"Ethnic studies" banned in AZ

[SwordoftheMorning]

It's not. The "193 times the national average" claim confirms that he's just spewing self-serving bullshit.

And this determinations is based upon ..... what exactly ?

Your distaste for the program and a desire to demonize it and the man that seems to be giving an accurate

description of what it's about ? As stated, it's not limited to the ONE racial group enrollment you spoke about

in fact, what he describes is almost exactly what you mentioned as an acceptable way to include ethnic studies

in a school curriculum. Could it be that admitting even the program this law was DESIGNED to shut down is a

positive way to increase the knowledge of how various minority groups participated in the building of America

(good and bad) would kinda gut your argument in support of this law ?

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

And this determinations is based upon ..... what exactly ?

The number is bogus on its face. Even if we assumed that 100% of the students in the program went to college, that statement could not be true unless, nationally, less than 0.6% of minority kids go to college. Even a cursory google search shows that isn't even close to being true. So, he's bullshitting.

Which leads me to believe the teachers and former teachers who testified that the course teaches the U.S. Is "occupied Mexico," and disbelieve his denial of that. Considering that one of the textbooks used in the course is titled "Occupied America", I think that is probably a reasonable assumption.

Your distaste for the program and a desire to demonize it and the man that seems to be giving an accurate description of what it's about ?

Accurate? The only independently verifiable piece of information he provided - the "193 times the national average", is crap.

As stated, it's not limited to the ONE racial group enrollment you spoke about.

Even if I believed this guy generally, even he acknowledged that the classes consist predominantly of kids of that group, which he says it what you'd expect. So no, its nothing like what I advocated, which was a course covering multiple ethnicities, attended by all students.

[TerraPrime]

]quote]And the children in our program matriculate to college at a percentage that is 193 times greater than the national average.

I think he probably meant that the matriculation rate for students in his class is 193% higher than the national average. If the national average is, say, 30%, then it'd be 90% for students in his class.

[Annelise]

A program that is indoctrinating kids with that kind of one-sided political rhetoric should be shut down. I can just imagine the reaction here if you had a history course in which it was stated expressly that Democrats are evil. I don't think we'd be hearing quite as much about academic freedom.

At least we seem to agree it is, in fact, about politics never-mind what Horne says to the contrary. As for the accusation of hypocrisy, I already covered that earlier in the thread so I don't know why you stuck that in there. I don't think what the guest speaker said about republicans, or bringing in a republican guest speaker to retort was appropriate.

I don't know whether this particular program deserved to be shut down, just required a change in personnel or is marvelous as it is. How could I? Or you for that matter. I can say I wouldn't have surmised from two guest speaker experiences, no matter the political bent, that the program was responsible for a small group of students showing disrespect at an assembly and that it was teaching a one sided political rhetoric. After I read how Horne publicly responded after the first one, I think it's fair to wonder if they were walking out on him.

Of course, whether the Mexican studies program is guilty as charged or not is beside the larger point of whether to approach ethnic studies content in separate classes, or mainstream more of it into the general program. That would be a no to the latter, from what I have seen from AZ. It seems like no to the former as well, unless it's as simple as say, combining African American and Mexican studies into the same course, so it's directed at two ethnic groups instead of just one.

Unfortunately, for all that it's been 4 years in the works, the focus seems to be all about getting rid of the existing approach with no more than platitudes and lip-service to replacing it. No matter how offensive you judge that particular program to be (without the benefit of an audit), that's an incomplete approach and I daresay, a bad one.

[Annelise]

I think he probably meant that the matriculation rate for students in his class is 193% higher than the national average. If the national average is, say, 30%, then it'd be 90% for students in his class.

I don't know if his claim shakes out but I saw this:

Meyers and Orozco are concerned about the proposed elimination of programs that have been documented to help student learning and success. The researchers said that Raza Studies students graduate at rates that are higher than their white peers, and enroll in college at a rate that approaches 70 percent. Raza Studies students also outperform their peers in Arizona’s standardized testing.

“Ample scholarship in a variety of disciplines now conclude that rates of student success — particularly among minority students — is positively correlated with culturally relevant and community-minded curriculum,” Orozco said.

