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Xray the Enforcer

[BOOK SPOILERS] EP101 Discussion, Mark II

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Despite how big he is, I didn't notice Hodor standing by Bran when Robb arrived. No wonder Theon and Jon are so petulant, Hodor is in the front row! :P

Hodor actually is in the second row. He's just so big that he appears to be in the front row when we see it from the front but you see he's in the second from other angles.

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Ok so i've been reading the boards forever but never post, so i figure im still new to the forums. I want so badly to enjoy the show more than I did. Not to say that it was bad by any means, but i feel .......underwhelmed by many moments that in my head were much more grand. The finding of the the pups for one was much less dynamic than I had hoped (no brotherly love between Robb and Jon in the race that led to them, no fear on the faces of the men at arms that accompanied them). Another part that left me somewhat flat was the heavily veiled violence of Viserys. To be honest I don't even know if I would have known how violent "waking the dragon" is supposed to be if i had not read the books first, where as in the books he's a bully right off the bat. Bran's fall was also somewhat less grand than I had hoped.

That being said I know these complaints would be none existant if I hadn't had read these scenes multiple times and imagined them in my own way. I doubt viewers unfamiliar with the books would notice these things. Alot was great. Robert was fantastic (even though I feel Ned was too close in height). Joff didn't have a line and I already can't wait to see the bastard choke. Arya was great. I really hope I can let go of my preconceptions and enjoy the show as a stand alone interpretation as the series progresses.

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Another thing that I loved about the first episode was the clear camaraderie of Ned and Robert. I know it was there in the book, but I really felt it in the show. The small look that Ned gives Robert after the 'you got fat' line was awesome. The needling he gives for the spear is another nice touch. There was this weight of warmth and familiarity that they did so very nicely. And the look Cersei gives Robert when he visits Lyanna's tomb....great.

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Seen it.

The Hound is wrong. He's not as burned and nasty looking as I imagined. His helmet looks a bit silly too. My dad even chuckled at it.

Sansa- thought she'd been aged up, was wondering how her plot would work with the pretty young adult she looks to be (sure I remember reading the actress was like...18 or so), turns out...she says she's 13. Ah. So its Westeros 90210 then.

One big dissapointing thing is that I know not too much will happen north of the wall now, that bit was awesome though.

Pentos was undewhelming. The whole thing there just...felt so very made for TV. Which it is but...yeah. Was expecting it to look grander.

Nude Dani was...nice. Hot.

I think a lot of people watching it are going to be very dissapointed after the initial battley lead in its going to be all politics with no others to be seen.

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(sure I remember reading the actress was like...18 or so), turns out...she says she's 13.

The actress is 14, I believe, just tall.

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Seen it.

The Hound is wrong. He's not as burned and nasty looking as I imagined. His helmet looks a bit silly too. My dad even chuckled at it.

Sansa- thought she'd been aged up, was wondering how her plot would work with the pretty young adult she looks to be (sure I remember reading the actress was like...18 or so), turns out...she says she's 13. Ah. So its Westeros 90210 then.

One big dissapointing thing is that I know not too much will happen north of the wall now, that bit was awesome though.

Pentos was undewhelming. The whole thing there just...felt so very made for TV. Which it is but...yeah. Was expecting it to look grander.

Nude Dani was...nice. Hot.

I think a lot of people watching it are going to be very dissapointed after the initial battley lead in its going to be all politics with no others to be seen.

Ran just explained on the other page that the Hound shot was from the pilot and that he looks a bit different in the newer make up.

Sophie Turner who plays Sansa is 15 years old (she was 14 during filming).

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Wow, weird, Sansa really does look old for her age.

Guess I've met such girls in the real world though.

Hope the hound is improved. Searching the net for photos he just always looks underwhelming.

Oh. And the opening credits were nowhere near as awesome as this site led me to believe they would be. Why the clockwork? Its a medieval setting, not baroque.

Overall I liked it. Just...guess I was expecting the best thing ever so am a bit underwhelmed.

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I changed my tune on screen adaptation bastardisations after LOTR. There were a lot of changes there, which pissed me off quite a bit. But after listening to the director commentary on the (extended) DVDs Peter, Fran and Philippa acknowledged many of the changes and offered explanations for them which, for the purposes of movie adaptation made sense.

