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marwyn

GRRM's new Not a Blog post

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So much to take away from this :D

It seems the returning character who's a bit worse for wear is hinted at Theon/Reek but it'd be a nice surprise to have a Cat point of view. Nothing to say about Brienne's death unfortunately as he says "several" of these characters have chapters in the next book but not her specifically.

I'm surprised no one has yet taken the article apart piece by piece and dissected it.

After lurching around this site for the longest time, I finally created an account to see if anyone else thought the "worse for wear" character could possible be Cat. What an interesting read it would be...to see the changes in her state of being, from her own P.O.V. When Thoros and Brienne are speaking in the cave, in AFFC, before the hangings, he tells Brienne how Cat travels around and never sleeps, so I imagine that if this P.O.V. did turn out to be her we would not only discover Brienne's fate, but we would also find out all the things Cat has seen throughout her travels. Oh the possibilities!!! Ok, now I'm gonna take a deep breathe and stop my hopes from getting to high.

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That's a pretty good justification for her inclusion, if only for one reason. It would solve Brienne's cliffhanger. Im not sure why giving Catelyn a POV would progress the story further though.

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I'm having trouble imagining how that would work, but I'm not clear myself on where this is all going. GRRM gave Brienne a lot of screen-time just to have her die in a Jaime chapter without much fanfare. If Brienne were to kill Jaime, then suddenly her prominence in AFFC would make more sense; but the foreshadowing suggests that Jaime and Cersei are going to die together, and I'm not sure where Brienne would fit in to that. (Maybe Brienne stumbles upon Jaime after he's strangled Cersei to death?)

In any case, I assume that Brienne's story will have larger implications than just for her and Jaime.

What foreshadowing suggests Jaime and Cersei dying together beyond their birth and Cersei's words I'm paraphrasing "not Jaime. Not with my life at stake...we will leave the world as we came into it"?

Because those words seem more an expression of desire than foreshadowing and everything we know about the prophecy suggests Cersei has to hang around until Dany reaches.

Jaime explicitly denies he wishes to kill Cersei to Ilyn Payne, albeit for fairly practical reasons.

I do agree Brienne's story will have larger implications.

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Regarding GRRM's comments:

I think the most surprising thing in the Blog post is the fact that Brienne won't have a PoV chapter in ADWD - equally he could never have revealed that she would have a chapter either, that would be a pretty massive spoiler. The cliffhanger involving Brienne has to be resolved in ADWD, I thought part of GRRM's reasoning for including the 'Feast' PoVs in 'Dance' was to resolve some of the cliffhangers from the previous book? For me that is justification that Brienne's fate will be revealed in the Jaime chapters in ADWD. It could be something as mundane as Jaime riding past Brienne's corpse?

Additionally, I can't see Jaime having any more than 2 chapters in the next novel, I'm more inclined to Cersei having 2 and Jaime having 1. The first Cersei chapter being her getting news, or the High Septon trying to get her to confess - about her resolve that Jaime will come and save her, switch to Jaime who has no intention of saving her, back to Cersei's trial.

As for the chapter composition:

Dany - will have the greatest number of PoV chapters dedicated to her, but I imagine that her PoV will be top heavy before she and Tyrion converge.

I don't know how much I am going to enjoy every second chapter being from the viewpoint of Dany, Jon or Tyrion...

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After lurching around this site for the longest time, I finally created an account to see if anyone else thought the "worse for wear" character could possible be Cat.

Very, very unlikely. We already know Theon is a POV and he fits that criteria too.

We may learn what happened to Brienne in a similar way to how we learned what happened to Sandor. And then he can bring her back in tWoW. I'd be shocked if she was dead.

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I don't know how much I am going to enjoy every second chapter being from the viewpoint of Dany, Jon or Tyrion...

Were Brienne, Cersei, and Jaime your preferred characters because they got 25 out of 46 chapters in AFFC.

Jon, Tyrion, and Dany got 29 out of 82 in ASOS but that was mostly because Dany gets only a few chapters in ASOS nad ACOK. Whenever I would get to one I would usually have to go skim the last one to remember what was going on.

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Were Brienne, Cersei, and Jaime your preferred characters because they got 25 out of 46 chapters in AFFC

No, they were my favourite characters because of the link between them. For me, Feast was about the 'triangle' between the three characters. The ending was great, where both Brienne and Cersei were brought down by the thing that is most important to them: honour and power respectively.

I was quite lucky because Feast focussed on the areas of the story that I was most invested in.

The thing that I am looking forward to is exactly what AFFC was missing: the overlapping of PoVs. Dany/Tyrion/Quentyn/Barristan/Victarion in Meereen and Jon/Mel at the Wall.

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No, they were my favourite characters because of the link between them. For me, Feast was about the 'triangle' between the three characters. The ending was great, where both Brienne and Cersei were brought down by the thing that is most important to them: honour and power respectively.

Ah ok that was what I suspected I was just checking.

