Wikileaks

[Sariel]

I'd be very interested to see what kind of legal basis they would find for prosecuting Wikileaks. A company neither based in nor run by an American citizen.

[Guest Raidne]

Been there, done that. Espionage Act. As I said, I think it's a loser, but that would be the basis. The mire he says about wanting to thwart the U.S. in particular, the better the case gets.

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

you're the kind of dick who keeps going when the condom breaks, aren't you pal?

No pun intended, I assume?

Been there, done that. Espionage Act. As I said, I think it's a loser, but that would be the basis. The mire he says about wanting to thwart the U.S. in particular, the better the case gets.

I agree with you here. It's just that it presents a somewhat interesting approach if a real spy wanted to try it. Get secrets that damage your enemy, post them claiming your motives are journalistic, then claim immunity.

[Guest Raidne]

Intentional pun

[Cantabile]

Oh I think he probably did it, he probably just didn't realize that it's rape to keep going when the condom breaks in Sweden. I mean, kudos to Sweden, IMO, but god knows I've been violated a couple of times if that's how it is. He's very likely guilty, IMHO. Fits with what we know of his character, also. Seriously, listen to him and you're like...you're the kind of dick who keeps going when the condom breaks, aren't you pal?

How can one possibly make assumptions about not only someone's character, but their sex life, off of what little they glimpse of the person through media? That's incredibly judgmental. No one can know for certain what occurred, except the parties involved, but the rape allegations seem incredibly fishy, and there's a lot more in favor of them being nonsense than in then being true. "Well, he seems like the type of guy that would have sex after the condom breaks," is about the only shred of reasoning there is so far for him having done it. Which isn't much.

[Quoth]

I'd be very interested to see what kind of legal basis they would find for prosecuting Wikileaks. A company neither based in nor run by an American citizen.

Yeah. I was wondering about this too. How is jurisdiction obtained...?

[Sariel]

No pun intended, I assume?

I agree with you here. It's just that it presents a somewhat interesting approach if a real spy wanted to try it. Get secrets that damage your enemy, post them claiming your motives are journalistic, then claim immunity.

By the logic that you seem to employ in thread to classify Wikileaks as criminal, any investigating journalist is much worse as they not only publish secret information obtained from sources within the government they also seek the sources out in order to obtain it.

[zollo]

Anyone have any statistics on how many Interpol warrants are actually put out there on an annual basis for people who have been accused of sexual assault? I am having a hard time finding any but I might be looking in the wrong places.

"Fugitive" status isn't clear to me either - he wasn't barred from leaving Sweden and once in the UK, British police allegedly knew where he was residing (apparently due to Assange having been in touch upon entering the country).

[Sariel]

I've never heard of it before and there have been cases of much more violent rape where the alleged rapist fled the country without any following involvement from interpol. Or so I've been told at any rate.

[Lord O' Bones]

Wait, wait, wait, Are you guys seriously trying to tell me that Interpol is real?!

[VarysTheSpider]

It's just that it presents a somewhat interesting approach if a real spy wanted to try it. Get secrets that damage your enemy, post them claiming your motives are journalistic, then claim immunity.

I'm no James Bond, but that seems quite eccentric behaviour. What benefit is there to the spy, who gives himself away, or to the organisation he works for, by providing the information to everyone?

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

By the logic that you seem to employ in thread to classify Wikileaks as criminal, any investigating journalist is much worse as they not only publish secret information obtained from sources within the government they also seek the sources out in order to obtain it.

Where did I classify Wikileaks as criminal? I simply tossed out the concept of spies potentially being able to use journalistic license to disseminate valuable information and damage their nation's enemies.

Let's say that there was no Wikileaks, and instead of Assange, we have an Iranian intelligence agent who solicits and obtains confidential material from someone like the U.S. soldier at issue here. After obtaining the information, he does a data dump like wikileaks did. Would that change anyone's POV on whether U.S. allies would be right to freeze assets, etc.?

I think that's an interesting question because I could see the lines between a guy like Assange and a guy like that Iranian intelligence agent getting pretty blurry.

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

I'm no James Bond, but that seems quite eccentric behaviour. What benefit is there to the spy, who gives himself away, or to the organisation he works for, by providing the information to everyone?

Because the publication of the information may be damaging to the targeted nation.

[tzanth]

I have to say, I'm a bit amazed by the near universal criticism of wikileaks in the US media. Even traditionally left leaning places, like huff post, have peen pretty harsh on Assange. The reactions seem totally out of touch with most people who I've talked to about it, who are either indifferent or somewhat supportive.

[Guest Raidne]

Cantabile - Actually the evidence used to substantiate the warrant is probably the shred of reasoning that really matters. I'm also saying that the allegations are, IMO, plausible on the face of it, which stands against a preliminary finding of malicious lying on the part of the accusers.

Sariel - No, not really. The test is what the *intent* is - to spread information or to screw with the United States.

[Happy Ent]

There is no way satire will ever catch up with reality. Brilliant!

[gladius]

I'm sure Assange will receive the Nobel Peace Prize.

[Cantabile]

I'm sure "...unless it's in our own country" is in microscopic fine print at the bottom :P

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

I have to say, I'm a bit amazed by the near universal criticism of wikileaks in the US media. Even traditionally left leaning places, like huff post, have peen pretty harsh on Assange. The reactions seem totally out of touch with most people who I've talked to about it, who are either indifferent or somewhat supportive.

I'd explain it like this: a lot of people agree that more openness is a good thing in general. However, a great many people also would agree that putting everything into the open is not a good idea. So what Assange gains from the conceptual virtue of more openness, he loses by publicizing information that does no conceivable public good, and likely does some harm.

[Sariel]

no conceivable good? You can perhaps say that about the strategic places leak, but apart from that you'd argue that the cable leak produced no conceivable good?

That's a pretty bold statement.