Jump to content

The Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon Thread, Part X


Angalin

Recommended Posts

Aren't we all sure Jon is Lyanna and Rhaegar's offspring? Who isn't, go home. Discussion is over.

Blasphemy!!! This discussion will go on until Martin himself answers the question... on second thought, some people will probably still argue after that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Blasphemy!!! This discussion will go on until Martin himself answers the question... on second thought, some people will probably still argue after that.

:agree:

this discussion will go on forever.

i hope we'll find out the truth in ADWD

i know, it's unlikely, but im still hoping...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find it interesting that no one, and I mean no one, calls Jon Eddard's bastard son in the trailers and behind the scenes for the series. GRRM, Kit, and the producers say that he's 'living in his household' and that he's a bastard, but suspiciously avoid saying that Eddard Stark is his father. Even when discussing Robb, GRRM says that they're 'as close as brothers', and not that they are brothers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:agree:

this discussion will go on forever.

i hope we'll find out the truth in ADWD

i know, it's unlikely, but im still hoping...

Perhaps not forever, I think Martin will reveal Jon's parentage in Dragons, at the very least at the end as a epilogue even if it isn't revealed to Jon himself. Beyond the truth or falsehood of R+L=J Jon's origins are an major point that has yet to be fleshed out. If they are going to play a major part in the story I think they have to at least start to be resolved by the end of Dragons. As we only have three books left it would seem that in order to develop the story of R+L=J would need at least two novels to develop, from Jon learning his origins, possibly while still on the wall or fleeing as the onslaught of others come and the possible blowing of the Horn of Winter (by Mel?).

Jon will have to fight his way south and eventually meet up with Daney who will be busy at some point with her invasion/return to Westeros.

An idea that has intrigued me lately is what is in The Jade Compendium Aemon left for Jon to read? Could this have some clues as to who Jon is and what he has to do?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

An idea that has intrigued me lately is what is in The Jade Compendium Aemon left for Jon to read? Could this have some clues as to who Jon is and what he has to do?

I'm intrigued, but i don't think the book is related to jon's parentage

I find it interesting that no one, and I mean no one, calls Jon Eddard's bastard son in the trailers and behind the scenes for the series. GRRM, Kit, and the producers say that he's 'living in his household' and that he's a bastard, but suspiciously avoid saying that Eddard Stark is his father. Even when discussing Robb, GRRM says that they're 'as close as brothers', and not that they are brothers.

well, what else could them say?

Let's assume that jon is not ned's. Then, he can't just call jon "ned's son" because he is not, but he can't say the truth either,

Then, let's say that Jon is actually ned's son...Well, GRRM can't call jon "ned's son". that would be a massive spoiler and a lame way to reveal us "the great secret".

(If anyone here has read WOT, this would be like the long-waited revelation of asmodean's killer listed in the freaking glossary.)

So, i think that what GRRM sais means nothing

Link to comment
Share on other sites

well, what else could them say?

Let's assume that jon is not ned's. Then, he can't just call jon "ned's son" because he is not, but he can't say the truth either,

Then, let's say that Jon is actually ned's son...Well, GRRM can't call jon "ned's son". that would be a massive spoiler and a lame way to reveal us "the great secret".

So, i think that what GRRM sais means nothing

No, it doesn't. Because, as far as we know, there was never any question about Jon's father in the books. So, if GRRM had said that Jon is Ned's son and it was true - that wouldn't be spoiler at all. But that would be a lie he can't afford to tell his fans, if Jon isn't Ned's son.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, it doesn't. Because, as far as we know, there was never any question about Jon's father in the books. So, if GRRM had said that Jon is Ned's son and it was true - that wouldn't be spoiler at all. But that would be a lie he can't afford to tell his fans, if Jon isn't Ned's son.

Yes, it does :D

assume that jon is ned' son. What do you do if GRRM just tell us in a GOT behind the scenes? Really, I'd be pissed. SO, even if jon is ned's, GRRM can't tell us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, it does :D

assume that jon is ned' son. What do you do if GRRM just tell us in a GOT behind the scenes? Really, I'd be pissed. SO, even if jon is ned's, GRRM can't tell us.