Yeah just like alot of people did not like Feast because they really like Jon, Dany, and/or Tyrion you might be in that same boat in ADWD.

The thing that I am looking forward to is exactly what AFFC was missing: the overlapping of PoVs. Dany/Tyrion/Quentyn/Barristan/Victarion in Meereen and Jon/Mel at the Wall.

Ah well especially in Meereen you should get that in spades.

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He's not a previous POV character, so no. ;) Could he be a contender for the mystery POV?

Ah, right. Okay then, I'm going to say that the Hound's going to be the missing POV. :)

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Ah, right. Okay then, I'm going to say that the Hound's going to be the missing POV. :)

Again I am going to predict the missing POV is a character we have yet to meet. GRRM said there were going to be a couple of those but the only totally new one that is reasonable known is Quentyn Martell. I bet there is one more.

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After reading all the great analysis in this thread and mulling it over for the last two days, I have to reconsidered my guesses of mystery POV. Instead of either Bobba Fett or Aurra Sing, I am, now, thinking Leia Organa or maybe Ahsoka Tano.

Really hope I am proven correct when I read Dance of Dragons.

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Reflecting about this more clearly, I think there are several possibilities as to the missing POV:

1) It's somebody entirely new and not somebody we will care much about. GRRM threw it out there and has kept it mysterious to keep us entertained. If so, it's a strategy that certainly has worked. I think it's more complicated than that, however.

2) It's not Marwyn the Mage. GRRM has explained that the Meerenese knot had five POVs to resolve. Unless Tyrion never reaches Dany in ADwD, then it cannot be Marwyn, as that will add a sixth point of view to Mereen.

I think we will see Marwyn reach Mereen, but not as a POV. GRRM is not going to give us too much interior insight into being a Wizard. We already have Melisandre for that (though she may not truly be a "wizard" as such). Episode 7 of Game of Thrones also strongly hints that Samwell will ultimately be moving in that direction during the Winds of Winter. The paucity of Bran chapters in ADwD also suggests that the full-on magic fires being stoked is something GRRM wants to take a little time with. So I think Marwyn's appearance as a POV is almost completely ruled out now.

3) It's not Osha. The reason I say this is because GRRM was quite enamored with the portrayal of Osha by Natalia Tena in the TV series and specifically noted that when he returns to Osha in the books, he is inclined to make the character match Tena's portrayal on screen more closely. He didn't just add to the book since Xmas. I infer that means that Osha is not in ADwD (but will likely appear in the WoW.)

4) Lady Maege Mormont: It may be that the story of the Crannogmen needs to be told in ADwD as their attack on the Ironborn at Moat Cailin will be an important plot development. Additionally, the whole issue with Robb's will and Jon being made a Stark and King in the North must come out (though that does not require a POV to resolve). Lady Maege may be an interesting way to show the Crannogmen without going to Howland Reed, who has an internal dialog that is too spoilerish.

5) It's a character who we are told is dead, but who is not, in fact, dead. By revealing that character as a POV to us, the mere disclosure of the identity of the POV character will be a spoiler as it would confirm the character is not dead. This suggests the following possibilities:

A) Loras Tyrell: Loras is supposed to be horribly burned and at death's door. IMO, he isn't and his "injuries" have been greatly exaggerated so as to cause Cersei to discount choosing Loras as her Champion. To identify Loras as a POV would ruin this reveal.

B ) The Hound: While the survival of Sandor was heavily foreshadowed in AFFC, the outright disclosure of the Hound as a POV would give too much away. This is a possibility.

C) Lady Ashara Dayne: While it may be too early to go here, we all know she must come in, somewhere. There is no way she threw herself into the sea with her body never recovered. She lived to do something. What that something is is doubtless important. This may be the time.

D) Gerion Lannister: I cannot believe that Gerion died in the Ruins of Valyria. Whether or not he will hear a tale of Tyrion's journey across Essos and seek him out is unknown -- but Gerion being Tryion's favorite uncle (and one who had no love for Tywin and no complicity in Tysha's shaming) means Gerion is a thread that GRRM wove for a reason and left unresolved for some purpose. This may be it. I think it more likely that Tyrion will encounter Gerion and he will simply be featured in Tyrion's POV as he meets him on the way to Mereen but... we'll see.

E) Tyrek Lannister: He went missing for a reason. Why this happened remains the most inscrutable "footnote" development in the series to date. GRRM has kept the hows and why extremely unclear. Somehow, Tyrek will turn up again. Or, somebody pretending to be Tyrek Lannister will (Why hello there: are you a friend of Jaqen's?). Either way, this one is a (remote) possibility.

F) Jorah Mormont: Not dead, but he is now lost and very much unresolved. Because of the five viewpoint limit, he can't be in Mereen as a POV -- but that does not mean that Jorah can't be doing something else of interest in Essos. I think this extremely unlikely, but it's possible.

