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Ran

Vote on the Reputation System

Reputation System  

226 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you find the reputation system adds something of value to the board?

    • Yes
      49
    • No
      113
    • Maybe, if you change it a bit...
      42
    • Do not care either way.
      22
  2. 2. If you voted Yes, please indicate how strongly you feel about it. 1 is not strongly, 5 is very strongly.

    • 1
      13
    • 2
      13
    • 3
      26
    • 4
      16
    • 5
      17
    • 0 (Voted No)
      141
  3. 3. If you voted No, please indicate how strongly you feel about it. 1 is not strongly, 5 is very strongly.

    • 1
      21
    • 2
      15
    • 3
      37
    • 4
      23
    • 5
      30
    • 0 (Voted Yes)
      100
  4. 4. If you voted for changing it, which changes would you like to see to make the system more useful on the forum? You may select multiple options.

    • Positive voting only.
      23
    • Removal of the feature from General Chatter.
      23
    • Public voting history (i.e. everyone would see the most recent votes, and who initiated them; no more anonymity)
      54
    • Change how many points are available each day (for example, more positive and negative votes, or more positive and the same or fewer negative votes).
      31
    • Did not vote for changing
      140
  5. 5. Respond to this statement: Ran is awesome.

    • Yes.
      50
    • No.
      3
    • Maybe.
      21
    • Awesome? No. More like evil incarnate.
      28
    • My hovercraft is full of eels.
      78
    • Yeah, but I am awesomer.
      31
    • No, but I am still awesome so it's all good.
      15


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Let me be clear:

I don't think that removing anonymity will necessarily make most people who behave badly behave nicely. I do think, however, that for those people sensitive enough to feel deep slights over a minus or two will probably be able to take a little bit of comfort in knowing, "Oh. It's just that asshole," and/or, "Oh. Raidne did that one. Strange. Well, I'll have to ask her what that was about," and counting on getting a decent response.

And, really, if you want to leave the board, that's your business. I just have a really hard time buying that you're actually afraid of some kind of persecution or tyranny. Persecution with what force? Tyranny by whom, exactly?

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Guest Raidne

Yeah, but I can see how it would be annoying if, say, every single time you posted you noticed that I had negatively rated your post. At that point, you'd almost want to put the person on ignore. Maybe it would be interesting if you could not be rated by any person you had on ignore.

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It does strike me that some people are assuming they are been negatively rated by other certain individuals, when nobody can be sure who is doing what to do (except Admins?).

I can see how that can be discommoding and could lead to trouble.

I don't think anyone thinks this system is tyrannical. Maybe annoying, frustrating, childish, petty etc.

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Pod,

I don't think anyone thinks this system is tyrannical. Maybe annoying, frustrating, childish, petty etc.

Perhaps I was going from too small a sample, but when I hear words like "bullying," and "groupthink" and see comparisons to the Vichy, I begin to discern a trend of fright, apparently before a perceived, conscienceless monster of power. In my experience, such monsters are usually thought of as tyrants by definition.

ETA: What I'm asking is for those people who are so frighted to at least describe the monster more fully, so that its existence can more properly be confirmed.

Edited by Lord Caspen

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On which note, is it possible to just disable it in GC and keep it in the other forums?

That's actually one of the options in the poll, if you select "maybe."

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I decided not to weigh in on things that I have been absent too long to have a good pulse on. For me, it's nice, it's a convenient way of passing opinion on posts. It can be abused, obviously, but I would hope we'd be above that. That doesn't make it true that it won't be a problem though, but it's still only as big a deal as you let it be. Speaking only for myself, I don't have problems with it, even the idea of people voting down all my posts*.

*Doing so passive aggressively would be annoying, but I'd deal I think.

Edited by Lady Blackfish

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A few of the most vocal objectors are personal friends, so I say this with no spite or malice, but FFS! How do you function everyday if you are that sensitive? I mean really, some stranger clicking a button sends you spiraling into despair? Thicken up!

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What I'm asking is for those people who are so frighted to at least describe the monster more fully, so that its existence can more properly be confirmed.

I refer you to Ser Scot's posts on page 3. It's as good a summary as I have seen. I have never been a fan of the argument that "We're only having a bit of fun. We're not the problem, you're the problem because you should have thicker skin."

Even you, Lord Caspen, in saying "people who are so frightened" are stopping just short of some schoolyard "What's a matter fraidy cat? Are you scared?" version of bullying and intimidation.

Metaphorically, it's like there's someone behind you in class who is shooting spit wads into your hair. Does it hurt? No. Should it be endured? No. So the recipient reacts to put a stop to it and either becomes a snitch or the person who punched first.

We may not be able to help the fact that there are assholes but we can at least refrain from giving them peashooters.

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A reputation system promotes group think and surrender. If anyone visited any social bookmarking website, they would know that dissenting opinions are usually sent to the bowels of hell. I garauntee if this forum had a upvote/downvote system, it would be the same thing. A bunch of like minded posts being at the top with the voice of opposition in the graveyard.

In a way, I completely agree with litechick but being chaotic evil is awesome.

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We may not be able to help the fact that there are assholes but we can at least refrain from giving them peashooters.

I think this whole debate comes down to something very basic: How do you see the board? I see it as a place where the lionshare of individuals who post regularly are intelligent, thoughtful and willing to use the post rating feature in the manner in which it was intended. I think every group has a few assholes...but to get rid of the feature because of concern for this minority (rather than using the post rating feature diagnostics to determine who precisely is misusing it) seems unnecessary.

Yeah it gives them peashooters, but for the majority of us, it gives us a nice tool.

