[ADWD SPOILERS] Tyrion 7

[Jory's Shade]

Touche. My apologies.

[Roose Boltons Bastard]

Jorah's actions are much more inscrutible to me in this chapter. I'm having a lot of trouble trying to puzzle out what he hopes to accomplish by taking Tyrion to Dany (he doesn't know about Tryion's dragon expertise or anything). My only guess is that he thinks Tyrion can give her a good inside look at the Lannisters and King's Landing for Danys' strategy but surely that can't be his whole motivation...

Tyrion's brother killed her father, his father's men raped and murdered her sister in law and killed her niece and as far as she knows, nephew. I think he would make a fine offering to the Silver Queen.

***EDIT*** Sorry, didn't see that previous post that basically said the same thing...my apologies!

[Forelver]

Loved the chapter, especially when Tyrion hears he's going to Meereen and cracks up at the craziness of it all. I can't help wondering if he and Jorah are going to end up becoming friends.

Also I liked the fact that he is worried about Young Griff, again his humanity is coming back. However I didn't like the comment about raping and murdering his sister, I wish he would give up on all the vengeance stuff.

What to me is so much fun about Tyrion is that he ends up in all these predicaments and still can crack a joke or make a witty comment.

Still waiting to hear from Arya though!

[Jennelyn]

More and more it appears that my suspicions of a slave uprising may be correct. This will be Dany's deliverance and her vision of a more just and slave-free world could come to fruition. Tyrion and Jorah will arrive with her saving grace which can't be bad. Once the battle in Meereen/Yunkai is won, she can move on to Volantis and clean up there too! Easier said than done, but I can envision it!

Tyrion does seem to genuinely care for Griff and Aegon which makes me think that his advice or "bait" was not given with ill intent. I think he was surprised to hear that he'd actually taken his advice and that Griff had gone along with it. Of course, the decision could ultimately prove to be bad advice, but it's a bold move and could be just the thing to finally pull Dany back to Westeros.

Jorah's reason for bringing Tyrion to Dany is that he hopes she will see him as a loyal servant. The gift of the brother of the man who killed her father etc. when he could have been his ticket to going home should prove that loyalty, if not his madness. She can do with them what she will. Kill them or use their service to her benefit. It makes no matter to Jorah.

[Hear Us Roar]

Tyrion is a Lannister -- you know, the house that holds the Iron Throne and is responsible for the murder of her father, the sack of KL, the believed murders of her aunt and niece and nephew. I can't possibly imagine why Jorah would want to deliver him to Dany... lol

some revenge for one

[Fryie]

Edit

Fuck it, I'm going to make a bigger point here. You know what ADWD has what AFFC fatally lacked? A real sense of anticipation. We know that loads of different plot threads are coming together and it's going to be explosive, in the same way we were anticipating all hell breaking loose in AGOT, the Battle of the Blackwater in ACOK, Joffrey's/Robb's weddings in ASOS. It actually has a carefully thought out structure to it. AFFC didn't, and Christ did it suffer for it. OK, it's "only" 350 pages in, but it already feels like Martin is back on the top of his game.

Interesting. I feel the other way around. We know that Tyrion is going to meet Dany, that Quentyn is headed towards Meereen too, etc. All that's happening in Essos is just filling material up to that point that doesn't matter much.

Yes, we knew about the Battle of the Blackwater. But that doesn't mean that in the chapters leading up to it nothing was happening. Quite the opposite: there was so much going on that you didn't keep track when the battle was really coming, and then it came onto you all of a sudden. Here it's just always like "yeh, and then we'll be in Meereen", "when we reach the Queen", "what will Daenerys do", etc. yadda yadda.

As opposed to that, there were some real big surprises in AFFC like what happened in Dorne and the Iron Islands, with Cersei and Jaime and Sam and Arya and everyone - everything was a surprise.