From Hirgon

G) Benjen Stark: Missing, possibly dead, but mentioned too often to not be involved somewhere. May be part of the Bran plot, possibly as Coldhands (satisfying all us crackpots). But North of the Wall is a large place, so he may also provide another northern POV. If he is a POV, revealing his name is a double spoiler, because it would essentially reveal that he is not Coldhands.

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Reflecting about this more clearly, I think there are several possibilities as to the missing POV:

G) Benjen Stark: Missing, possibly dead, but mentioned too often to not be involved somewhere. May be part of the Bran plot, possibly as Coldhands (satisfying all us crackpots). But North of the Wall is a large place, so he may also provide another northern POV. If he is a POV, revealing his name is a double spoiler, because it would essentially reveal that he is not Coldhands.

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G) Benjen Stark: Missing, possibly dead, but mentioned too often to not be involved somewhere. May be part of the Bran plot, possibly as Coldhands (satisfying all us crackpots). But North of the Wall is a large place, so he may also provide another northern POV. If he is a POV, revealing his name is a double spoiler, because it would essentially reveal that he is not Coldhands.

I don't think so. Benjen is dead. What he is now? That won't get a POV.

Coldhands' identity as Benjen is a near certainty to me. I would bet serious money on it. As I do not see GRRM ever giving us an internal dialog of the undead, and as Bran's interaction with Coldhands is as much as we really need to see of the character, I think this is extremely unlikely.

I do suppose, however, that Tormund as a POV is a possibility. I prefer to think that Jon's interaction (and ultimate rescue) of Tormund will have a great deal to do with Jon's POV and arc in ADwD. After all, if Stannis leaves Melisandre behind at the Wall, there has to be a reason for that. I believe that is because her presence on the Wall is necessary as a POV as Jon will be ultimately going north of the Wall to rescue Tormund and the wildling host from the Others.

So I think that rules out Tormund. Still, it's a possibility.

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I did think of Maege Mormont. A POV from the North that was actually, you know, from the North would be sorta nice.

But I do not think so.

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My bet, or hope, is for grown up baby Aegon or a pretender. Give Dany somebody to fight.

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4) Lady Maege Mormont: It may be that the story of the Crannogmen needs to be told in ADwD as their attack on the Ironborn at Moat Cailin will be an important plot development. Additionally, the whole issue with Robb's will and Jon being made a Stark and King in the North must come out (though that does not require a POV to resolve). Lady Maege may be an interesting way to show the Crannogmen without going to Howland Reed, who has an internal dialog that is too spoilerish.

FWIW, the same arguments apply for Ser Galbart Glover, who was travelling with Lady Mormont last we saw him. Also could be Lord Jason Mallister, who we last saw ferrying Ser Glover and Lady Mormont north.

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It's been a while since I read AFFC, but wans't there a Kettleblack going to the Wall on Cersei's behalf to kill Jon? He could make for an interesting POV. If not him, another member of the Night's Watch (Slynt, Throne) who doesn't like Jon. Would definitely be interesting seeing the Night's Watch through a non Lord Commander's eyes to see what the rest of the brothers think of their new Commander.

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It's been a while since I read AFFC, but wans't there a Kettleblack going to the Wall on Cersei's behalf to kill Jon?

Yes after Osney Kettleblack confessed to having sex with Margaery. He was going to take the Black and then kill Jon and then be pardoned by Tommen.

Unfortunately for him the High Septon decides to torture him, where he confesses to sleeping with Cersei and murdering the last High Septon, and will shortly be put to death. So that developement ruined that 'killing Jon Snow' plan.

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Again I am going to predict the missing POV is a character we have yet to meet. GRRM said there were going to be a couple of those but the only totally new one that is reasonable known is Quentyn Martell. I bet there is one more.

I'm with you. I think it'll be along the lines of Areo.

If it was someone MAJOR, I don't know that GRRM could keep himself from hinting. He loves dropping hints.

The cliffhanger involving Brienne has to be resolved in ADWD, I thought part of GRRM's reasoning for including the 'Feast' PoVs in 'Dance' was to resolve some of the cliffhangers from the previous book? For me that is justification that Brienne's fate will be revealed in the Jaime chapters in ADWD. It could be something as mundane as Jaime riding past Brienne's corpse?

I dunno, when he said cliffhangers, I thought Cersei and perhaps the events in Dorne. There are things happening in those two spots that it's hard to just skip over and go back to in Book 6.

Brienne, I always assumed if she's still alive (and if she's not then she wouldn't have a PoV regardless), it'd be something like Jaime or Arya, where their last chapter in a book (or, in Jaime's case, last chapter from Catelyn's PoV) involves their potential deaths, then the first time we see them in the next book they're strolling along thinking "Gee, remember that time...". I figured Brienne would get a PoV in Book 6 (again, if she lives) and it would start with her on her new mission, whether it's to find Sansa, kill Jaime, whatever, and she'd think back about how she yelled out whatever.

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