Which Battles should be shown in the series?

[primeminister03]

Okay, so we have an understanding that we are not going to be seing Troy, or LoTR on the small screen when it comes to battle scenes. However, which battles do you think should be shown? Which battle/battles should they go all out for? Thoughts?

[Werthead]

They have to go all-out for the Battle of the Blackwater and then the battle on the Wall. I'd say that pretty much everything else can be fudged. The battle of the ford can be done by just staying tight with Tyrion and his savages, plus the battle is fought at night which should help. The whispering woods and Edmure defeating the Lannister attempt to cross the fords are battles you hear rather than see. The Battle of the Camps can be a report, as in the book. We don't really see the taking of Meereen either.

Of course, the Blackwater is more than challenging enough for anyone to be getting on with, and HBO's attitude to the big battles in Rome is worrying in this regard. Philippi was okay, but did look a bit video gamey. Everything else they copped out on. This is weird, because the battle recreations in the BBC's accompanying documentary series on the same time period were really good, despite being done on a tiny percentage of the budget. They also notably didn't show any of the battles in John Adams. The closest was a long shot of some British ships firing on Boston harbour and later on few brief moments of a naval battle involving the ship Adams is travelling to France on.

I'd hate for the Blackwater just to be a couple of long shots of ships on the river then lots of close-ups on Sansa looking out a window going, "They've blown up the river!" and that's it. Based on the effects used in shows like Doctor Who and BSG, which have much lower budgets than GoT will have, there's no reason something more impressive couldn't be shown. Maybe not on the lines of the Pelennor Fields, but something like the battle on the slopes of Mount Doom in the prologue to Fellowship should now be achievable on a TV budget, given we're ten years later on with more advanced technology.

[kidindi]

exactly as it is in the book other than I'd have the end of the whispering wood on screen

[thotk]

Whispering Wood, Blackwater, Wall, at least the end of a Dothraki battle or 2, taking of Mereen,

and of course I want King Robert vs Rhagar & TOJ

[The hairy bear]

They have to go all-out for the Battle of the Blackwater and then the battle on the Wall. I'd say that pretty much everything else can be fudged.

I fully agree, and I wuld even say that perhaps the battle on the Wall is not needed in its full extent. We have to face that if the Wall is made 700 fit high it is impossible to portray in a realistic fashion a batttle between the Watch at the top and the wildings at the bottom. So perhaps we could just have some fog, some arrows coming from below, the fighting at the doors,...

[Langkard]

Blackwater, of course, from at least the POV of Tyrion and Davos, as it was in the books, and maybe also from the POV of Sandor Clegane and perhaps even the Tyrell's and Stannis.

Whispering Wood because it is a pivotal event for both Robb and Jaime.

The Dothraki battle in which Drogo is wounded is pivotal as well, although it wasn't really much in the book, except the aftermath. Because of the lack of narrative in a TV show, as opposed to a book where such can be easily explained, we need the battle itself to explain what happens to Drogo. Just having him fine in one episode and then terribly wounded in another would be too jarring without all of the internal mental dialogue in Daenerys' thoughts which explained it all in the book.

The battle in Astapor is essential to explain the Unsullied as part of Daenerys' army. I don't see any way around it. And how Daenerys gains the Unsullied is just too clever to leave out. I'd like to see at least the fight between Strong Belwas and the Yunkai hero outside the walls there. And at Mereen it would be nice to see a sewer scene leading to a battle inside the city, since it is important in the complicated relationship between Daenerys and Jorah and the person I'll call Arstan (in lieu of a spoiler).

The siege of Storm's End (the Baratheon siege not the Tyrell siege) is necessary, at least at the beginning to explain what happens to Renly (and Brienne and Catelyn for that matter).

We need the battle on the Fist of the First Men, it's essential. And then we also need the battle and aftermath at Crasters. Can't do without those.

The really big battle of the Wall! I almost forgot it. Of course we need the scaling of the wall from Jon's POV. But we also need the enough of the later battle to explain the desperate situation (with the added benefit of lots more Dolorous Edd comments!) and the resolution and rescue which saves their butts, and explains what happens to Mance and his child and the arrival of certain persons at the Wall and the later vote. (It is very difficult to avoid spoilers!)

[Silverstar]

The Battle of the Blackwater, definitely. It should be an awesome spectacle if they can get it right.

I'm torn on the Whispering Wood. Whilst what happens there is important, I thought the way it was portrayed in the books was so unusual and so cool that I'd love to see that happen on screen too. An entire battle just shown through the strategic use of sound, and the expression on the faces of those listening could be fascinating. Or awful.

[Mya Stone]

I think the Whispering Wood can be done on a very small scale - as someone (I forgot who, I'm sorry) had posted previously, it can be done as quick cuts of Jaime killing a ton of people (Karstarks included), Robb and Grey Wind kicking butt, and Catelyn listening to the sounds in the woods. I think it would be very effective to just show those points of view during the battle scenes, as well as somewhat cost effective (although Direwolf CGI prolly a little more pricey - I can't imagine using a real wolf for Grey Wind in this case).

The Blackwater is a must-have. It's the pinnacle of battles in the second book, heck it's the pinnacle of the second book, period; it's the breaking point for Stannis vs the Lannisters, and we have to see Tyrion's epic plan come to fruition. Coupled with the Cersei/Sansa scenes during the battle, I think it could be brilliant. Not to mention Sandor's complete freak out. It would make no sense to not see what's causing his complete break down and why he's leaving, IMO.

