Mafia 75 -- Revolution in Vanillaville

[House Westerling]

What on earth do you think i'm doing? :P

Well, reading fresh posts instead of older ones? :)

[House Pommingham]

I'm trying to catch up on the thread Starting at the begining (and keeping an eye out here) but if we don't have that long left if there are any cases it would be helpful to me if someone could point out where they are so I can read them first.

The thread isn't too long, so I'd suggest you better make your own reread.

[House Dalt]

Ok, I'm back. Thoughts:

I went to bed thinking about the hider role, and its best use, because I'm a dork that way. It was the first thing on my mind and the first thing I posted about in the time I had to get on the board this morning.

I came back a few hours later, saw that things were still going slowly, and thought I'd put down a vote on Fossoway to try to get some more contribution out of him before I left for work.

That sums up my feelings pretty well. I would call you reasonable, but that's the kiss of death in mafia. :P

General thoughts:

- Not really liking the cases against either Reed or Bolton. In my eyes, Reed has been taking the case on him very personally, which I don't usually see FMs do. Bolton is the opposite extreme - too nonchalant. In his case I'd expect him to be more engaged or more defensive if evil.

- Because of my thinking on Reed and Bolton, I'm a little suspicious of Tarth Estermont and Fossoway. I feel like Reed and Bolton are too easy targets and I'm wary of mobs forming on them.

- I'm having trouble getting a read on Ashford. Ashford, care to share your thoughts on someone besides Estermont?

- I'd love if Connington and Frey would post more.

I'm not sure about who to vote for right now, so I'll leave my vote for the moment. I'll be around a lot tonight, looking forward to hearing what all of you think.

[edit]Said Tarth when I meant Estermont, fixed it.

The highlighted sentence seems weird to me. It's not like either case is that strong, and they've both been defending themselves reasonably competently. That makes it feel like a statement that's designed to sound conscientious.

In addition, the sentiment that Player A has made a weak case on Player B, and is therefore suspicious seems disingenous at best. It creates an artificial division of the players based on their opinions of the case in question, as opposed to encouraging players to generate fresh content with new viewpoints and cases.

Vote Vance

[House Pommingham]

Since it doesn't look like we'd get an extension at all, I'll put my vote on

Ashford

instead of Connington. Just to keep things moving. I hope the next day is going to end at a convenient time.

[House Pommingham]

The highlighted sentence seems weird to me. It's not like either case is that strong, and they've both been defending themselves reasonably competently. That makes it feel like a statement that's designed to sound conscientious.

In addition, the sentiment that Player A has made a weak case on Player B, and is therefore suspicious seems disingenous at best. It creates an artificial division of the players based on their opinions of the case in question, as opposed to encouraging players to generate fresh content with new viewpoints and cases.

Vote Vance

I noticed the same and I'm still waiting for an answer by Vance.

[House Connington]

Why do you ask, Reed?

Of course, they won't include a suiciding role into ten-players game.

That's serious vote, by the way. Since nobody is interested in playing House Westerling vanilla game, we may go strightly to looking for our evils as well.

Interest in the game mechanics is not suspicious, nor is trying to get the game going (even if I think the case is wrong). I like Westerling and Reed.

I don't know if I'd go that far. A suicide role is a lot riskier in a 10 person game, but it could still exist. If I'm doing my math right, it's ok to have a suicide role in a smaller, even-numbered game. Because it's an even numbered game, we have one person we can lose without reducing the amount of days we have to find the FM. If we have a hider and he or she screws up, that makes it a little harder for us to win by reducing the number of innocents, but does not lower the number of days we have. I'll write out the numbers if you want.

If we do have a hider, I hope he or she also notes the diminishing returns on the role. Each day the hider will have a smaller chance of not hitting an FM or the FM's target. I'd recommend only using their ability on night 1, CI'ing whoever their target is if they're alive on day 2, and ignoring their ability after that. Best way to use that role IMO.

/math!

But then there's this. I think it's a bit much. Lots of typing, certainly, but not especially helpful. So I looked more closely at Vance.

Sometimes I wonder if people vote Targ as an easy way to not have to take a stand.

Your thoughts on that, Fossoway?

Attacks someone for an obvious joke vote. Silly.

The idea is to make a vote that will get people to react, even if my not-really-a-case sucks. More communication is always better.

It's day 1 and I have nothing to go on from most players. Maybe this will get some more thoughts from Fossoway. It already got a new post out of you.

And yeah, you already know my thinking on your suspicion on Reed. I don't think wondering about a role is the same thing as fishing for a role. And frankly I don't suspect you very much because I don't expect an FM to be so aggressive this early.

The case didn't just suck, i've got nothing against weak day 1 cases. But we were still in the joke phase, it was an obvious joke, and exactly what sort of different reaction were you expecting from a killer? It's nonsensical.

General thoughts:

- Not really liking the cases against either Reed or Bolton. In my eyes, Reed has been taking the case on him very personally, which I don't usually see FMs do. Bolton is the opposite extreme - too nonchalant. In his case I'd expect him to be more engaged or more defensive if evil.

- Because of my thinking on Reed and Bolton, I'm a little suspicious of Tarth Estermont and Fossoway. I feel like Reed and Bolton are too easy targets and I'm wary of mobs forming on them.

- I'm having trouble getting a read on Ashford. Ashford, care to share your thoughts on someone besides Estermont?

- I'd love if Connington and Frey would post more.

I'm not sure about who to vote for right now, so I'll leave my vote for the moment. I'll be around a lot tonight, looking forward to hearing what all of you think.

[edit]Said Tarth when I meant Estermont, fixed it.