This.

For the time being, I'm going to assume that changes were done to simplify story lines (to the extent possible), make the story work better as a tv show and be more comprehensible to the viewers who haven't read the books. I think before anyone gets too worked up about changes from the books, we should see how things play out over multiple episodes.

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I for one thought it was better than I had expected. I can nitpick but am not going to because it is impossible to create what I see in my head while I read and what they create onto the film. For what they did, it's pretty amazing. I really have no complaints and I've read the books at least 6 time through. Great job so far. My favorite part was Arya running around with the helmet on while Robert makes his entrance into Winterfell. I can't wait for next week.

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Wow, weird, Sansa really does look old for her age.

Guess I've met such girls in the real world though.

Hope the hound is improved. Searching the net for photos he just always looks underwhelming.

Oh. And the opening credits were nowhere near as awesome as this site led me to believe they would be. Why the clockwork? Its a medieval setting, not baroque.

Overall I liked it. Just...guess I was expecting the best thing ever so am a bit underwhelmed.

The hound will be burned but he won't be extremely messed up. I assume it's better for acting if he doesn't have too much things on his face as it will make his facial impressions less vivid. We'll see how it turns out.

As for the cogwheels and so on in the opening credits I took it to be a visual representation of the political machinations that drive the story. Whether or not that's the intended idea I can't say yet but I believe there will be a featurette on the credits now that the first episode is aired.

High expectations are never good to have. At best the show will just meet your standard, at worst you'll be disappointed with something that's really good.

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I don't think I have seen this mentioned, if it was sorry. Was anyone else surprised at the way Theon spoke to Robb? I would have thought that he would talk to Jon that way but not Robb.

I thought it was pretty awesome, I was surprised they managed to cram so much in one episode.

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Treb - he isn't, he's in the second row, behind the Starks. He's just that tall.

Here I was hoping that in true Hodor style he had just wandered into the front row on his own. :)

Hope the hound is improved. Searching the net for photos he just always looks underwhelming.

I kept seeing similar complaints when the first pictures of the Hound came out. I actually had to go back and reread the description because I apparently toned down his disfigurement in my head. Which explains why I have no problem with the way he looks (if they had stuck to GRRM's description they probably could have just hired whoever did the two-face makeup/effects in the Dark Knight and told them to do that again). Also, I really liked the Hound's helmet, I thought it was kinda badass, different strokes for different folks I guess.

Count me among the people that loved the opening credits as well.

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I don't think I have seen this mentioned, if it was sorry. Was anyone else surprised at the way Theon spoke to Robb? I would have thought that he would talk to Jon that way but not Robb.

I thought it was pretty awesome, I was surprised they managed to cram so much in one episode.

I think that because they omitted certain other ass-like Theon traits that we've seen, they illustrated it in other ways, like his manner of speaking to Robb.

However, I also believe that Theon will be forced to serve Robb once Ned isn't the Lord in Winterfell.

It changes the dynamics of his ultimate betrayal, but really, the end result is the same. Theon screws the Starks over in the end.

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I admired the shot of danny's arse. The camera moved inches lower to let us have a good look. Nice work.

Other people mentioned this too in the previous thread, but I thought they had a full body shot (and kept at it for a while). Is this a HD / non-HD difference?

I wasn't fond of Maester Luwin. He always felt more fatherly and warm in the books, but he seems much colder in the first episode.

This, I agree. The other maesters (Prycelle, Aemon) seemed off in the previews as well.

lol, it must've been the angle I noticed him in. Or he just takes up two rows!

Heh, I saw the same thing too. I even thought "What the hell is Hodor doing on the first row?"

One thing that really worked for me was Cat. I did not expect that. I usually do not linger on appearances (mainly because I don't pay attention to descriptions in the books), so I didn't feel bad about any of the choices, except for Cat. Ever since the role was recast, I couldn't help but think "That's just not gonna work." But now that I've seen the episode, it feels perfect. Maybe because they reimagined Cat quite a bit and it all fits somewhow...

I was also surprised at how much I remembered from the books and how I reacted to small details. Stupid things like Stark guards bowing while Cat is walking past. I was all "Come on, these are Northmen, this would never fly up there!!!" (Now that I think about it, I have no idea whether they do this in the books or not. :laugh: But Tyrion having a semi-friendly banter with the Hound...Now that should not have hapenned!)

