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A Thread for Small Questions III


Lady Blackfish

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I was thinking about the older crowns, the ones that sat the heads of Aegon I and the kings that followed him. If you look at the art of the Russian artist (I think his name is Amok but am not sure) the historic Targaryen kings are all wearing crowns. For example, Aegon I had a crown of square cut rubies and Valyian steel. I want to know where that crown is. Queen Raella's crown must have been just a consort crown. I think Cersei had her own consort crown as well.

I get the distinct impression that crowns in ASOIAF are less than reverently handed down like treasured heirlooms and are regarded more just like another piece of jewelry that you wear if it compliments your outfit. Mind you, only certain persons would be entitled (heh) to wear a crown, but Cersei appears to have several, that she swaps around to match her clothes, as did Joffrey, Robb just had crowns made (even though their surely must have been crowns for the Kings in the North, back in the day)...

Although GRRM was very specific about the fact that Aegon I had a very distinct crown that he favored, it didn't appear to be in use among the rest of the dynasty for very long. Queen Rhaenyra wore her father's crown, but since she didn't actually rule as a queen, Aegon II probably his own, etc...

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Another question from me - I seem to have an endless supply.

Jaime tells Ryman frey to go home or to hell but to leave the crown. And yet the crown is with lady Stoneheart later on. How can that be? I cant imagine Ryman not following Jaime's specific instructions.

He did, and Ryman was intercepted by unCat and her merry band of murderers. I think.

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Finally I read somewhere (and i cannot recall where) a speculation that the "Unknown substance" mixed with standard steel prior to spellforging was one of the things slaves mined for under Valyara. The kindly man told Arya the story of the 1st faceless man in these mines. He said they were searching for "Silver, yellow gold, and red gold". I understand what silver and yellow gold are...but red gold? I don't understand that. The only metal that comes to mind is copper, but they always call copper "copper" in the books...as in "I just passed the maester exams in the subject of history and forged my copper link". Now add to that Brienne's thoughts of the beauty of the red veins in Oathkeeper.

Red gold is simply gold alloyed with copper, which gives it that reddish hue. The more copper in the alloy, the redder the color is. Similarly for a silver/gold alloy and white gold. In fact, you can even make "fake" gold, that is only an alloy of copper and silver, with only traces of actual gold but looking a lot like it.

Isn't Winterfell destoryed?

Not destroyed, only burnt. I recall reading somewhere in the books, someone mentions something to the effect that granite doesn't burn. If there was someone willing to rebuild, the castle could be made suitable for habitation quickly.

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I have some questions.

IIRC we know that:

1. First Men and Children were battling Others in Westeros during the Long Night, it was the War for Dawn.

2. Old Nan (?) tell Bran that the Last Hero went to the Children and then could win against the White Walkers.

3. Azor Ahai is an eastern hero, who seems to have raged war against Others too.

So my questions are:

1. Are the Last Hero and Azor Ahai the same person ? It would be strange since I don't think there was many connections between Essos and Westeros in that era.

2. Was there at least two War for Dawn ? One on Essos then one on Westeros ?

I have another too but not related with the previous ones: since the First Men used bronze weapons and Childrens dragonglass ones, how it is common knowlegde that Others hate iron ?

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The common speculation is that, yes, Azor Ahai = the Last Hero. Essos does not connect to the far north as Westeros does, and Azor Ahai may well have come to Westeros to try to end the Long Night by defeating the Others.

The Last Hero is the one who fought using "dragonsteel", which Jon and Samwell to take to mean Valyrian steel. It's supposed that Azor Ahai's sword, Lightbringer, was basically a weapon of that kind. I've speculated that Azor Ahai was essentially Valyrian, or perhaps of an immediate predecessor culture to the Valyrians.

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The common speculation is that, yes, Azor Ahai = the Last Hero. Essos does not connect to the far north as Westeros does, and Azor Ahai may well have come to Westeros to try to end the Long Night by defeating the Others.

The Last Hero is the one who fought using "dragonsteel", which Jon and Samwell to take to mean Valyrian steel. It's supposed that Azor Ahai's sword, Lightbringer, was basically a weapon of that kind. I've speculated that Azor Ahai was essentially Valyrian, or perhaps of an immediate predecessor culture to the Valyrians.

So will we finally discover who the Azor Ahai is, rather confirm Azor Ahai when that individual (Danys) finding the "lightbringer" sword?

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I have another question. How the Vale of Arryn and the Mountains of the Moon fall under Targaryen rule ? Is there some battle ? A kneeling king ? I don't remember anything about it reading the books.

Concerning Azor Ahai beeing an immediate predecessor of valyrian culture, I find it improbable: the Long Night was some 8,000 years ago, the Freehold of Valyria rose in proeminence 5,000 years ago but they used to be shepherds before.