But it's this post that's the major problem. This post is horrible. "Not really liking" cases. "A little suspicious" of Tarth, Estermont and Fossoway. Qualifying words I don't like on day 1, it removes any pressure you're trying to put on. There's no pressure on any of them from this, particularly since Vance included three people in the little suspicion. Having trouble with Ashford - Is that suspicion or not? :unsure: Wants the non-contributors to post more - Who doesn't? Does that really add anything?

It's a lot of words of nothing.

Vance

[House Connington]

Crossposted with Fossoway.

[House Dalt]

Right, my lunchbreak is done. I'll be available to change my vote if necessary, but I won't be able to participate in discussion.

As it stands, Ashford, Connington and Frey need to provide more content. I'm voting for Vance because of a perceived inconsistency, but if these guys don't produce anything of note before the deadline, I'd be happy to switch to any of them. There's no room for deadweight in such a small game.

EDIT: Xpost with Tarth and Connington.

[House Westerling]

I noticed the same and I'm still waiting for an answer by Vance.

Then, consider voting him instead of Ashford.

[House Pommingham]

Then, consider voting him instead of Ashford.

I am considering. What about you?

[House Pommingham]

So either I'm going to vote Vance now and make his lynch almost a foregone conclusion or I stay with Ashford to offer another option.

Less discussion with a likely lynch or more discussion with possibly no lynch. :dunno:

[House Westerling]

I am considering. What about you?

I am equally happy with lynching Reed or Vance. I'll switch, but no need to rush, I'll be here until dusk.

[House Connington]

Bolton has two votes, thus, Bolton is my next read.

I don't know about that. When I read the role description I pretty much took it as meaning that if they hit a FM they'd die. I didn't even consider the fact that we're playing in a small game. In other words I think it's just a simple question. Perhaps youWesterling are the one suspicious for trying to over-analyze what the perfect innocent reaction to the role description would be, no? :P

Certainly, Westerling overanalyses things, but I disagree that it's particularly suspicious at that stage. However, I do like the generally adversarial tone of Bolton's post.

Agreed.

Early day one tone tends to be tit-for-tat, why are you so forgiving of Westerling, Reed?

And then Bolton pushes it again, good stuff.

Not really, no.

Lots of silly back-and-forth between what's the proper way for an innocent to react in such-and-such situation --guilty of it myself-- that I have my doubts will actually get us anywhere.

If that's what we're basing evidence on at this stage, I still say Westerling over-thought Reed's question on the 'hider' role.

And I like this as well. Blunt and annoying.

Bolton's other posts are of a similar nature. I wouldn't want to vote for Bolton today.

[House Pommingham]

I have to go now. I leave my vote on Ashford for a completly egoistic reason: in a small game like this I prefer to keep those who keep talking to increase my fun of the game.

[House Connington]

Oh yeah, i'll be around until nightfall too. It'd be nice if the timer was updated (grumble grumble bloody kids get off my lawn grumble grumble).

[House Westerling]

So either I'm going to vote Vance now and make his lynch almost a foregone conclusion or I stay with Ashford to offer another option.

Well, Bolton still is another option. I suppose he has two votes, same as Ashford.

[House Targaryen]

It is day 1.

10 players remain: Estermont, Tarth, Connington, Frey, Westerling, Fossoway, Ashford, Reed, Vance, Bolton.

6 votes are needed for a conviction or 5 to go to night.

2 votes for Ashford (Estermont, Tarth)

2 votes for Vance (Fossoway, Connington)

1 vote for Westerling (Bolton.)

1 vote for Fossoway (Vance)

1 vote for Reed (Westerling)

1 vote for Bolton (Reed)

2 players have not voted: Frey, Ashford.

[House Frey]

ok general thoughtsa of a quick read.

Westerling - Reed case. Read asking for role clarification. Dunno about you but if I was Evil I would have normally ask questions like this via PM to Targ. Yes this could be WIFOM and not every plays evil the same way. So I see the case as a non-tell and so was Reeds response. I am also not worried about Westerling making such a case so early in the game he just wanted to move the game out of the joking RP stage a little earlier than normal. My impression of Westerling is that he is trying to help, and I have good vibes about Reed.

I kind of got the impression Bolton was being a little defensive at times in the earlier game pages. I've felt better about him in latter posts but something is bugging me.

Estermont - Ashford

I have been confused in many games before, and I don't belive anyone would feel pressured into writing something from Bolton's one liner. Ashford gave us his quick impression without checking carefully. Yes he got the facts wrong Which I don't find an innocent or evil thing) and overstated what was there. At most Reed poked his tougne out with the !!!!! post and htere wasn't any biting. (+ timing may have been in the wrong order)

I don't mind the mistake so much, but I am concerned about the lack of other points on other things or the lack of a Sorry I made a mistake post.

I think other people had some issuses with Estermont but I really could not see what they where. I like Estermoint. I also like Fossaway (for Day one)

and I did have a good feeling about Vance - although I have just read Connys case which means casts him (vance) in a different light, I need to think about this.

However right at this moment I think Ashford is the better option.

[House Westerling]

Ok, now we have alternative, which is always good.

Vance.

[House Targaryen]

It is day 1.

10 players remain: Estermont, Tarth, Connington, Frey, Westerling, Fossoway, Ashford, Reed, Vance, Bolton.

6 votes are needed for a conviction or 5 to go to night.

3 votes for Ashford (Estermont, Tarth, Frey)

3 votes for Vance (Fossoway, Connington, Westerling)

1 vote for Westerling (Bolton)

1 vote for Fossoway (Vance)

1 vote for Bolton (Reed)

1 player has not voted: Ashford