More on Meyers and Orozco:

Before coming to OSU, Orozco spent 15 years as a teacher at a predominately Mexican-American school in Tucson. His research there focused on analyzing mission statements of schools and school districts that served predominantly white versus predominantly Mexican ethnic populations to see if expectations and attitudes differed. Orozco found that there were lower expectations and more negative attitudes toward the Mexican ethnic students.

“For minority students — whether ethnic minorities, first-generation college students, disabled students, etc. — ethnic studies program can provide meaningful connective experiences that aid both their understanding of academic content and increase their motivation to pursue formal education.” he said.

Orozco said he had many students who pursued post-secondary education in Tucson and credits Mexican-American studies curricula with providing the impetus they needed.

Meyers has been involved for the past two years in a qualitative research project that investigates the educational experiences of students whose families immigrate to the United States from Mexico. In particular, she concentrates on the ways in which these students adapt to education in the United States and she has focused specifically on these students’ relative success and motivation – and their decision as to whether to pursue further levels of education.

Her findings indicate that when students encounter curriculum that does not include cultural references or awareness of their backgrounds, they feel alienated by the education process, and they are less likely to complete high school and/or go on for professional or academic training.

In contrast, Meyers said, curriculum that encourages students to think critically about a variety of topics — from cultural differences to gender equity to transnational relationships — is a more effective means of engaging students and preparing them for higher levels of education.

In addition to this research project, Meyers also worked with a college readiness program in Tucson called GEAR UP, which serves the Tucson school district and a neighboring district, Sunnyside Unified School District. GEAR UP is a federal grant that aligns school districts and local universities in order to help prepare students from low-income schools for college programs. Many of these students become the first members of their families to attend college; in Tucson, many of these students are Latino.

http://www.articleant.com/gen/79086-new-arizona-law-could-be-detrimental-to-students--according-to-o.html

[MinDonner]

Now Texas is at it too

The board is to vote on a sweeping purge of alleged liberal bias in Texas school textbooks in favour of what Dunbar says really matters: a belief in America as a nation chosen by God as a beacon to the world, and free enterprise as the cornerstone of liberty and democracy.

...

Several changes include sidelining Thomas Jefferson, who favoured separation of church and state, while introducing a new focus on the "significant contributions" of pro-slavery Confederate leaders during the civil war.

...

The education board has dropped references to the slave trade in favour of calling it the more innocuous "Atlantic triangular trade", and recasts the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as driven by Islamic fundamentalism.

[Annelise]

Now Texas is at it too

Ah yes, no worries about a large chunk of the nation's textbooks describing the civil rights movement as creating, "unrealistic expectations of equal outcomes."

Don't worry folks, we don't need ethnic studies: all is well. Post racial society is just around the corner.

(At least they're pretty honest about wanting to break down the separation of church and state).

[ztemhead]

I have a friend who works at the governor's office, and relates the following tidbits

-- the impetus for this bill is political vengance against a particular district in Tucson that offended Tom Horne. Use of the legislature to execute personal vendetta is par for the course here lately.

-- On account of it's passage, plus the immigration bill, various gun legislation, etc., Governor Brewer will most likely win the Republican nomination for governor.

-- Because of backlash against the above, and the amount of independents who are totally disgusted with her performance, she will probably lose the general election to state AG Terry Goddard.

[peterbound]

I have a friend who works at the governor's office, and relates the following tidbits

-- the impetus for this bill is political vengance against a particular district in Tucson that offended Tom Horne. Use of the legislature to execute personal vendetta is par for the course here lately.

-- On account of it's passage, plus the immigration bill, various gun legislation, etc., Governor Brewer will most likely win the Republican nomination for governor.

-- Because of backlash against the above, and the amount of independents who are totally disgusted with her performance, she will probably lose the general election to state AG Terry Goddard.

I got to disagree with the Independent vote. As an Arizona independent i'll vote for Brewer. Nor am i disgusted. The only people that i've spoken with that are 'disgusted' are registered Democrats, and would vote that way in the GE anyways, so no loss there. The republicans love the idea, and most of the Independents i've spoken with are happy she's actually taking action against what has been a political hot potato for so long.