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Concerning Azor Ahai beeing an immediate predecessor of valyrian culture, I find it improbable: the Long Night was some 8,000 years ago, the Freehold of Valyria rose in proeminence 5,000 years ago but they used to be shepherds before.

I think that can be explained by the fact that the histories are rather messed up. There is at least one mention of knights living before there where knights, and people living for hundreds of years. Also, the Maesters argue over othr aspects of ancient history, so it's reasonable to assume they could be the same, just the records are wrong.

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I don't know if this is a question, a statement or maybe I'm just not quite understanding how it goes...

When Joffrey becomes king after Robert's death, I am under the impression he is not of age and Cersei, as the Queen Regent, actually governs the realm.

When Tommen becomes king after Joffrey's death, the same situation appears to occur.

However, it seems Joffrey wielded more power than Tommen does. Joffrey was able to make demands and actually have them carried out most of the time, even if they were in contradiction to what everyone else wanted (the beheading of Eddard Stark being a classic example but far from the only one). Yet Tommen doesn't seem to have this kind of power. Even simple requests (like having Ser Loras teach him how to joust with a lance) are denied him with casual ease by Cersei.

I understand Joffrey was older than Tommen and I also understand he was far more headstrong than Tommen, but I thought they're respective situations were the same (underage, requiring a Regent). Why was everyone in such a hurry to do everything Joffrey ever wanted and yet Tommen has to fight just to get a kitten???

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Cersei indulged Joffrey far more. When Tyrion noted his various cruelties, she just said, boys will be boys. Tommen, in contrast, is coddled in a very constraining way. And, yes, he's a child, whereas Joff -- at 13 -- was most of the way to adulthood by Westerosi standards.

Finally, Ned's execution was clearly prompted by other parties, and Tyrion suspects that Slynt's part in it, at least, was something that had been planned by someone else (i.e. Littlefinger, who seems the obvious candidate).

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I have another question. How the Vale of Arryn and the Mountains of the Moon fall under Targaryen rule ? Is there some battle ? A kneeling king ? I don't remember anything about it reading the books.

It's never been explained. The general guess is that the Arryns capitulated without fighting. I like to imagine this happened with the Arryns amassing their armies near the Bloody Gate and retreating to the Eyrie, congratulating themselves on their many-layered defences, then Aegon on dragonback directly lands in the castle courtyard and King Arryn says, "Oh yeah, dragons, damn," and bends the knee :)

I think Ran once said we might get an explanation in the world book, if we were very lucky.

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I don't know if this is a question, a statement or maybe I'm just not quite understanding how it goes...

When Joffrey becomes king after Robert's death, I am under the impression he is not of age and Cersei, as the Queen Regent, actually governs the realm.

When Tommen becomes king after Joffrey's death, the same situation appears to occur.

However, it seems Joffrey wielded more power than Tommen does. Joffrey was able to make demands and actually have them carried out most of the time, even if they were in contradiction to what everyone else wanted (the beheading of Eddard Stark being a classic example but far from the only one). Yet Tommen doesn't seem to have this kind of power. Even simple requests (like having Ser Loras teach him how to joust with a lance) are denied him with casual ease by Cersei.

I understand Joffrey was older than Tommen and I also understand he was far more headstrong than Tommen, but I thought they're respective situations were the same (underage, requiring a Regent). Why was everyone in such a hurry to do everything Joffrey ever wanted and yet Tommen has to fight just to get a kitten???

Well, for starters, the age difference does matter. 13 isn't that far from being of age, whereas Tommen is a few years younger. Plus Joffrey has a much more forceful personality. In addition to that, Joffrey would sometimes pull his stunts in places that Cersei couldn't deny him; example, with Ned, he called for his head in the middle of a big public gathering. If Cersei says no, Joffrey looks like a weak king doing what Mommy says.

I'd also say it has something to do with Joffrey dying. Cersei coddled all her kids, but after Joffrey died, I think she really felt like she had to baby Tommen and protect him even more.

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Guest Other-in-Law

2.5 questions

1. How big is Westeros? like the size of Great Britain or North America?

2. Does dragonglass only come from dragons?

2.5. If so how do the children of the forest have dragonglass weapons?

1. About the size of South America. The Wall is very nearly 300 miles across, so you can figure from there.

2. It's actually stated to come from the fires below the earth, and Stannis intended to have it mined from the volcano Dragonstone. There's no proof that it does come from dragons at all; the name may come from mere folk belief. It's also called obsidian, which in real life has nothing to do with dragons.

2.5 Presumably there are extinct volcanoes elsewhere in Westeros. They were virtually all over the world at some time or other on earth.

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She is the Princess that he serves. It's sort of like how everyone calls everyone else "my lord" or "my lady"; they're not saying that this person is actually their personal husbands or wives, but it's just a general term of respect.

Although, I can see why Rhaella might fall for her gallant, infinitely devoted master-at-arms over the cruel, sexually dysfunctional wreck of a brother that she was forced to marry.

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