waste so much time, effort and resources for hiring and training new staff every other week.

The thing here is your assuming I haven't tried.

I did try. I hired 5 clean highschool grads that did the good decently and knew manners costed me 13/hr each

It was good for a few weeks then It was raise time, so it was 13.20/hr and I didnt have funds to hire more workers so I took it out of my own paycheck figuring if it works out I could just convince the boss this was better. Suffice to say after a few month I started to few the pain, and 7 people cannot do the physical workload of 10 no matter how much you pay them. I'm sorry you all feel so angry or pissed at me for stating my employee practices, but this is everyone gets their socks, and toothbrushers and anything other small everyday items from another country, we have underpaid employees.

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Kat: Thanks for putting up that link. If I'd have been around earlier it would have been double posted.

MD, X-Ray, Raidne et al: Right now you women are my heroes.

Datepalm: Just read your most recent post with the song in it and it made me want to crawl into a corner for the rest of my life and weep. I just don't get how anyone can think that's OK in any situation ever.

amicoa: No wonder the girl left, if your attitude is that anti-harrassment policy is a bloody poster.

we have underpaid employees.

Just cause your employees are underpaid doesn't give them the right to be raging mysoginists and it doesn't give you the right to 'apologise' for them and make excuses.

Rape Culture: Why yes we are swimming in it...

N

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@Mormont

I don't understand what you expect me to do, I protect my employees as best I can. I don't like firing people, I really don't. I had to fire a 46 year old man because he was late for 30 mins every single day, the reason was because he moved and he had to take his kids to school and he didnt want to wake his kids up too early. I asked him if he could stay later to make up the time he said he had to pick up his kids, I said I dont mind come back after that and I can pay you extra overtime, but he just couldn't and I cant just deduct 300mins from his paycheck every 2 weeks, Itll set a standard for other people and they'll all come late. So I fired him, and he cried. I dont know what you expect me to do differently there but if you have an idea please enlighten me. I should add that he did stop waking his kids late, and was on-time for a few days then his was late again for a week after 2 more talks and only after another MONTH of lateness did I fire him He was good leader in the warehouse.

@pample

........ I give warning to anyone that has a complain on them, and will look at the cameras when someone is caught doing anything wrong they are fired.

I cant help it because the amount of new workers that comes in and out, and i cant help the amount of new workers because this is the industry, now if you have a way of giving me a guy that can do the work of two people for 15/hr I will gladly hire 5 of those for each shift and all my problem will be solved but unless you do. then my problem lives on.

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Speaking of vagina, you should tell the kid he's never ever going to get any vagina acting like that. Tell him he's never even going to see one that doesn't require an internet connection or a cover charge if he acts like a pig his whole life. Then laugh in his face. That should fuck with his head a little bit. Speaking as someone who was once a pubescent heterosexual male... if threatened with the prospect of a vagina-less existence I probably would have headed off into the wilderness, eating nothing but nuts and berries for three or four days to re-evaluate my life and contemplate existence.

As for the rest of it... never come across anything like that myself. Sounds like lawyer territory, or at the very least something that needs to be brought to someone in a position of authority within the organization so that they can bring the hammer down.

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