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Ski the Swift

The Judging Eye V

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I wonder if "Death came swirling down" is meant to be more than just a nice-sounding repeating phrase... Do you think it's possible that it's code for damnation?

I don't want to write a long reply to previous points now as I'm afraid that the thread will be closed on me and I'm having some computer trouble due to which I'm currently forced to write on a keyboard with American layout. This makes writing annoying as I have to hunt and peck the punctuation. (In case you wonder, I had to boot from a live CD since that seems to put less strain on my dying power supply and the live CD doesn't appear to support other keyboard layouts. It's power supply shopping time!)

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So...does anyone think Lord Kosoter is really an entity that took over Geshrunni from The Darkness that comes before?

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I wonder if "Death came swirling down" is meant to be more than just a nice-sounding repeating phrase... Do you think it's possible that it's code for damnation?

No, I don't.

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So...does anyone think Lord Kosoter is really an entity that took over Geshrunni from The Darkness that comes before?

No.

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This is all very hypothetical, but I think Lord Kosoter is Kellhus's man, Soma is an agent of Esmenet's, Cleric is Mekeritrig, and there are no skin-spies in the company. If we REALLY want to go on a limb, I might speculate that Sutadra works for Moenghus Sr. (How do you get diaresis on the American keyboard?) and Pokwas is a Zeumi spy, but that's pretty much just guessing on the basis of the Rule of Funny. And since Sarl is crazy, he is particularly susceptible to the influences of various gods.

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This is all very hypothetical, but I think Lord Kosoter is Kellhus's man, Soma is an agent of Esmenet's, Cleric is Mekeritrig, and there are no skin-spies in the company. If we REALLY want to go on a limb, I might speculate that Sutadra works for Moenghus Sr. (How do you get diaresis on the American keyboard?) and Pokwas is a Zeumi spy, but that's pretty much just guessing on the basis of the Rule of Funny. And since Sarl is crazy, he is particularly susceptible to the influences of various gods.
You must be the funnest person to play mafia with, ever.

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Well, most of us think it's pretty great, and the ones who think it's bad don't think it's "hilariously bad." Their dislike of certain aspects of it, I don't think would lend themselves to humor; i.e., the treatment of females.

The swirly death, though, is another matter.

The reason I asked that way was that I'm following the "Thongor and his mighty thews" thread also and I love it.

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The "death came swirling down" line is an homage to Homer, whose descriptions of battle are closely followed by Bakker. The one line epithets, the sudden appearance of named men only to die, the phrase itself... it's not in the Iliad as is, I don't think, but a quick search yields some pretty similar turns of phrase.

The point of the spear went through the bone into

the bladder, and death came upon him as he cried aloud and fell

forward on his knees.

They

threw at the same moment, and Sarpedon struck his foe in the

middle of his throat; the spear went right through, and the

darkness of death fell upon his eyes.

His teeth were all of them

knocked out and the blood came gushing in a stream from both his

eyes; it also came gurgling up from his mouth and nostrils, and

the darkness of death enfolded him round about.

whereon he fell headlong to the ground and the

pangs of death took hold upon him.

That's out of the first 12 books or so, but it's enough examples, I think. So, not exactly the same, but similar. It's what I'll call a Homeric affectation, or so it seems to me.

Edited: found a better example

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Fuck me sideways, I just reread the Iliad and I did not pick up on that at all. Good call.

Anyone think of any others? There's the obvious shout-out in the opening lines of The Sagas, and Cnaiur Breaker-of-Men-And-Horses/Hector, Tamer of Horses.

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Note that Homer used more or less different expressions in all the four quotes while in PoN death keeps coming swirling down. That looks intentional to me. When things are repeated by good authors, it's usually because it's an important detail. When death comes swirling DOWN, my best guess is that Bakker is implying (in a way that is meant to be all but impossible to notice before later books come out and PoN is reread) that the people who die in that passage are going to Hell, assuming that Hell in Earwa (sorry for the lack of diaresis) is downwards.

Thus, death coming swirling down could be a subtle way of saying that the Holy War is anything but and does not really give salvation.

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