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spikebrennan

Opportunities to cast non-white actors

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The Myrish are described as 'olive-skinned', which is a term vague enough to cover Spanish, North African, Persian, Semitic, North Indian, and Indonesian people amongst others. So they have licence to be creative when casting Thoros and Taena Merryweather. I imagine Areo Hotah looks similar.

How about George Harris for Thoros. (He recently played Kingsley Shacklebolt in the Harry Potter series. And he is British.)

GH

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That's not really how he's described but I guess he could do it. Although tbh I don't think we need British actors for the non-Westerosi roles (AFAIC the whole show could have been done with US accents).

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That's not really how he's described but I guess he could do it. Although tbh I don't think we need British actors for the non-Westerosi roles (AFAIC the whole show could have been done with US accents).

I think it's a union thing. They have to cast British wherever they can.

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I don't see why every major Westeros family has to stay white. It probably makes more sense for each family to follow a typical coloring scheme, but there can be non-white families amongst the nobility. I can't think of a single logical reason why someone like Brienne could not come from a dark-skinned or Asian family. We already know that Dorne in the books has a Latin flavor so clearly GRRM didn't intend for Westeros to be lily-white.

I think Davos is a good example of a role that can be cast color-blind. There are loads of non-white people in the UK, so racism or blind obedience to the books are the most likely reasons for refusing to consider non-white actors unless written as such. Screw that. Bring on the variety.

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I don't see why every major Westeros family has to stay white. It probably makes more sense for each family to follow a typical coloring scheme, but there can be non-white families amongst the nobility. I can't think of a single logical reason why someone like Brienne could not come from a dark-skinned or Asian family. We already know that Dorne in the books has a Latin flavor so clearly GRRM didn't intend for Westeros to be lily-white.

I think Davos is a good example of a role that can be cast color-blind. There are loads of non-white people in the UK, so racism or blind obedience to the books are the most likely reasons for refusing to consider non-white actors unless written as such. Screw that. Bring on the variety.

Because Brienne is blonde? It makes sense for a nation like Westeros to be relatively ethnically homogeneous - and exceptions like Dorne are specifically noted and explained in back-story. No Westeros characters are described as being non-white except the Dornish to some extent. If they change that for a character like Davos because the best actor who auditioned was non-white, or because a non-white actor would help viewers keep characters distinct I would have no problem with it, but equally I don't think racial diversity should be persued for its own sake. I would much rather the casting people don't really care about race as we think of it at all, and therefore just cast characters who look plausibly like how they're described in the books - maybe this is 'blind obedience to the books' but I won't apologise for that. The producers have to change lots of things when adapting the story for television; I don't think race of characters is one of them.

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Answering "Because Brienne is blonde?" is the perfect example of blind, pointless obedience to the books. It serves no plot device to be picky about Brienne's coloring .Some of the characters (like the Lannister/Baratheon intermarrying/coloring plot issue) are dictated to be a certain look, and that makes sense, but Brienne's hair and skin color is irrelevant. I just don't understand the desire to keep Westeros completely light-skinned Caucasian. They should cast the best actor for a part, regardless of skin color. If they're white, so be it. If they're not, roll with it.

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It serves no plot device to be picky about Brienne's coloring .Some of the characters (like the Lannister/Baratheon intermarrying/coloring plot issue) are dictated to be a certain look, and that makes sense, but Brienne's hair and skin color is irrelevant.

I think it would be strange if one of the few non-white characters in GoT was portrayed as a freak like Brienne. :) It might confuse her story also. Is she been badly treated because she wants to be a knight or because of the colour of her skin?

OTOH, Davos could work. And i'd agree that they could easily put in more variety. Although, if they don't, I wouldn't call it racism.

I think it's a union thing. They have to cast British wherever they can.

I imagine any EU actor should be fine. But language will give British and Irish actors the advantage.

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Answering "Because Brienne is blonde?" is the perfect example of blind, pointless obedience to the books. It serves no plot device to be picky about Brienne's coloring .Some of the characters (like the Lannister/Baratheon intermarrying/coloring plot issue) are dictated to be a certain look, and that makes sense, but Brienne's hair and skin color is irrelevant. I just don't understand the desire to keep Westeros completely light-skinned Caucasian. They should cast the best actor for a part, regardless of skin color. If they're white, so be it. If they're not, roll with it.

Well, as I said, I make no apology for wanting the series to remain as close as possible to the books. I just don't understand the desire for racial diversity for its own sake - if there's a good reason to change it from the book, or if it's not specified in the book, fine, but otherwise I don't see what's so wrong with wanting the portrayal on screen to be as close as possible to what one has imagined - they could change all sorts of minor details in the series like making Riverrun made out of granite rather than sandstone or something. it wouldn't be a big deal, but I don't see what's wrong with wanting them to roll with what's in the book unless there's a good reason to change it.

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Am I alone in imagining Belwas as a walking, talking, sword-wielding Buddha?

