Ned Starks real bastard and Jon Snow's twin

[Howlin' Howland]

About two years ago I came up with a crazy theory that Gerold (“Darkstar”) Dayne was actually Jon Snow’s twin brother under the theory R+L=J&D. The theory didn’t work out because Darkstar is too old to be Jon’s twin.

I’ve come up with another crazy theory that I think works much better, it answers all of the questions that made me believe Darkstar was Jon’s twin, and it helps explain some inconsistencies I’ve seen in the actions of some characters (especially Eddard Stark). My new theory is that Darkstar is the bastard son of Eddard Stark and Ashara Dayne, and that Lyanna Stark had twins at the Tower of Joy.

Here’s the timeline and explanation for the theory (it includes facts from the books mixed with speculation to fill in the gaps):

Eddard and Ashara already had a relationship before the Harrenhal Tourney. Ashara was already pregnant and Eddard was waiting to ask his father for permission before marrying her. Before Eddard had a chance to ask for permission Lyanna and Rhaegar ran off to the Tower of Joy and Aerys murdered his father. Realizing that Eddard would need the support of the Tully’s in the coming war he broke off his relationship with Ashara, who returned to Dorne, and he married Catelyn.

The nice thing about this timeline is that it’s the only one that I’ve seen that lets Eddard get through the entire series without ever breaking an oath or telling a lie. He never broke his marriage vow to Catelyn and because Ashara gave birth to their bastard child after the war had begun he wasn’t lying to Robert when he told him that he had fathered a bastard while on campaign.

The reason I like Darkstar for the bastard is because of his appearance. GRRM spent more time describing the physical appearance of Darkstar than almost any other character (except maybe the faceless man) in the series. Silver hair with a dark streak down the middle that looks dark in the moonlight. Dark violet eyes that look dark in the moonlight. At first I thought this was a clue that he was half Targ and half Stark (hence Jon Snow’s twin) but it works just as well for a half Dayne half Stark and the only likely pairing in the story is Ashara and Eddard at Harrenhall.

It took a while for Robert et al to marshal their forces, probably the better part of a year. Because he was in seclusion Rhaegar only learned about the war shortly before the battle of the trident, and at the time Lyanna was newly pregnant. This timeline lets Darkstar be about two years older than Jon.

The battle of the Trident, the battles in the Riverlands, the capture of King’s Landing, and the breaking of the siege at Storms end take close to eight months. Then Eddard goes to the Tower of Joy where he finds Lyanna dying after giving birth to twins. He makes her a promise to Lyanna, probably including something about protecting her children. One of the children is a dark haired dark eyed boy, the other is silver haired and purple eyed. Eddard knows that if Robert sees the silver haired child he will become suspicious and ask questions, that combined with his promise to Lyanna could force him into a war with his friend, so he goes to the only place he can for help…Dorne.

On the pretext of returning Dawn to the Daynes Eddard travels to meet Ashara. He learns about their bastard son. He and Ashara agree that the twins should be split up, that way if one is discovered the other will still be safe. Ashara fakes a suicide and takes Rhaegar’s silver haired child and her bastard to one of her families most remote holdings, High Hermitage, to raise in secret.

Prince Doran is aware of the arrangement and is concerned that Darkstar’s push for rebellion could cause the Baratheons to investigate High Hermitage which could lead them to discovering Rhaegar’s heir. This is why Doran claims that Darkstar “is the most dangerous man in all of Dorne.” That line always looked suspiciously like one that had a secret meaning to me.

I like this theory because it works within the timeline of the book. It lets Eddard get through the books without lying or breaking an oath. It explains Ashara’s “suicide.” It explains Doran’s claim about Darkstar being the most dangerous man in all of Dorne. It gives us the third head for the dragon. And it’s exactly the kind of twist that GRRM gives hints at early so on a reread you can see how everyone’s actions had a different meaning from what you originally thought.

[Mad Monkey]

It lets Eddard get through the books without lying or breaking an oath.

Oh, no, even if we give you all of that he still has a couple of lies to his credit.

At first I thought this was a clue that he was half Targ and half Stark (hence Jon Snow’s twin)

Could you go over this part again? I can definitely see the reasoning behind your "half-Targaryen" idea -- he, like many people in the series, share Targaryen-like features and even if he isn't related to Rhaegar he still might have a trace of Valyrian somewhere in his lineage. I think this is the quote you were describing:

Ser Gerold Dayne had an aquiline nose, high cheekbones, a strong jaw. He kept his face clean shaven, but his thick hair fell to his collar like a silver glacier, divided by a streak of midnight black. He has a cruel mouth, though, and a crueler tongue. His eyes seemed black as he sat outlined against the dying sun, sharpening his steel, but she had looked at them from a closer vantage and she knew that they were purple. Dark purple. Dark and angry.

