Goodkind XLVIII

[MattL86]

Yeah, Chainfire's not terribly action packed. There is the scene where Cara and Nikki discuss which of them would make Richard more happy as his wife, and they both decide he would like Nikki better and then try to force him into the relationship, or some such crap. The details are getting hazy, it's been a while.

Here's the order of books from worst to least...worst, at least IMO:

1. Confessor (not even a contest)

2. Pillars of Creation (due to mind raping boredom)

3. Faith of the Fallen

4. Soul of the Fire

5. Naked Empire

6. Temple of the Winds

7. Phantom

8. Stone of Tears

9. Blood of the Fold

10. Chainfire

11. Wizard's First Rule (some of the more hilarious moments, but it's the lowest on sermons and the only semi-legitimate novel structure. It's readable to a very small extent).

EDIT: Never read Lo9, but I imagine it fits in somewhere in the middle. No way it cracks the top five. If it does it's one special book.

[Jaxom 1974]

When I was looking up the release date for The Omen Machine, various places were referring to it as TG's "grand comeback" or somesuch, which leads me to believe that Law of Nines has been erased from the pages of history. Or maybe it never really happened at all and Tormund made the whole thing up?

I'm telling you, Law of Nines is going to get absorbed into the whole pantheon of SoT novels. It's not a seperate entity, it's going to have major impacts on all future things Tairy writes where in Rich and Klan are present...

You heard it here first. :P

[MinDonner]

Are you suggesting that... Jax Amnell might have some connection to Kahlan? :o It's a bold theory, I admit, but stranger things have happened. No-one would ever see it coming!

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Where's the love for Stone of Tears? I mean, it has everything, and it's one of the most original books ever written.

Rand Richard gets captured by the Aes Sedai Sisters of Light who take him to the White Tower Palace of the Prophets to learn how to channel make his thing rise on command (no more pesky embarrassing moments) while Egwene/Elaine/Nynaeve/Aviendha Kahlan goes off and discovers that Trollocs renegade D'Harans have sacked Caemlyn Ebinissia for no apparent reason. Along the way, Rand Richard discovers that he is the Dragon Reborn Bringer of Death, who will naturally either save the world or destroy it (it's an oft-misunderstood prophecy). Oh, and he also becomes a blademaster blademaster in a remarkably short period of time.

I know some of you think that the Yeard ganked his plot, characters, names, and concepts from Robert Jordan, but let me assure you that he has never sullied His Divine Bookshelf with any blasphemous fantasy novels that might not fully noble-ize the human spirit. Also, it's complete coincidence that the Stone of Tears has a SLIGHTLY similar name to Jordan's Stone of Tear. And completely coincidental that both are apparently essential elements for the protagonist's success.

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

When I was looking up the release date for The Omen Machine, various places were referring to it as TG's "grand comeback" or somesuch, which leads me to believe that Law of Nines has been erased from the pages of history. Or maybe it never really happened at all and Tormund made the whole thing up?

No one is actually going to go read it to check now are they? :leer:

Yeah, Chainfire's not terribly action packed. There is the scene where Cara and Nikki discuss which of them would make Richard more happy as his wife, and they both decide he would like Nikki better and then try to force him into the relationship, or some such crap. The details are getting hazy, it's been a while.

Here's the order of books from worst to least...worst, at least IMO:

1. Confessor (not even a contest)

2. Pillars of Creation (due to mind raping boredom)

3. Faith of the Fallen

4. Soul of the Fire

5. Naked Empire

6. Temple of the Winds

7. Phantom

8. Stone of Tears

9. Blood of the Fold

10. Chainfire

11. Wizard's First Rule (some of the more hilarious moments, but it's the lowest on sermons and the only semi-legitimate novel structure. It's readable to a very small extent).

EDIT: Never read Lo9, but I imagine it fits in somewhere in the middle. No way it cracks the top five. If it does it's one special book.

I've read all of them except Confessor. I would put Lo9 at #3 on that list. Honestly. The huge gaping hole in the plot alone is enough to put it in the top 5.

[SkynJay]

1. Confessor (not even a contest)

2. Pillars of Creation (due to mind raping boredom)

3. Faith of the Fallen

4. Soul of the Fire

5. Naked Empire

6. Temple of the Winds

7. Phantom

8. Stone of Tears

9. Blood of the Fold

10. Chainfire

11. Wizard's First Rule (some of the more hilarious moments, but it's the lowest on sermons and the only semi-legitimate novel structure. It's readable to a very small extent).

Hmm. I'll bite. With reasoning

1. Confessor (not even a contest) Agreed. I've said it before, but if I read a series to the end, i want an ending.

2. Pillars of Creation (due to mind raping boredom) Is this not the novel of the Noble Goat? Must rank higher for that.

3. Faith of the Fallen - Strangely, I didn't hate this book as much. I Nicci is one of his better characters. Hated the politicking, hated the "proxy rape" through the bond, but ill rank it higher than others.