I picture him more as middle-eastern. There was a professional wrestler called Abdullah the Butcher. That's how I imagine him.

GH

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I picture him more as middle-eastern. There was a professional wrestler called Abdullah the Butcher. That's how I imagine him.

GH

I think I just discovered the proper use for the word side-boob, or possibly arm-pit boob? That guy seems more floppy fat though, I see Belwas as fat but at least solid. Either way, I'm gonna have trouble sleeping tonight =)

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Am I alone in imagining Belwas as a walking, talking, sword-wielding Buddha?

Yes sort of like that, though harsher and bearded sort of him combined with that shitty caricature of the guard from Aladdin. (FYI that's not the Buddha, this is the usual depiction of the original Buddha that's Budai the "laughing Buddha". Though some consider Budai to have obtained the status of Buddha)

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Yes sort of like that, though harsher and bearded sort of him combined with that shitty caricature of the guard from Aladdin. (FYI that's not the Buddha, this is the usual depiction of the original Buddha that's Budai the "laughing Buddha". Though some consider Budai to have obtained the status of Buddha)

I noticed when I googled it, hence the included link =)

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People from Westeros should be white imo. There are plenty of opportunities to cast non-white actors. But casting people from Westeros as non white would seem like they are doing it just for the sake casting non-whites.

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since westeros has a vaguely medieval european setting it would annoy me to see people being cast just for the sake of :grouphug: and the general rule of modern TV entertainment that everybody should be represented.

we will get very cool ethnic/ non white characters anyway (summer islanders sam is on the hip with, the east, danaerys' menagerie of sellswords, oberyns sandsnakes, and so on.) so why force them into the series just for the sake of them being there in season one?

if we follow this way of racial roles to its stereotypical (and mostly slightly racist) end we end up with a black medieval jester /fool type of character who raps the bear and the maiden fair. or imagine patchface saying "hey yo I've been to tha deeps and seen mermaids, yo!" :stunned:

not that this will hapen with HBO (99% sure ;) ) , but it could be an outcome in the entertainment industry. :stillsick:

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since westeros has a vaguely medieval european setting it would annoy me to see people being cast just for the sake of :grouphug: and the general rule of modern TV entertainment that everybody should be represented.

we will get very cool ethnic/ non white characters anyway (summer islanders sam is on the hip with, the east, danaerys' menagerie of sellswords, oberyns sandsnakes, and so on.) so why force them into the series just for the sake of them being there in season one?

if we follow this way of racial roles to its stereotypical (and mostly slightly racist) end we end up with a black medieval jester /fool type of character who raps the bear and the maiden fair. or imagine patchface saying "hey yo I've been to tha deeps and seen mermaids, yo!" :stunned:

not that this will hapen with HBO (99% sure ;) ) , but it could be an outcome in the entertainment industry. :stillsick:

But isn't Patchface from one of the Free Cities? (Volantis) If so, that would mean that he is not from Westeros, and is more likely to be cast with a minority actor.

Same with Thoros of Myr.

Where is Vargo Hoat from? Qohor? That would make him and his band of Bloody Mummers more likely to be cast with minority actors.

Varys, if they had chosen a minority actor over Conleth Hill, that would have been fine.

I think it would be great to have these roles cast with minority actors. And the same with Dorne, as I envision it as having a moorish/middle-eastern feel to it.

But most of Westeros is based on Anglo-Europeans, and their description confirms this, so they should be cast in this light.

GH

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in case you missed my point: i was just trying to emphasize where some "forced" casting could lead (in a weird universe where another network would be doing thrones). i was not making any point considering one of the jesters/fools. I was merely exaggerating the bad possibilities of a stereotype casting which i vaguely connected with Patchface. ;)

reeeaaally nasty example: the thug-o-bot-twins in transformers II (ok they were officially autobots, but you get my point...)

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it wouldn't be a big deal, but I don't see what's wrong with wanting them to roll with what's in the book unless there's a good reason to change it.

GRRM did comment on this himself recently. His point was that he writes very descriptively but that doesn't mean he thinks much of his description is in any way vital to the story. Its just the way he writes. If he wrote a page one day perhaps a city would be made of granite but he happened to write it the day before, when sandstone crossed his mind.

His point is that changing background stuff is no big deal. Since he was involved in TV before, that probably helps his viewpoint. There are a lot of creative people involved in a production and if one dictates to them every little detail then things would lack inspiration. And somethings that work on the page just don't work on TV. Spending time trying to make them work would be wasteful.

Without making radical changes, the cast was always going to be generally white but there are plenty interactions with other continents, so a few characters could be non-white. But in GoT, most of those actors/extras probably ended up in Dany's storyline.

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People from Westeros should be white imo. There are plenty of opportunities to cast non-white actors. But casting people from Westeros as non white would seem like they are doing it just for the sake casting non-whites.

Because non-whites in a European-ish medieval setting is inherently unrealistic?

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