I'm not seeing which part of that seems especially Stark. The bit about black hair could easily point to Baratheon too, for example (though I doubt that, of course).

. One of the children is a dark haired dark eyed boy, the other is silver haired and purple eyed.

Are you saying that these are Lyanna's children? Are these the twins then? If so, then who is the dark-haired, dark-eyed child? You said earlier that it couldn't be Jon Snow -- and if the kid has dark eyes it couldn't be him anyway (his are grey, I think). Maybe I'm really drowsy or something, but I'm not sure I completely understand what you're trying to say here about the connection between Jon Snow and the Darkstar.

[Howlin' Howland]

Oh, no, even if we give you all of that he still has a couple of lies to his credit.

Could you go over this part again? I can definitely see the reasoning behind your "half-Targaryen" idea -- he, like many people in the series, share Targaryen-like features and even if he isn't related to Rhaegar he still might have a trace of Valyrian somewhere in his lineage. I think this is the quote you were describing:

I'm not seeing which part of that seems especially Stark. The bit about black hair could easily point to Baratheon too, for example (though I doubt that, of course).

Are you saying that these are Lyanna's children? Are these the twins then? If so, then who is the dark-haired, dark-eyed child? You said earlier that it couldn't be Jon Snow -- and if the kid has dark eyes it couldn't be him anyway (his are grey, I think). Maybe I'm really drowsy or something, but I'm not sure I completely understand what you're trying to say here about the connection between Jon Snow and the Darkstar.

He regularly mislead people, but when did he lie?

That was the quote. I don't have the book with me and wanted to get the theory off my chest. The detail in the description makes me think GRRM is giving us a hint. Silver/Purple in the major players in the story means Targ or Dayne. The three houses with Dark coloring are Stark, Baratheon, and Greyjoy. The major Baratheon players are Renly (gay), Stannis (would never father a bastard), and Robert (the seed is strong, no siver hair). Plus blue eyes. That leaves Stark, unless the detail in the description is a red herring.

No, there are three kids. Darkstar is born 18-24 months before Lyanna's twins. He explains Eddards ability to honestly claim a bastard. But he doesn't explain the suicide or why Darkstar was raised in the isolated keep at High Hermitage in secret, or why Darkstar would be the most dangerous man in Dorn. One of Rhaegar's children would explain all of that.

[Mad Monkey]

He regularly mislead people, but when did he lie?

Remember when he said that Joffrey Baratheon was the just and true heir to Robert's throne, and that he himself was an evil traitor who had conspired to defile Robert's legacy and murder the new King, his siblings, and their mother? Remember that time when he said that he would write down Robert's will exactly as it was dictated, and then he decided to change it all? He had a good reason for each of these things, but they were definitely intentional lies.

But that's not really the point here. I like your theory; it's a little convoluted, but it does sort of make a nice counterpoint to the usual Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon theories. I just need some more clarification because I'm not too sure if I understand the details:

Is Darkstar Ashara Dayne's child with Eddard? If so, then who are each of the twins that Lyanna had and what happened to them? I think one of them is Jon Snow, right? But then who is the other. You mentioned 3 kids but I can only account for 2.

[The Gallows Knight]

Interesting but now I can't help but picture Eddard as some sort of Westeros Obi Wan Kenobi what with all the secret twin hiding.

[FatCatOberyn]

Darkstar as Ned's child... interesting.

[MinDonner]

Why does there need to be a twin? Ned already has a reason for going to the Daynes'. Secret Hidden Heirs appearing with no warning seems too cheesy; at least with R+L=J it's been telegraphed from the start.

ETA: I quite like (though am unconvinced by) the Darkstar = Ned's Bastard theory, as there has to be SOME reason for Darkstar "couldn't kill an 8-year-old-girl" to be The Most Dangerous Man... maybe he's just party to the Jon's Parentage secret?

[John Blaze]

I'm on a reread right now, about to start AFFC, but do they ever say that Ashara is Darkstar's mother?

[mikeym]

I'm on a reread right now, about to start AFFC, but do they ever say that Ashara is Darkstar's mother?

No, I don't believe so, I'm sure that would have jumped out at me.

I'm hoping Darkstar puts in an appearance in ADWD. I'd be surprised if there isn't some crossover between ADWD and AFFC - defeats the point of having them happen simultaneously. Darkstar pops up near the end of AFFC without any real explanation as I remember it for where he'd been or what he was doing, so it seems a possibility.

[Flea Bottom Flea]

I'm on a reread right now, about to start AFFC, but do they ever say that Ashara is Darkstar's mother?

