American Politics mark something something

[Alcibiades]

I imagine tea partier support will be great in primaries, but less so in the general. They should provide organizational strength for the general, I should think. Door knockers, phone bankers, small donors, ect.

But it looks like they'll be as destructive as helpful to Republicans in some places. See the tea party challenger splitting the right wing vote in Harry Reid's race in Nevada, and the Tea Party supported Rand Paul in Kentucky. I think nominating Rand Paul will give the Dems a legitimate shot at winning that Senate seat.

[DanteGabriel]

Repeal the 17th amendment? Just imagine what kind of Senators the Arizona legislature would decide to send to Washington. We'd get some kind of rabid Desert David Duke.

Hrm, on the other hand, maybe they wouldn't have elected a sold-out tantrum-throwing egomaniacal blowhard who was ready to endanger us all with Palin as his next-in-line. McCain used to be pretty soft on Mexicans.

[Mad Monkey]

The 17th amendment? Are you sure that's not some kind of typo? I think they'd be more likely to go after the one about income taxes. Why would a populist group want to weaken its control over politicians? If GOP incumbents no longer have to fear being directly booted out of office by the Tea Party, then why should they ever consider kowtowing them to the future?

[Alcibiades]

Well, maybe they feel a state government is easier for a group such as theirs to influence. Or, they are genuinely federalist. *shrug*

But yeah, the 16th amendment definitely seems like it should be more egregious to them.

[Mad Monkey]

I've never actually heard someone hate on the 17th amendment before. That's like going after the 3rd Amendment! It's just there, not bothering anyone, but securing a basic liberty in a clear, non-ostentation, non-major Supreme Court battlesy sort of way. It's like attacking a crossing guard with a machete! Is this just some sort of gag, or is it something that Republicans are going to have to start pretending to think might be a good idea in the future?

I guess it's less tedious than abortion and gun control.

[DanteGabriel]

I've never actually heard someone hate on the 17th amendment before.

It's probably part of the ongoing fetish that some quarters of the right have for The Way Things Were in the Founding Fathers' Time.

[Mad Monkey]

Well, it's just too bad that not a single one of them seem to understand or even care about the Founding Fathers except as a mean to confer a veneer of historical sanctity upon their modern political beliefs. It's sort of like if the left started saying that the health care law is righteous because King Akhenaten of Egypt approved of it, or that the assault-rifle ban is a great idea because Leonidas of Sparta did the same thing.

[Old Nan]

Well, the left has Europe to fill that void.

[BloodRider]

Sound familiar?

You said they "always underestimate". Furthermore, you show no where in that work that congress followed the CBO budget recommendations, and that is why the CBOs estimate was wrong. Thats quite the burden of proof for you. Until then anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

[Seventh Pup]

Also, this was kinda neat.

A big long list of all the money Arizona is losing because of their new laws:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37021347/ns/us_news-life/

I love the picture of the protesting woman in this article. She truly looks like a zombie.

I also love seeing people protest something in an appropriate way. I always love to see a good boycott. It seems like such a civilized way to disagree with someone and put political pressure on them.

[ThinkerX]

A (incomplete) list of Goldman Sachs people and their flunkies in the upper echelons of the US government.

http://seminal.fired...com/diary/43559

OBAMA, BARACK.

Although to my knowledge he has never directly worked for Goldman, he has taken boatloads of their money (an investment repaid many times) and he calls Robert Rubin, the former head of Goldman Sachs "my friend Bob". (See the video clip of then Senator Barack Obama's address to the Goldman-Rubin funded Hamilton Project in a link below where he uses these words and calls for cuts in entitlements and more NAFTA-type agreements

BIDEN, JOE.

Is it any wonder that between his service as "Senator Credit Card", his efforts to limit busing for desegregation, and his five draft deferments at the height of the Vietnam War that Joe Biden is attached to one of Goldman's tentacles? Goldman has been a major campaign contributor to Biden and according to OpenSecrets, Biden in 2007 alone took almost $25,000 from the Robert Rubin related Citigroup (Rubin was its head as well as being a former head of Goldman

And the list goes on...

[TrackerNeil]

I've never actually heard someone hate on the 17th amendment before.

