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MercurialCannibal

[BOOK SPOILERS] The Book Was Better

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Direwolves scene. It did look kinda cheap. don't know why they changed the dialogue so much. i know that things change from book to movie, but when you are doing the scene anyways, why cut the "I think not Greyjoy" line, it was so revealing of the interplay between the characters.

Biggest overall gripe is how they are portaying Cat. I know they upped the ages, but this is too big a spread. Isn't she only supposed to be about 5 years older than Cersei? If they were playing her as 40 instead of 35, I'd role with it, but they have her looking 50. Totally throws Cat off. In the book she was a lovely woman from a great house, tied to the great powers of the Kingdom. She feels isolated from things up there, not lower class. In the book, she wants to have Ned go to KL, wants Sansa and Joffery. If she isn't pushing that and paying for it later, how is she interesting? Plus, while they show a little tension between Jon and Cat, they don't show any of the venom. So if it shows up later, after Bran's fall, it just becomes grieving mom, rather than something older and more subtle.

Love the Lannisters, love Ned, love the Kids.

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Sorry for the long post below. I loved the pilot, it’s an immense achievement and in some ways even improves on the books. The nuances lost in translation are unavoidable. What works on the page doesn’t always work on screen. I understand that.

But I have to say that they butchered my favorite scene from the books—and not for any very good reason either. It’s not an interior monologue, it’s not a throwaway moment. Arguably it is the most important scene in the entire series, as GRRM himself explains:

This scene is the reason that ASOIAF exists. It’s the heart of the story, the bleakness and the terror and the hope and the magic of it all. For D&D to apparently not get that is beyond disappointing. I mean, I realize they do show the Stark kids finding the direwolves. But it’s so incredibly rushed. They could have copied the scene from the book word-for-word and it would have been brilliant. Instead they cut everything meaningful to make room for less important things (the bloated 7 minute long prologue being the worst offender—the direwolf scene is only 3 minutes).

Maybe other people have a different view, I don’t know. Maybe they don’t care much for direwolves. All I can say is that when I heard of the HBO show the FIRST scene that popped into my head was this one:

It would have been astonishing and unforgettable to see these words come to life on the screen. I’m sorry to know we will probably never have the chance again.

To be honest I think that scene and the whole hour to be honest, played incrtedibly similar to the book. It's just completely unrealistic that it will be a line by line translstion. Did it not feel like Game of Thrones to you? It did to me. I thought it was close to perfect

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2). Horses must cost a helluva lot, because where they should have been there, they weren't. Particularly notable for me is the beheading scene and ride back--Ned's conversion with Bran should have happened on horseback. I'm hoping they don't skimp on them with the Dothraki--their culture is defined by horses and wide open plains. I'm afraid we won't be getting that.

Well, having a scene on horseback works much better in a book than on the screen. It would probably look a bit strange and forced and could potentially take away from the acting as well.

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they def dropped the ball on the direwolf scene. seemed like an afterthought.

Im pretty sure they didnt lay out the whole rhaegar, lyanna, rebellion thing in the crypts.

so that didnt bother me.

Irc. cat wanted ned to go south because of the letter (they got that before the king even got to winterfell right) and changed her tune after brans fall. I think this would play the whole who killed jon arryn bit much better.

all in all, i was mildly dissapointed. to cut out and change the stuff they did, and then ADD a tyrion whore scene. I like titties but cmon!

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Same here, i expected too much,so now i don`t like many things. I was hooked up to the series at direwolves scene,in book it had some sort of epicness,but on the screen it was just lame,i was really disappointed with that. And i hate Catelyn, too too old! And Theon,baaad cast!

Ok,i understand it can`t be perfect or as good as book,but some things could have been done better. On the other side,some things trilled me,for example Sean Bean,he IS my picture of Eddard.

All in all,i can be saticfied, I`ll keep on watching ofcourse.

So Catelyn is too old, but 52-year old Sean Bean as Ned is fine?

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The book is pretty much always better, but I really enjoyed this first episode. Just finished watching it a few minutes ago. I agree that the pacing was a bit clunky but that's to be expected with pilots. If I have any complaint about the aforementioned tower scene, it's that it was too short. Jaime's reaction was similar to my interpretation - what was missing was the expository dialogue in the book. But I expect they'll have gone in a different direction in the next episode to portray the same thing.

Casting was generally excellent to perfect. Lena Headley was if anything very sympathetic to start - which is how Cersei ought to begin and I'm excited to see more of her. Emilia Clarke was note perfect as Dany - and with hardly a word. To some extent there's always a letdown when your imagination gets reinterpreted on screen but she was perfect. All in all I just want to see more of everyone.