4. Soul of the Fire - Blah. My second least favorite.

5. Naked Empire - Is this the one with the Slide? I thought the slide would be cool, not just a bird possessor. And tasting a way to an antidote? AND the biggest Dues ex Machina in the whole series outside of the ending? HEY LOOK! It's Zedd! Will put this in the bottom three.

6. Temple of the Winds - Now this is a book that went nowhere. 3rd wife and all that, chick getting murdered, after her genius plan to win our glorious hero by screwing her brother failed. More sex in the temple. Damn. Now i got 4 books in my bottom 3. How the hell did that happen?

7. Phantom- One of the better books, id say second in my mind. I am one of the few who liked the crazy football subplot.

8. Stone of Tears- Never read Jordan, so this was an ok second novel for me, not knowing of the ripoff factor.

9. Blood of the Fold- Not horrible either. Ya, naked Khalan was silly, but still one of the better.

10. Chainfire- Just slow to me.

11. Wizard's First Rule- Read it. Went meh. Read it again once my sister had all the novels(think chainfire was the last released when i started). Then read on through the rest of the series. Wish I had better recomendations earlier, and i would have skipped it, but at least I have the right to mock with the best of them now. :cheers:

[Grack21]

Where's the love for Stone of Tears? I mean, it has everything, and it's one of the most original books ever written.

Rand Richard gets captured by the Aes Sedai Sisters of Light who take him to the White Tower Palace of the Prophets to learn how to channel make his thing rise on command (no more pesky embarrassing moments) while Egwene/Elaine/Nynaeve/Aviendha Kahlan goes off and discovers that Trollocs renegade D'Harans have sacked Caemlyn Ebinissia for no apparent reason. Along the way, Rand Richard discovers that he is the Dragon Reborn Bringer of Death, who will naturally either save the world or destroy it (it's an oft-misunderstood prophecy). Oh, and he also becomes a blademaster blademaster in a remarkably short period of time.

I know some of you think that the Yeard ganked his plot, characters, names, and concepts from Robert Jordan, but let me assure you that he has never sullied His Divine Bookshelf with any blasphemous fantasy novels that might not fully noble-ize the human spirit. Also, it's complete coincidence that the Stone of Tears has a SLIGHTLY similar name to Jordan's Stone of Tear. And completely coincidental that both are apparently essential elements for the protagonist's success.

Oh my god. THIS. A thousand times this. Plus another thousand. Times a million. When I first read SoT when it first came out I was wondering when the lawsuits were gonna begin.

[sologdin]

must admit that WFR was the best of the bunch. i appreciated how the numinous object quest (about a box of some sort, aye?) was accomplished halfway through, and then the protagonist gets abducted by leatherclad rape-spies, who then become his toadies. (did i recall that correctly? it has been many years.)

it's all handled ineptly, 'course, and the eponymous rule is philistine. was expecting something a bit more nuanced and reasoned, maybe with some maths in it, even, instead of an elitist platitude. barf. the freudian egomachia is not credible. ricardo's acquistion of his various helpers is just plain silly, not just the rape-spies, but also the red flying gorilla-thing that talks like sloth from the goonies, the bags! sorcerer guy, the (WTF) "mud" people (seriously?), puff the magic dragon, even his girlfriend. goodness, it's just dreadful--and it's the best of the bunch.

[Foreverlad]

hmm... I think my list is a bit odd-man out.

1. Pillars of Creation - FotF was the most "important" book in the series. How does Tairy move forward? By ditching the main cast entirely and focusing on two bastard children espousing the strawmanity and virtue of their competing philosophies

2. Naked Empire - Coming after Pillars, we're stuck with a fucking goat, the surviving bastard sister, death to the vegan lifestyle, and Goodkind/Dick at their most righteous.

3. Confessor - The baddie of 10 books practically dies off-screen as all the lead-up to his destruction happens in summary. After a long and involved career, Deus Ex Machina retires and puts Dick in charge of the universe.

4. Blood of the Fold - I can barely remember this one. Dick is king, faces off against porkchop seduction, random sisters of the dark (I think?) and I believe we get the nipple examinations in this one.

5. Soul of the Fire - STDs, Bill & Hillary Clinton, why democracy sucks, and a fucking sonic horn. On the plus side, Klan is nearly beaten to death.

6. Temple of the Winds - Evil stepbrother, female orgasms used as a diagnosis tool, spine ripping, Daddy's ghost, and The Art of Sucking A Cock Covered in Your Own Menstrual Blood (there's gotta be a euphemism for that)

7 & 8. Chainfire & Phantom - I get these two mixed up. Dick and Klan have been separated, Dick starts preaching A = A and starts speaking magical mumbo-jumbo that sounds eerily like advanced mathematics. All the left-behind characters start reappearing.

9. Faith of the Fallen - Tairy's most important novel, marking him as the Glenn Beck of his time. Though there's tons of poorly designed drama, I credit Tairy for at least trying to rip off Ayn Rand properly.