I also agree the battle of the Wall is a must-have. If this does make it to a third season, and HBO is seeing some profit from the first 2 seasons (DVD sales and whatnot), I hope they make it exactly as we read it, from Jon's POV. I think it would be doable, albeit a bit costly with the Mammoths and Giants and CGI-heaviness, but no more costly than the Blackwater, and just as important in terms of story for the third book.

[Ran]

I really hope the Whispering Wood stays exactly as in the book -- no play-by-play, faint glimpses of people under moonlight, the rest noise and screams, and Catelyn surrounded by men praying her son comes through it safe and sound.

I hope they get someone who can do the same as Gareth Edwards did for the Heroes and Villains: Atilla the Hun program, re: battles. They can cover every single battle appropriately, in a good-looking and cost-effective way, with that sort of approach.

[Black Wizard]

ALL OF THEM.

[spikebrennan]

exactly as it is in the book other than I'd have the end of the whispering wood on screen

I'd advocate handling Whispering Wood almost exactly the way it is done in the book; that is to say, from Catelyn's perspective rather than actually seeing the battle. Catelyn is a ways away from the battle, we can _hear_ it, we know it's going on; the outcome is uncertain. Then Rob returns to the camp triumphantly, Catelyn is relieved. _Then_ you drop the surprising punchline: it is revealed that Jaime has been captured in the battle.

[spikebrennan]

Robert vs. the boar. I think it'd be better to show this rather than simply have a wounded Robert return to King's Landing.

[Padraig]

Its going to be hard to show the Whispering Woods and not show Jaime in action. It seems a great scene for him.

I think they can easily skip the Robert v Boar thing.

I can't imagine the Wall being as tall as it is described in the books either. It doesn't really serve any purpose been that tall, except sounding cool. :)

At least there isn't a ton of huge battles. In most, they can focus on some of the key events. Like say, the Others arriving at the Fist.

[Gertrude]

As has been said, Blackwater is most important IMO. Just is. I also agree that Whispering Wood should be as close to the book as possible, but the series is going to need to punch up Jaime's parts, so he will most likely get some close-ups on his bad-assery.

The Wall, I think the most important part is going to be not so much the battle itself, but seeing the army of Wildlings against them - we don't even have to see that much of them, but an establishing shot of the giants and mammoths and spiders (oh my!) will go a long way.

I would be more than happy to see very little focus on the actual battles. Agreed, we need to get a sense of it and the wow factor of Blackwater and the Wall is hard to beat, but a little goes a long way. The moments that happen within these battles are the heart of it and I'd rather see the focus on that.

If this lasts more than a few seasons, we are going to need to add the invasion of Westeros with a resounding Hell Yes! (wherever, whenever that may occur)

[Slick Mongoose]

I was thinking that the battle of the ford in book 1 can be skipped, we can be told what happens afterwards. It's just not that important.

The Whispering Wood needs to be done and done well. It could be one of the highlights of the series if the right atmosphere is put across. And yes, I think you do need to show Jaime in action.

[The Iceman of the North]

The Whispering Wood worked very well in the book. It'd be interesting to see if this format worked just as well on the small screen. It ought to be possible to incorporating scenes from the battle, like Jaime in action, in flashbacks after the battle is over. (For instance when Robb told Catelyn about the battle.)

[Miyamoto]

The majority of the Blackwater was Tyrion roaming about the city at different positions followed by him leading the bust out and killing a bunch of people (which I think they can do relatively tight) and then the battle upon the ships.

The city part ought to be easy, the burning ships will be interesting.

Then the Onion Knight's perspective will be him riding to get all burnt up. If they put as much description into the other galleys, it will be awesome.

This is probably the most descpitive battle besides the wall, and the most decisive in the books. This all saying that they will make a Season Two.

If they can get the drama and the action right like they did in Generation Kill, then it will be good. They have to put more effort in it, then that Terry Goodkind series. That shit sucks.

[redxavier]

For this first series we're likely looking at just some skirmishes - a raid on the Riverlands by Clegane and Catelyn's party being attacked on the way to the Vale being ones that come to mind at the moment. The Whispering Wood is the only battle that needs to be shown - the Green Ford functions mainly as a way of showing Tyrion cannot fight but this can be done well enough in the mountains.

And hopefully these will be reminscent of ROME's opening, rather than the slow-motion choreographed crapness that is Legend of the Seeker (I like 300's style of fighting, but it would be completely inappropriate for Game of Thrones).

For the second series - the Wall and the Blackwater are essential. All the ships will likely be pretty costly.

[Eyelesbarrow]

I want to see Whispering Wood because of the potential awesomeness of it. Night time, moonlight fighting, all the Houses involved in full battle gear and heraldry plus Robb and Jaime.

Also: Not a big scene battle, but I want to see Syrio battle with the Meryn Trant and Co.

[Frank Stark]

I've forgotten my AGoT readings. I thought both the Whispering Wood and the Green Fork battles were at dawn?

I think both should be shown, though I'd enjoy a minimalist approach to Whispering Wood in tribute to how it's depicted in the book. I wouldn't care if they went 100% with it though.

I think the Green Fork is about a lot more than showing Tyrion's inability at combat (which I don't even think is entirely true, esp when he's mounted on horse). It shows Tywin's tactical mastery and willingness to endanger his son. Plus I want to see the reactions of Twyin and his lords when they figure out Robb duped them.