IIRC, Gerold Dayne is from a lesser branch--High Hermitage I think. Which would, I believe remove the possibility that Ashara Dayne is his mother. Not to mention, wouldn't he have taken his father's name? Speaking of which, who is Edric Dayne's papa?

[Yakman]

omg, threads like these are the reason why GRRM has to get ADWD out.

Darkstar is not, cannot, be Eddard's son. Why? Pretty simple: he's too old.

We don't get an exact age, but let's be real here--Jon is only about 16 when the Feast occurs. maybe 15. Darkstar is described as a MAN not a boy. he has a lot of stories swirling about him. he's a knight. it is suggesting that he has military experience, which in turn suggests that he may have fought in the War of the Usurper.

remember, all the "adults"--Eddard, Robert, Cersei, are all fairly young. Robert and Eddard are only about 33 when the story begins--they were maybe 18, 19, when Robert's rebellion began. Cersei and Jaime are about 30. I'd guess that Darkstar is about Jaime's age.

[Mad Monkey]

which in turn suggests that he may have fought in the War of the Usurper.

The proper term is, "the War of Targaryen Aggression."

[my watch begins]

Ok so hows this crack pot theory? Eddard and Ashara had a bastard child. Eddard was going to marry Ashara but since all that shit went down with His father and brother he had to marry Catelyn so Ashara took his bastard back to where ever she lived. Rhagear has Lyanna in the tower of joy were she of course is pregnant with Jon Snow the bastard of Rhagear Taragyan. So Rhaegar knows he needs to protect his true heir Aegon. So he along with Arthur Dayne are able to convince Ashara to swamp Eddards bastard with Aegon. So when the sack of King's Landing happens Gregor kills Eddards bastard but not Aegon. Eddard finds out about this and doesn't say anything but has a deep hatred for the Lannisters ever since. He goes to the tower of joy kills Arthur out vengeance (hey Eddards an honorable guy but he's human and seeing is crushed baby and knowing Arthur had a hand in it probably pissed him off) Eddard goes into the tower of joy and finds Lyanna dieing with baby Jon and her arms and he promises her to take care of him. Upon hereing of here baby's gruesome death and her brother's death at the hands of Eddard, Ashara kills herself. Meanwhile the still alive baby Aegon is takin Dorne to be raised in secret with a new name. He becomes Darkstar! Sorry for the terrible grammar and spelling.

[House Mauldania]

bump

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I think Darkstar is just a cadet-branch Dayne with an inflated sense of self-worth. I also think he's too old to be be Ned's son with Ashara. Arianne is like 23 and she treats him like a peer, so I assume he's probably that age or older. Certainly older than 18-ish, which is what he'd be if he were Ned's bastard from the Harrenhal tournament.

[Bride of Winter]

honestly, at this point there are so many theories I never feel right dismissing any as wrong. and to be honest, this is on the more plausible side of some of the parentage theories out there.

Not saying I expect it to be true, but there are a few reasons I really like your theory -

1 - I've always believed there's something up with Darkstar. No way GRRM spent so much time describing him, and Doran described him as "the most dangerous man in all of Dorne" if he's just a passing minor character.

2 - It explains Ned + Ashara. I never believed Jon was their son because at this point, I'm unmovable on the stance that Lyanna definitely had a baby in the TOJ, and that that baby is most likely Jon. So your theory explains Ned and Ashara (and how it's not out of character for Ned given the timeline), while explaining Rhaegar and Lyanna as well.

[Jem]

1 - I've always believed there's something up with Darkstar. No way GRRM spent so much time describing him, and Doran described him as "the most dangerous man in all of Dorne" if he's just a passing minor character.

I sometimes think that GRRM was indulging in some low-brow, trashy, pulp-fantasy when he came up with some of his Dornish characters. Characters like Darkstar and Lady Nym are these gorgeous, badass paper cut-outs who sound like they were inspired by the illustrations on the front cover of a romance novel.

The funny thing with Darkstar is that GRRM made him this brooding, handsome fellow and all of us girls go 'hello!', but then he just turns out to be a sulky little whiny boy. Lady Nym, however, remains every nerd boy's fantasy girl. Sexy, deadly, oh yeah!

[James Arryn]

I don't see it, but I sympathize with any effort to make him or Edric more relevant.

[CrypticWeirwood]

I sometimes think that GRRM was indulging in some low-brow, trashy, pulp-fantasy when he came up with some of his Dornish characters. Characters like Darkstar and Lady Nym are these gorgeous, badass paper cut-outs who sound like they were inspired by the illustrations on the front cover of a romance novel.

Make that superhero comic, and you’d be a lot closer to the truth.

[chris999]

I dont really think that this theory works out, but I am waiting for some more twins somewhere.

Every fantasy has the twins separated at birth... and we do need another head of the dragon.