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My first reaction seeing Catelyn was that she was older than I'd pictured. But yes, Tyrion Lannister, so is Sean Bean. After the episode, Cat seemed rightly cast alongside Ed. Winterfell looks like a harsh place to live, even for the nobility, and after having five children, I can well imagine Cat looking prematurely aged.

So no, not what I pictured, but admittedly, what I'd imagined was not very realistic. I can appreciate that what the show has given us would be far closer to how it might be if the world was real.

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Just realized that my little quip about Sean Bean's age earlier might have sounded like I was criticizing the decision to have him play Ned. For the record, that wasn't the way I intended it at all. I thought Bean was a fantastic choice the minute I heard about it, and still think so after seeing the first episode. And I think Michelle Fairley complements him perfectly. Having a 20 or 30 something play Cat to Bean's Ned would've looked and felt awkward--that's the point I was trying to make.

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Dude, no it isn't. There are plenty of complaints you could make about the book, particularly with the way it starts.

Sure. If you wanted to be so wrong that you couldn't be wronger if you walked on the wrong side of the wrong street getting hit in the head with a wrong stick. The first few chapters of that book are brilliant.

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And I think Michelle Fairley complements him perfectly. Having a 20 or 30 something play Cat to Bean's Ned would've looked and felt awkward--that's the point I was trying to make.

I agree in principal that having an aged up Catelyn should be ok - but one thing that still bugs me after seeing her in the pilot (and not just in photos) is that (to me) she looks like a menopausal (or post menopausal) woman. Imho, Catelyn should still look fertile and maternal.

I'm in agreement about the direwolf scene. I really wanted to see the (hint) of magic that was in the books.

But, I'm also thrilled this show is being made - so can't wait until next week.

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I agree in principal that having an aged up Catelyn should be ok - but one thing that still bugs me after seeing her in the pilot (and not just in photos) is that (to me) she looks like a menopausal (or post menopausal) woman. Imho, Catelyn should still look fertile and maternal.

I'm in agreement about the direwolf scene. I really wanted to see the (hint) of magic that was in the books.

But, I'm also thrilled this show is being made - so can't wait until next week.

Why does she need to look like that when characters like Eddard has been aged up more than she has. The age gap between Fairley and Bean is 7 years, while it's 2-3 years in the novel. She's also less aged up than, for example, Tyrion. It seems like people aren't equally apt at judging ages on men compared to women.

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Why does she need to look like that when characters like Eddard has been aged up more than she has. The age gap between Fairley and Bean is 7 years, while it's 2-3 years in the novel. She's also less aged up than, for example, Tyrion. It seems like people aren't equally apt at judging ages on men compared to women.

I think the point people are trying to make is that Michelle Fairley (bless her heart) LOOKS older than Sean Bean, despite their chronological ages. Worse yet, she looks older than Catelyn "should." For the record, my sister (who incidentally is 46, the same age as Fairley) has this same complaint. It's her only major beef with the show vis a vis the books.

Personally I disagree - I think the two actors complement each other as a couple very well, and that Fairley is a lovely woman and very convincing as Catelyn. Everyone on the show is aged up so it makes sense.

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I didn't have a problem with any of the casting. Sansa is a little less beautiful than I imagined but the actress is growing on me after watching the episode a couple of times. She definitely sticks out from the women of Winterfell.

Gosh, little Arya is so cute! I can't get over those big eyes.

A final note - did anyone else find it amusing that Robb and Tyrion look more related than anybody because of their prominent brows?

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Regarding character appearance, I had a very definite idea of the Tully look, based on a compilation of book character descriptions, and I'm still having kind of a hard time getting past that. I think that TV Cat's physical appearance is absolutely fine, but am disappointed that Robb, Sansa and Bran don't resemble her or each other more - I realize that it's just not possible to cast that many good look-alike actors but find it a bit off putting nonetheless.

In particular, my idea of the Tullys is somewhat stocky and prone to plumpness if not active. In the books, Lysa has gone to fat, Robb is broad shouldered, and Sansa is an early physical developer, attracting men's notice at age 12. While Cat and the children who resemble her aren't fat because they have an active life, I wanted to see them all be more voluptuous/stocky.

Oh well, can't have everything.

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I really think is not possible to translate a book (a great book in this case) into film and get a final product which "keeps up to the book" for all the readers. It could keep up for an "hypothetical reader" and maybe it could get close to what creatives involved in the making of the film got out from the book but there's no way it could match the personal universes of each reader along the world.