I think you need to regroup your shot pattern on your definition of an independent. If you mean the college kid that has been to lazy to register as a democrat then she won't get the vote, but if you mean someone that votes on the issues, and not the party, i think you'll find the votes will swing in Brewer's favor.

Plus, how can you /not/ love the new gun law? That's the best thing to happen to AZ since the freaking London Bridge came to town!

This is my favorite quote about it, from the freaking Huffington Post:

'However, the measure was supported by police unions representing rank-and-file officers, who said their best friend on the streets is a law-abiding citizen equipped to protect themselves or others.'

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

peterbound,

The only people that i've spoken with that are 'disgusted' are registered Democrats, and would vote that way in the GE anyways, so no loss there.

I'm a looooonnnng way from an American Liberal and I'm not a Democrat and I think this law is pretty stupid. Of course I live in the incredibly liberal State of South Carolina so I might be biased by my place of residence.

[peterbound]

Now Texas is at it too

Wow, when i read this i actually got a little sick to my stomach. Really? She actually ran on a platform of 'Creationism'? Good lord. I can't wrap my head around the idea that people actually buy into that shit. Moses and our Founding Fathers? The Ten Commandments and The Constitution. This article has ruined my day.

[peterbound]

peterbound,

I'm a looooonnnng way from an American Liberal and I'm not a Democrat and I think this law is pretty stupid. Of course I live in the incredibly liberal State of South Carolina so I might be biased by my place of residence.

One i'm sure with as big of an illegal immigration problem as AZ, as well. And just to clarify, are we talking the Ethnic studies law, or the immigration, or both. Just so i know what we are arguing about :)

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

peterbound,

The ethnic studies law. I'm not overly comfortable with the "I need your Papers" law either.

[ztemhead]

I got to disagree with the Independent vote. As an Arizona independent i'll vote for Brewer.

Really?

No, dude, really??

[peterbound]

peterbound,

The ethnic studies law. I'm not overly comfortable with the "I need your Papers" law either.

Check.

I don't see the Ethnic Studies law changing many courses in the schools. Like i said on several occasions. It was a required class when i was in high school, that or gender studies. Now i came from a small town in AZ that had a heavily hispanic influence, and I didn't really think anything of it. We did however have a teacher that was very into the 'occupied mexico' philosophy that this is trying to knock down. No one in the administration, school board, PTA, really felt comfortable addressing this issue due to the rampant PC'ing of our schools, and the idea that as long as this hatred is directed against the majority it's alright. The oversight that this bill is introducing could have been used to bring this errant instructor back into line and to follow the set curriculum that had been approved by the state/local boards.

No one has ever said they were going to stop teaching the past, and all it's ugliness. What they are saying is that they are going to stop using that past as a platform to create extremists. It's shocking to me that so many people are against this. It would be like teaching the 'War of Northern Aggression' in South Carolina instead of the Civil War. Teach the facts, not something that is going to stir shit intentionally.

[peterbound]

Really?

No, dude, really??

Admittedly i've been in Iraq for a loooong time, so i've not been following Goddard as much as Brewer. I do like what he did up in Colorado City, but unless he comes up with something better than 'Increasing Boarder Security' i'm going to have to throw my hat in with Brewer, and i haven't voted Republican in years.

My vote will come down to a couple things

The immigration issue

The budget (which sucks right now, and is killing my chances of getting on at PFD)

if this gun bill sticks.

And if the stupid ass 'ride your bike between cars' law sticks (i put that one in for you)

[MinDonner]

'Increasing Boarder Security'

Dude. We have mods for that.

[peterbound]

Dude. We have mods for that.

Ha, if only it was that easy

And two 'Dude's' in a row. I haven't heard that word this much since the 90's.

[ztemhead]

And if the stupid ass 'ride your bike between cars' law sticks (i put that one in for you)

Brewer vetoed it.

[peterbound]

Brewer vetoed it.

Ha, i know, i read your post the other day. I know you are for it, but i could never fit my Harley between the cars, so i don't really care for it. It was legal when i lived in the UK and i never did it. I was always afraid someone was going to 'Door' me.