But the identity of Jon's father is never questioned in the books to begin with. The mystery is supposedly who his mother is, and not who his father is. So if there's no mystery or question about the fact that Jon's father is Eddard Stark, then GRRM wouldn't have to avoid spoiling anything, simply because there's nothing to be spoilt - we learn that in the first chapter of the first book.

And I honestly doubt that GRRM wouldn't have just dispelled a theory, no matter how popular among fans, that is completely without ground and will never become an issue in the story.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But the identity of Jon's father is never questioned in the books to begin with. The mystery is supposedly who his mother is, and not who his father is. So if there's no mystery or question about the fact that Jon's father is Eddard Stark, then GRRM wouldn't have to avoid spoiling anything, simply because there's nothing to be spoilt - we learn that in the first chapter of the first book.

Jon's father identity is questioned, not in the books but it's the main topic among the fans

GRRM doesn't read the fan theories, but he surely knows that a (very) large part of the fanbase suspect that jon is not ned's son.

It's like if you say that in the books nobody thinks about coldhands being benjen so, if this theory is not true, GRRM can just come up saying that benjen dies in AGOT, his body is never found and he is no longer part of the story. He wouldn't spoil anything but, come on, it would be really lame

And I honestly doubt that GRRM wouldn't have just dispelled a theory, no matter how popular among fans, that is completely without ground and will never become an issue in the story.

So are you basically saying that whenever GRRM doesn't answer to a question means that question will become an issue of the story? Are you idea how many Prince(s) That Was/Were Promised would be around?

just an example..if aegon is ned dayne, then the sam theory is without groud. But if aegon is sam, then the ned theory is without ground. Following your logic, Aegon would be something like 4 different people at the same thime :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find it interesting that no one, and I mean no one, calls Jon Eddard's bastard son in the trailers and behind the scenes for the series. GRRM, Kit, and the producers say that he's 'living in his household' and that he's a bastard, but suspiciously avoid saying that Eddard Stark is his father. Even when discussing Robb, GRRM says that they're 'as close as brothers', and not that they are brothers.

I noticed this, too and was grinning to myself. BUT in one or 2 of the newer bits that HBO has just released, Kit DOES say that he plays Ned's bastard son. I was so surprised that it really jumped out at me. So - now what????? End of all the theories that his father is not Ned? Or was this just a slip-up on Kit's part.....??

Sorry I can't remember which clip....there are so many! I'll try to watch them again today and find the exact clip. Sigh. How awful to have to watch them all _again_..... :laugh:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I noticed this, too and was grinning to myself. BUT in one or 2 of the newer bits that HBO has just released, Kit DOES say that he plays Ned's bastard son.

I remember this too... he probably said it because jon believes to be ned's son :crossfinger:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember this too... he probably said it because jon believes to be ned's son :crossfinger:

*crossed-fingers* is right. I SO want GRRM to put a rabbit outta the hat and fool all of us with an un-thought-of shocker regarding Jon. But, these fans are SO sharp that it's probably not likely.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jon's father identity is questioned, not in the books but it's the main topic among the fans

GRRM doesn't read the fan theories, but he surely knows that a (very) large part of the fanbase suspect that jon is not ned's son.

It's like if you say that in the books nobody thinks about coldhands being benjen so, if this theory is not true, GRRM can just come up saying that benjen dies in AGOT, his body is never found and he is no longer part of the story. He wouldn't spoil anything but, come on, it would be really lame

So are you basically saying that whenever GRRM doesn't answer to a question means that question will become an issue of the story? Are you idea how many Prince(s) That Was/Were Promised would be around?

just an example..if aegon is ned dayne, then the sam theory is without groud. But if aegon is sam, then the ned theory is without ground. Following your logic, Aegon would be something like 4 different people at the same thime :D

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Imagine you're GRRM and you're writing this amazing story that fans obsess over. You're constantly asked questions about it and your goal is to answer them without giving out what you're planning, and also without lying. Then imagine that a large portion of your fans - for some inexplicable and completely ridiculous reason - have decided to question something you've told them in the very first chapter of the story. Their theory is completely wrong. Not only is it wrong, but it won't ever become an issue in the story, it will never play an important part. Basically, it's not equivalent to 'who killed Asmodean?' but to 'What if Rand is not the son of Tigraine Mantear but the son of Suan Sanche?'. It's simply absurd. What will you do?