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I'm going to have to watch it again.

The pacing was...fine. Everything just felt a shade cartoony to me...as if caricaturing some of the characters would help establishing them faster in a shorter time frame. I don't know what to feel about this, as this is relatively on par with other dramas.

Cersei and Jaime are too sympathetic from the start. Cersei has twinges of bitchiness and Jaime has a macho contest with Ned, but more time was spent establishing their relationship with each other and Tyrion than making them villains. Which increases shock value at the big reveal, but unfortunately sets their arcs back a bit. I hope this is remedied in later episodes, though I get the feeling like they'll only become more human with each minute of added screen time.\

Viserys is the wrong kind of creepy for me. I just don't see a sleeping dragon in that guy, just a hammy actor in a bad wig. Fortunately he'll get his soon enough and then the series will be all the better.

On the other hand, I feel Sansa, Catelyn, Ned, Dany, Robert, Jon, and Tyrion were all well handled, all things considered. I'm indifferent on Bran and Arya.

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Someone in the last thread said they thought it weird that Sansa wouldn't have had her period yet at 13, which of all the nitpicks this surprised me the most. Sure, some girls get earlier than 13, but it's hardly unheard of I thought for a girl to still be 13 and not have it yet. Yeesh, some people will complain about anything.

I love the fact that my brother and his friend who have not read the books believe that Bran died. I am so looking forward to seeing their reaction to the later events. My brother didn't know about Ceresi and Jaime, though I had warned him about the Targs. He visibly recoiled and glared at me saying, "Just how much incest does this show have?!" LOL Still, despite that he seemed to enjoy it over all and both he and his friend want to see more.

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I was trying but couldnt get a look at Luwin's chain. Did anyone get a look at it?

I'm sure I kind of saw some rings hanging down when he entered the bedroom.

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Hey everyone, I'll share some thoughts too after watching the first episode last night. My initial reaction is that it was pretty good - nothing especially mindblowing, but a very good start to the series. I think that it will pick up momentum as time goes by.

Regarding the technical side, I thought that overall the quality of the production was good. I expected a little more armor on the knights - I recall the Winterfell scene where the king's party arrives and thinking that Jaime was a little too underarmored, especially in the legs. On the other hand, the Hound's helm looked a little too big and plastic for my taste, especially as the visor kind of bounced while he rode. Very minor complaints, however. The one aspect I really thought I'd see more of, was colorful costumes. Martin spends quite some time describing clothes and personal effects to cover the thematically rich landscape of Westeros in equally rich garb, and I felt that it was not addressed as much in the first episode of the series. The Winterfell feast scene especially seemed a little drab compared to the cornucopia of colors, dagged sleeves and slashed vests I had pictured when I read the books. But I suspect these minor issues will be straightened out as time progresses.

As far as the acting is concerned, I thought it was, overall, great. Some actors pleasantly surprised me with the depth they were able to reach using often limited material. Special mention to the children portraying Arya and Bran, who I also think are phenomenally suited for their respective parts.

I now come to the aspect of the series that was the most off-putting for me: The nudity. Before I am misunderstood, let me say that I am aware that some people have raised the issue, when discussing the books in particular, of whether sexual scenes might be overdone. I disagree with that sentiment. I have no quibble at all with how Martin handles sexuality in the books. In fact, I think that aspect of his writing is one (of many) that greatly contributes to the characterization and depth for which the series is justly famous.

That said, I found the overt depiction of said sexuality in the TV adaptation a little unsettling. I am struggling to describe my exact impression, as I think that nudity, if done right, is also something that contributes greatly to a movie, and I can think of some great movies that contained incredible erotic scenes. However, I did not expect the amount, or speed, with which it would be exhibited in this first episode. Perhaps the intention was to set the tone, but if so, the tone it set for me was, somehow, a little off. Was it - among other things - because, as some have commented in reviews I chanced to read online, Dany's nudity became a visual vehicle for her lack of power, which they found a bit unfitting? I can't really say. But my, for lack of a better word, art sense tingled with the kind of unpleasant tingle Highlander felt in the presence of other Immortals. I hope it goes away.

I wonder whether anyone shared those feelings.

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