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I'm being slowly won over by the "nay"-crowd. It's like gun control. Just because a few people go mental with guns, you want to take away our GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS?!?!?! It's just not that important to have this feature. It's cute, and it might be slightly useful (at the most), but if it upsets some people and make them want to leave, I say fuck it.

I can't remember ever seeing anyone asking for the rating system when we didn't have it.

I think posts that would warrant a large number of minuses have always been dealt with quite effectively on this board anyway.

So maybe just keep the pluses?

I don't know, but I am drunk, and I wish that Nasrudin's Shadow would serenade me.

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I refer you to Ser Scot's posts on page 3. It's as good a summary as I have seen. I have never been a fan of the argument that "We're only having a bit of fun. We're not the problem, you're the problem because you should have thicker skin."

Even you, Lord Caspen, in saying "people who are so frightened" are stopping just short of some schoolyard "What's a matter fraidy cat? Are you scared?" version of bullying and intimidation.

Metaphorically, it's like there's someone behind you in class who is shooting spit wads into your hair. Does it hurt? No. Should it be endured? No. So the recipient reacts to put a stop to it and either becomes a snitch or the person who punched first.

We may not be able to help the fact that there are assholes but we can at least refrain from giving them peashooters.

This. Exactly.

I am really fucking sick of folks coming into this thread and whining about how people are too sensitive and should just deal. It's not constructive, it's not what the thread is for, it's just condescending and unnecessary.

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I see it as a place where the lionshare of individuals who post regularly are intelligent, thoughtful and willing to use the post rating feature in the manner in which it was intended.

Well, I definitely don't see the board as all these three things. Thoughtful and intelligent folks, heck yeah, but a bunch of them are also capable of being total assholes (I'd say 'myself included', but I don't consider myself one of the intelligent, thoughtful people of the board -- I'm just an asshole). I find a good number of folks on this board who are very valuable people also post things that are just plain mean and petty. I don't think these people should also be given the proverbial 'peashooter'.

Sorry for the double post.

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Yeah it gives them peashooters, but for the majority of us, it gives us a nice tool.

Looking at the results of the poll the majority of us actually think the feature brings nothing of use.

Anyway, somewhere in the recesses of my mind I seem to recall this idea of reputations being floated in a previous incarnation of the board and the overwhelming vocal majority didnt want the feature. Pretty sure I have his accurately captured in my mind since my memory is legendary.

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I think this whole debate comes down to something very basic: How do you see the board? I see it as a place where the lionshare of individuals who post regularly are intelligent, thoughtful and willing to use the post rating feature in the manner in which it was intended. I think every group has a few assholes...but to get rid of the feature because of concern for this minority (rather than using the post rating feature diagnostics to determine who precisely is misusing it) seems unnecessary.

And most people probably won't even pay attention to it and use it sparringly, if at all.

Yeah it gives them peashooters, but for the majority of us, it gives us a nice tool.

Jsime comes through with another sig worthy statement. :thumbsup:

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I've been struggling for about an hour I think to come up with an adequate reply on this discussion, and what it comes down to is: I tried to take people to task for being too sensitive and I think that was an asshole thing to do and I'm sorry.

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I've been struggling for about an hour I think to come up with an adequate reply on this discussion, and what it comes down to is: I tried to take people to task for being too sensitive and I think that was an asshole thing to do and I'm sorry.

+1 for the apology.

I get what you were trying to say originally.

It's not worth leaving such a great board for.

To those that use it properly, it's a fantastic tool. Those that do not are just going to have to be dealt with. It's that way with anything. Open up a forum, and you'll get a few trolls. Give a new tool for rating, and you'll get some peashooters. Unfortunately, in both cases, someone's feelings are going to get hurt. It may hurt me deeply that I have a negative rating (and it does bother me), but it isn't something that would turn me against the tool... and it DEFINITELY is NOT something that would ever drive me away from the boards all together!

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I'm curious about something, though ...

Suppose we're on an extended vacation at the home of a mutual friend. Some person present and not known to you, call her Janet, makes a joke and you laugh. You laughed -- which is to say you benefited from and were in any case largely sympathetic to the person who wanted to speak her mind. Now another person in the party, an acquaintance and someone you generally like pretty well, call him Brad, is offended and asks that no one tell any more jokes for the duration of the vacation, not even the ones that would make him laugh. After all, the ones that make him laugh might offend someone else. He wants no one to benefit because some people will be hurt.

It's one thing to sort of hope that Janet will do the ultra-cool thing and cave, so that everyone can have a good time. Yet the host, Frankie, hesitates to come down on this because it's kind of a heavy-handed rule. And then, OTOH, Janet didn't technically do anything wrong, and insists that jokes should still be allowed.

Here am I. I'm looking at Janet, who arguably is not being terribly sympathetic let alone charitable right now, but who in all other circumstances I would have to say, Hell yes, she definitely should be allowed to tell jokes! Freedom of expression and all that! And on the other hand, Brad says that if I take that position then I'm not being sensitive enough to what he needs. Furthermore, he threatens to abandon the vacation altogether if he doesn't get what he wants.

I don't want anyone to leave. I want everyone to be able to enjoy the vacation. I like jokes -- hearing them makes me laugh, and telling them gratifies me when I make other people laugh. Brad has a point, but really, why does he get to take that away? It doesn't strike you as at all sad that it should all have to come to such a high pass?

ETA: Blauer, thank you very much for the +1, and for reporting it. I was having kind of a sucky night till then. I hope you don't mind that I hit you back with it.

Edited by Lord Caspen

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