Back in 2004, Alan Keyes opposed the 17th Amendment in his Senate race against Barack Obama, which shows you what caliber of minds get behind that kind of thing. If people think the Senate is full of political windbags now, they obviously have never read what things were like before that blessed amendment was enacted.

Funny...supposedly the Tea Party is all about empowering people and not politicians, and yet they are endorsing an idea that would take power away from people and put it in the hands of politicians. I guess that's in line with their support for policies that allow corporations to prosper at the expense of people like them.

[Annelise]

Charlie Crist on FL OK-lite abortion law:

Gov. Charlie Crist (I-FL), who left the Republican Party two weeks ago to run for Senate as an independent, is giving further hints that he will likely veto a piece of anti-abortion legislation passed by his state's Republican legislature -- going so far as to call the bill "mean-spirited."

The bill would require women seeking an abortion to get an ultrasound, and to listen to a doctor give a description of the fetus. The legislature has not yet formally sent the bill to Crist. When he does receive the bill, Crist will then have 15 days to decide whether to sign or veto it, or to allow it to become law without his signature.

"On two fronts it disturbs me," Crist told the Tampa Tribune editorial board. "That you would force a woman to go through this procedure...almost seems mean-spirited. To have your government impose on you, listen to a lecture, then on top of that, you have to pay for it."

[Annelise]

Back in 2004, Alan Keyes opposed the 17th Amendment in his Senate race against Barack Obama, which shows you what caliber of minds get behind that kind of thing. If people think the Senate is full of political windbags now, they obviously have never read what things were like before that blessed amendment was enacted.

I don't understand the logic either but this group, at least, is serious about it.

Tea Party Boise President Brendan Smythe told me Ward's new take on the 17th Amendment is a "massive flip-flop." He said that Ward's change of heart "means a lot to us" and could have an effect on Ward's chances in Idaho's May 25 primary.

"It sounds to me like he's answering to the GOP machine," Smythe said. He said that most establishment Republicans in Idaho don't support repealing the amendment and he speculated that they may have influenced Ward's decision to change his mind on the issue.

"He probably got some advice from the incumbents," Smythe told me. "[Ward's reversal] is typical party before country behavior. That's all it is."

[...]

Shortly after this post was published yesterday, Tea Party Boise endorsed Raul Labrador in the Idaho Congressional race. According to KTVB-TV, the tea party group chose Labrador because, among other things, he's "more thoughtful and knowledgeable" than Vaughn Ward.

[BloodRider]

A (incomplete) list of Goldman Sachs people and their flunkies in the upper echelons of the US government.

Yeah - this is a problem, to be sure. To the extent that financial companies have direct influence on policy. I would like to see some direct evidence of favoritism - as it stands it doesn't look too kosher.

Not sure where to go to get away from this though. And we shall see if Wall-Street reform does pass. If it does it will put lie to this notion of buddy-buddy, I think.

[Mad Monkey]

My God, the 17th amendment? Even almost a day later, that still looks so insane. How could anyone hate the 17th amendment? What possible reason could anyone, apart from maybe Boss Tweed from Tammammy Hall, hate the 17th amendment? Maybe it is true that they're pining for the good old days again. What's next -- bring back Alien and Sedition? The Missouri Compromise? The Know-Nothing Party?

[Alcibiades]

I've heard the 17th amendment hate from right wingers (states-rights, more specifically I guess) before. The idea is that the senators would represent the states, and reign in the federal government a bit.

EDIT: Yeh, here's essentially that argument: http://www.libertystop.com/serendipity/archives/119-Abolish-the-17th-Amendment-Direct-Election-of-Senators.html

[Mad Monkey]

I guess that answers all of my questions. I guess that makes sense; can't really expect a well-reasoned idea from such a stupid source. I'm guessing that none of these guys have cracked open a history book from that part of American history (and old Conservapedia articles don't necessarily count).

[aeu]

At the 8:40 mark in the video is one of the saddest things I've seen.

:laugh: Oh, man...

[The Marquis de Leech]

The funny thing about restoring Senators-appointed-by-state-legislatures is that you'd see the return of Democratic Senators from Alabama, Mississippi, et cetera.

I'm not sure if the Tea Partiers have quite thought through the party-political implications of repealing the 17th Amendment.