A Thread for Small Questions II

[Alexia]

I find it strange that there weren't more Valyrian noble houses, one would be inclined to think that after more than one or two centuries of being in Dragonstone/Westeros, the Targaryens/Valyrians would have an extended family of sorts.

That's the problem with marrying brother to sister; you lose the chance to create collateral lines.

[DizoakiusMaximus]

That's the problem with marrying brother to sister; you lose the chance to create collateral lines.

Yeah thats the problem. ;)

[Guest Other-in-Law]

I find it strange that there weren't more Valyrian noble houses, one would be inclined to think that after more than one or two centuries of being in Dragonstone/Westeros, the Targaryens/Valyrians would have an extended family of sorts.

The inbreeding actually doesn't explain this, since daughters don't create collateral braches of the house, they disappear into whatever house they marry. The cadet lines would have been founded by younger sons. There were at least five times this could have/started to happen:

1. Aegon II and his brothers, who were wiped out in the Dance, so Rhaenyra's descendants ended up as the the sole surviving line

2. Her younger son Viserys II, who ended up succeeding when his nephews died childless

3. Aerys I, Rhaegel, and Maekar (who was actually set up with his own appanage of Summerhall). All the senior sons died without leaving heirs, so the throne fell to Maekar

4. Aerion, Maester Aemon, and Egg; the elder sons predeceased or renounced the claim, so it fell to Egg

5. Jaehaerys II, his elder brother predeceased him

Each of those could have conceivably started a cadet branch of House Targaryen, but things just didn't work out that way.

I'd say some relatives or friends of the Targaryens would have arrived with them, or visited Dragonstone and stayed. And if the Targaryens were exiled, there should still be some other Valyrians that arrived in Dragonstone with them. Also, what was the composition of the army Aegon the Conqueror raised? Were they all native Westorosi? Dragons or no dragons, he would have needed knights and captains to lead his army, and shouldn't it make sense that his guys in key army positions should have been Valyrians?

As already mentioned, there were other Valyrian families who were the Conqueror's battle companions. The Velaryons and the Qoheryses.

[crimsondragon]

I didn't want to start a new thread just for this. It's a small question but a medium sized request for help. ;)

In my paperback copy of ACOK, in the Dany chapter where she visits the Undying, I have a big smudge/blank spot in the last paragraph on page 706. The paragraph begins, "Faster and faster the visions came, one after the other, until it seemed as if the very air had come alive." The next complete sentence I have is, "Behind a silver horse the bloody corpse of a naked man bounced and dragged."

Would someone be so kind as to fill in the interim sentences for me. I'm especially loathe to miss any of this since it's a vision/prophecy section. Big TIA. :bowdown:

[Rhaegar's Rubies]

"Faster and faster the visions came, one after the other, until it seemed as if the very air had come alive. Shadows whirled and danced inside a tent, boneless and terrible. A little girl ran barefoot toward a big house with a red door. Mirri Maz Duur shrieked in the flames, a dragon bursting from her brow. Behind a silver horse..."

Hope that answers all your questions! :laugh:

[crimsondragon]

Hope that answers all your questions! :laugh:

Yes! Thanks so much! :thumbsup:

[Guest Other-in-Law]

The official answer to this one, if there was one, would probably be a retcon. When Theon is returning home in aCoK one of the Mallister sons talks with him about the Booming Tower (iirc) at Seagard, which warns of Ironman attack. They say how it has only rung once in the last three hundred years, when Balon rebelled the first time.

But now we're learning that some 90 years before, the Ironborn were raiding and plundering right and left under Lord Dagon Greyjoy. From Little Dosk in the Reach, to Fair Isle in the Westerland, to the lands sworn to the Starks in the North. So why not Seagard, which is one of the closest targets from the Isles? Did they pull such a fast surprise raid that no one had time to ring the alarum? Or did they refrain for some reason, like marriage ties to the Mallisters?

[Ran]

No direct evidence they've raided directly on larger towns/ports, I think. Lord Farman's said to be repairing his defenses, but that's not necessarily Fair Castle's defenses -- Fair Isle's a big place, and one supposes the Farmans had watchtowers and the like all along their coast.

So it may be that they've raided the riverlands coast (though it's interesting that the riverlands have not yet been named as a subject to ironborn raids), but they just haven't aimed directly at Seagard at any point, thereby leaving the Booming Tower quiet.

[Liliedhe]

One thing that I have been wondering about...

Has there ever been any hint as to whether Aegon the Conqueror and his sisters were all full blood siblings, or if maybe one of them was just a halfsister or halfbrother?

[Ran]

Interesting question. I think if they had been half-siblings, it would probably have been noted... but, you never know. My inclination, however, is that they are full siblings. Something I could ask George to deal with in the Targaryen family tree in the world book, actually.

[Liliedhe]

That would be great. I've been wondering this because of Rhaegar - he seemed to want to reconstruct Aegon's trio with his children, and it seems like he wanted a different mother for his Visenya (at least Dany's vision in the HOuse of the Undying can be interpreted that way), so I wondered if there was historical precedent for this or not.

[Ran]

My take on the different mother thing is necessity: Elia was sickly and it may well be that she was told, after her second child, that she should not/could not have more children. Rhaegar would have to look elsewhere, then.

[Liliedhe]

Could be, of course. It's just that he went to such length to recreate the historical three heads of the dragon that one wonders if having another mother for the third one, maybe a mother associated with Ice instead of Fire, was also part of that 'project' or not.

[El-ahrairah]

Another Aegon I question - did he espouse both his sisters at the same time? Visenya was a few years older than him, and Rhaenys a few years younger.

Dragonstone Septon: "I now pronounce you man and wives. You may kiss the brides".

[Ran]

GRRM has confirmed Aegon was married to both at the same time, but I suppose that doesn't necessarily mean Aegon actually married them at the exact same time. I imagine he did, though.

[schrecklich]

Just an idle question that popped up for me on rereading AGoT....

What happened to Robert Baratheon after he died? Sansa sees Cersei and co. wearing mourning clothes at one point, and the Sansa and Arya chapters reveal that all the bells in the city tolled, but otherwise there is no mention of a funeral or burial that I can recall. With Renly fleeing the city at the time of Robert's death and then taking up arms, it may not have been prudent to send Robert's bones back to Storm's End (if that's even where they'd go any way). I guess the Silent Sisters are somewhat apolitical, so perhaps they did take his bones back?

[Dreadwolf]

What happened to Robert Baratheon after he died?

May be Cersei burried the boar with high honors and ordered to have the King cooked and served with a lemon. :)

On a more serious note I do not know but there should have been a standard Kings funeral procedure with no significant influance over the story that author wanted to tell us. (I can*t remeber well but do we have details on Joffrey*s funeral?)

[Alexia]

We know there was a funeral feast because Cersei said she had the boar served up at the funeral and it tasted like triumph. I don't recall any other references to it though. :dunno:

[Liliedhe]

Robert was buried in the Great Sept of Balor in King's Landing.

Cersei or Jaime reminisce about that at some point, about some wing of the Sept where Robert's bones lie.

[Liadin]

Can anyone recall the extent of Tyrion's knowledge about Cersei's kids' parentage? I should be able to, but can't remember any passages one way or the other.