I think that any author will just dispel such a theory - it's just not something that fans should lose time discussing. If Jon is indeed Eddard's son and that will never, ever be questioned in the future books, then I don't see why GRRM wouldn't just tell us.

@mimi - Well, I clearly haven't noticed it. Still, it's Kit, not the author or the producers who know what'll happen. ^_^

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Imagine you're GRRM and you're writing this amazing story that fans obsess over. You're constantly asked questions about it and your goal is to answer them without giving out what you're planning, and also without lying. Then imagine that a large portion of your fans - for some inexplicable and completely ridiculous reason - have decided to question something you've told them in the very first chapter of the story. Their theory is completely wrong. Not only is it wrong, but it won't ever become an issue in the story, it will never play an important part. Basically, it's not equivalent to 'who killed Asmodean?' but to 'What if Rand is not the son of Tigraine Mantear but the son of Suan Sanche?'. It's simply absurd. What will you do?

I don't know what i'd do. I could even keep playing with the fans .. there are many clearly crazy theories out there, but GRRM is not saying they are false.

@mimi - Well, I clearly haven't noticed it. Still, it's Kit, not the author or the producers who know what'll happen. ^_^

:hope:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Comcast On-Demand

-Tier-

Top Picks:

Game of Thrones:

The Houses:

Stark:

Jon Snow: 2 minutes

KIT says (speaking of Jon Snow) "......He's a by-product of Ned's infidelity......"

___________________________________________________

Top Picks:

Game of Thrones:

Inside the Game:

About Stark: 9 minutes

SEAN BEAN says "...Catelyn knows that I had a son with someone else...."

Now, I can see that Kit's statement might not mean much because Jon himself believes he is Ned's son. But the statement by Sean Bean is hard to ignore.....unless he is trying to throw us off on purpose. :stunned:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think that the cast of AGOT knows about the future development of the plot (except for the books already published). Martin can't allow too many people to know the future developments of ASOIAF.

The TV show promos also say that Ned is the main character, that Viserys Targaryen is more important than Daenerys and other stuff like that. :rolleyes:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Top Picks:

Game of Thrones:

Inside the Game:

About Stark: 9 minutes

SEAN BEAN says "...Catelyn knows that I had a son with someone else...."

Now, I can see that Kit's statement might not mean much because Jon himself believes he is Ned's son. But the statement by Sean Bean is hard to ignore.....unless he is trying to throw us off on purpose. :stunned:

IMHO this statement by SB is less worrying than kit's sentence. As far as cat knows, jon is ned's son.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMHO this statement by SB is less worrying than kit's sentence. As far as cat knows, jon is ned's son.

Mark Hamill did not know that Vader's big reveal was "No, Luke. I am your father" until The Empire Strikes Back had its premier. The line David Prowse said on set was, "No, Luke. Ben killed your father." Actors don't always know the story. They know the script, which tells them enough to get on with in the present, but not all the future twists of the plot. If we don't know the circumstances of Jon Snow's birth, there is no reason to suppose the actors would know any better. So far, they have only seen a script for A Game of Thrones.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mark Hamill did not know that Vader's big reveal was "No, Luke. I am your father" until The Empire Strikes Back had its premier. The line David Prowse said on set was, "No, Luke. Ben killed your father." Actors don't always know the story. They know the script, which tells them enough to get on with in the present, but not all the future twists of the plot. If we don't know the circumstances of Jon Snow's birth, there is no reason to suppose the actors would know any better. So far, they have only seen a script for A Game of Thrones.

.. i suppose you are right. :)

Out Topic (starwars fan mode on) really? i didn't know that

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...