10. Wizard's First Rule - Pretty stupid novel, simplistic, middle of the road fantasy free from the absolutes later plaguing the series. Content wise, pretty full, though hints of Tairy's perversions can be spotted.

11.Stone of Tears - absolute Jordan rip-off, which is why the novel mostly succeeds. Stubborn dick goes to school to learn 'bout his magic. Bestiality, live-flaying, Gratch, potential racism and some low-level worldbuilding make appearances. Again, mostly free of the crazy tyrannical shit that makes Dick a dick.

[manmiles]

then the protagonist gets abducted by leatherclad rape-spies,

Damn! Just as I was about to escape, I get dragged back in!

[Jerec]

The Blood of the Fold were very Children of the Light inspired. But at least in Goodkind's series, they're never mentioned again after Book 3 (I remember they were referenced in passing in book 2). Jordan's Children of the Light just hang around for the whole series causing problems.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

The Blood of the Fold were very Children of the Light inspired. But at least in Goodkind's series, they're never mentioned again after Book 3 (I remember they were referenced in passing in book 2). Jordan's Children of the Light just hang around for the whole series causing problems.

My favorite part of this is that there were literally hundreds of thousands of them, all in Aydindril, and then Dick just has them all slaughtered. IIRC, they try to surrender and his men show no mercy.

Oh and then there are those weird knife dudes who apparently used to be wizards but traded AWESOME COSMIC POWER for the ability to ... well, fight with weird knives. Anywho, despite the sheer weight of numbers and the fact that the D'Harans are, of necessity, stretched thin to surround them (I wonder how big a mass of 100,000 men actually is? An acre? 3.8 acres? Who knows?), the BotF and their buddies make absolutely no attempt to break out. They just kinda sit there and die.

Then again, that's nothing compared to the field army of 7 million the Order has by book 8 or so...

[MinDonner]

Also, it's complete coincidence that the Stone of Tears has a SLIGHTLY similar name to Jordan's Stone of Tear. And completely coincidental that both are apparently essential elements for the protagonist's success.

No, no, no. Tairy's Stone of Tears is not even so much as a plot coupon, it's the equivalent of drawing a Nike swash (with crayon) on the cheapo knockoff trainers you're trying to sell, in the hopes that it will fool the less observant punters. I reckon the conversation with the publishers went like this:

Tairy: Here's book 2, I've called it "Wizard's Second Rule".

Publishers: Hm. I don't think the Jordan similarities are quite obvious enough. Let's call it "Stone of Tears", can you stick a stone of tears in there somewhere? Say it's a magic stone that gets its magic taken away if a wizard cries on it.

Tairy: Bah! When I'm more famouser you won't be able to tell me what to do, death-choosers!

Final plot: Zedd finds SoT, cries on it. Rachel takes SoT somewhere to get it out of the way of the plot. Richard has the same adventure as before (involving a completely different stone. Zedd remembers that crying on the stone makes it useless anyway. The End.

[Jussi]

My favorite part of this is that there were literally hundreds of thousands of them, all in Aydindril, and then Dick just has them all slaughtered. IIRC, they try to surrender and his men show no mercy.

Actually Richard did accept their surrender. Kahlan wanted to kill them all.

Why do I remember this...

[theMountainGoat]

How is Soul of the Fire not higher up people's lists? Its got the chicken-that-is-not-a-chicken in it FFS!

But then I guess you can't have a top 3 worst books which actually comprises 11 books. Perhaps if there was some way to bend space-time there would be a way to fit them all in together?

[Alytha]

In terms of involuntary hilarity, which is the best book to choose?

[SkynJay]

In terms of involuntary hilarity, which is the best book to choose?

Temple of the Winds if you have sick, sick humor. The every popular menstruation blow job, justification on how a man has 3 wifes and why it matters, a chick trying to get a man by banging his brother....

[sologdin]

top 3 worst books which actually comprises 11 books. Perhaps if there was some way to bend space-time there would be a way to fit them all in together?

well, in string theory, IIRC, spacetime is actually 26 dimenstions curled up in a little ball, with only 4 obvious to our senses. so i think that the tairy has managed to unravel one of the central mysteries of the universe by cramming 11 horrible books into the Top Three Worst Books Ever Written list.

[theMountainGoat]

If that theory is correct this could mean that Tairy will write 78 craptastic books to fill the top 3 spots in all 26 dimensions. 12 down, 66 to go. Oh the horror! :uhoh:

[MattL86]

9. Faith of the Fallen - Tairy's most important novel, marking him as the Glenn Beck of his time. Though there's tons of poorly designed drama, I credit Tairy for at least trying to rip off Ayn Rand properly.

Yeah excet for the whole statue plot where richard carves himself into a hunk of marble and he is so beautiful it inspires people to weep and be free.

Don't forget the part where the supposedly good characters fall asleep to the screams of someone being tortured to feel better about losing their friend.