A writer creates a castle of words which we, as readers, inhabit. We bring our own memories to this castle, we put a lot of ourselves: how we see the world, things we enjoy, our own personal feelings at the time, things we've seen, things we've lived through and then well, books we read -and how we felt through all that. My own "adaptation" of the book changed in time as my personal point of view on things changed, some characters I understand now why I just can't stand them and that understanding is helping me sorting out some things I think I'll live better if rid of.

A book is a universe, or at least it has the potential to be one and each reader will have a personal reference coding which is not just about the words and the grammar but about how we feel their flow, how sometimes one thing just pours into another making totally impossible to leave that world because while we are reading we finish forging it and doing it makes us part of a creative process which has no end. For every single reader there will be a different shade of blond for the lions, e distinct presence for Starks, a personal definition of Targs and so on because what I think is glorious red hair or and imperious look or a broad shouldered guy and that's that wonderful things books can deliver. I love some choices (Arya, Ned, Bran, Tyrion for a start) and I don't understand others because they are quite far from what I had in mind (Catelyn for a start, but Robert doesn't look a bit as I thought he would, and Cersei does not have what I would call "golden hair" but I'm sure I will live happy with it anyway.

For the others I always found descriptions of monster far more realistic and terrifying than any monster on screen, probably because the horrors I can imagine are for me a lot worse than any already cooked up monster around, so I wasn't really into a high expectations mood. I didn't get why they changed that though.

I'm just happy the series is there, and I really want to get into reading ADWD, and I have this blinding hope whispering to me that if Martin signed a contract with HBO then maybe I won't be waiting a lifetime for the next book.

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So... I am not here to complain really because I have to say I am so excited that they are doing this (and for 2 seasons no less!)

The actor who plays Benjen looks EXACTLY like I thought Eddard should look. Like...exactly. I have no problem with Bean as Ned, but that guy is PERFECT.

The girl who they got to play Arya also looks just like my head Arya.

The only complaint I really have is the Dothraki scene.....it should have been just CRAZY and mad with a hundred thousand people...but I know why they didn't do it.

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I think the point people are trying to make is that Michelle Fairley (bless her heart) LOOKS older than Sean Bean, despite their chronological ages. Worse yet, she looks older than Catelyn "should." For the record, my sister (who incidentally is 46, the same age as Fairley) has this same complaint. It's her only major beef with the show vis a vis the books.

Personally I disagree - I think the two actors complement each other as a couple very well, and that Fairley is a lovely woman and very convincing as Catelyn. Everyone on the show is aged up so it makes sense.

I call bullshite! Michelle Fairley looks like a better 46 than most women at that age in the U.S. (in our oh so modern 2011), it is known... I don't know what 46 year olds you know who look younger (other than actresses, older models, women who get work done, and the rare genetic winners), but most do not. She looks realistic, lovely, and perfect for Ned.

The characters on the show were aged up, get used to it. :rolleyes:

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A final note - did anyone else find it amusing that Robb and Tyrion look more related than anybody because of their prominent brows?

I wouldn't have noticed (but it is amusing :D). The only apparence issue I had was between Robb and Theon. I could hardly tell them appart at first... This is odd, I expected something different. I hope the others Greyjoy will have a more... hmmm... "special" look, let's say.

edit: He has a distinctive figure, for sure. But I just felt like he could pass for one of the Stark's sons to the non-readers (especially during the execution scene). Maybe it's intended, since Theon's supposed to feel alien to his kind when he goes back...

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I wouldn't have noticed (but it is amusing :D). The only apparence issue I had was between Robb and Theon. I could hardly tell them appart at first... This is odd, I expected something different. I hope the others Greyjoy will have a more... hmmm... "special" look, let's say.

That is strange. I really liked the distinct Welsh look of "Theon". As soon as I saw that guy, I knew it had to be a non-Stark, even a non-Northerner. I never imagined the Greyjoys to be "welshish", but that really lets Theon stick out - for me at least.

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Well, the books would always be the best to me, but I think that this first episode was a heroic effort that played very well.

The first time I watched it, the pace felt rushed to me and some scenes a bit underdeveloped, but in subsequent re-watchs, it got better. The episode got right more things than it did wrong, and for the most part, luckily, it got right the important stuff and dropped the ball only on minor issues.

Doesn't mean I don't have complaints - still wish they had salvaged the wedding scene between Dany and Drogo, the Prologue is a mess and the direwolves were but all but non-existant, but everything else was as good as it could have been.

I think that the show will get even better and hopefully, it will remain faithful to the books.

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