Here we just know that they'll end up in Meereen eventually. Aegon deciding to go to Westeros instead was the first real plot twist in the Essos story archs. (Well except the plot twist of Aegon being alive. Which I didn't like because it's just so cliche)

[Tyrionthebest]

Interesting. I feel the other way around. We know that Tyrion is going to meet Dany, that Quentyn is headed towards Meereen too, etc. All that's happening in Essos is just filling material up to that point that doesn't matter much.

Yes, we knew about the Battle of the Blackwater. But that doesn't mean that in the chapters leading up to it nothing was happening. Quite the opposite: there was so much going on that you didn't keep track when the battle was really coming, and then it came onto you all of a sudden. Here it's just always like "yeh, and then we'll be in Meereen", "when we reach the Queen", "what will Daenerys do", etc. yadda yadda.

As opposed to that, there were some real big surprises in AFFC like what happened in Dorne and the Iron Islands, with Cersei and Jaime and Sam and Arya and everyone - everything was a surprise.

Here we just know that they'll end up in Meereen eventually. Aegon deciding to go to Westeros instead was the first real plot twist in the Essos story archs. (Well except the plot twist of Aegon being alive. Which I didn't like because it's just so cliche)

How is it so cliche , genius ? It is seems all you are doing is criticise the book without posting any valid points why you are doing it .

[Joffrey]

Perhaps Jorah is delivering, what he believes to be, Dany's ticket to Westeros?

Yeah, he's doing it for love and to prove his loyalty like others have said... So what if Dany shows up in Kings Landing with Tyrion in tow and says, "okay Queen Cersei. Here's the dwarf you wanted. I'll take my lordship and castle now thankyouverymuch."

And in one shot, Dany has a castle, lordship, etc. without so much as a drop of blood (except for Tyrion's) spilled.

I don't actually expect Cersei to keep her word on that offer should Dany claim it, but Jorah? We know Cersei does only what is in her own interests, but is this common knowledge across the Narrow Sea?

Just throwing that out there.

[Joffrey]

Oooh - or better still - Jorah tells Dany, I have a guaranteed lordship in my pocket here. Let's you and I get married. We'll keep your identity secret or come up with a phony identity for you. I'll claim the lordship and we'll get all settled in our castle. AND THEN we'll announce to the world that, oh yeah, by the way, this here is Danaerys Targeryan, rightful queen.

If that plan doesn't win over just about any woman, I don't know what would.

[Fryie]

How is it so cliche , genius ? It is seems all you are doing is criticise the book without posting any valid points why you are doing it .

How am I not supplying valid points? I'm comparing it very specifically to its predecessor, AFFC (a book that so many people criticized), and say that it lacks in what that book had: good storytelling, strong characters and good writing. Of course it's still not that bad, otherwise I wouldn't read it, but yeah - seeing that I waited so long for ADWD most of it disappoints me. Reek's chapters are a formidable exception.

(The comparison is not wholly without reason, since I'm re-reading AFFC in parallel with ADWD, and I just find that the former is much more enjoyable to read, even though I already know most of what's gonna happen.)

Of course you're free to feel different.

[Jamie Fannister]

Anyone else's heart flutter for all of 5 seconds thinking Arya had somehow found Tyrion, despite all the evidence that it clearly couldn't have been her (over-lapping time etc)?

Yes, to the point I had to stop and go "nooo, not possible"!!!

[King in the Centre Bit]

Tyrion's brother killed her father, his father's men raped and murdered her sister in law and killed her niece and as far as she knows, nephew. I think he would make a fine offering to the Silver Queen.

***EDIT*** Sorry, didn't see that previous post that basically said the same thing...my apologies!

This. I'm puzzled as to why people don't think taking Tyrion to Dany is a good idea? Lets also not forget that he was the Kings Hand, he knows every nobleman in Westeros and probably most of their secrets. He's seen the Wall (and I think Dorne?). He's like a walking Whose Who? for Westeros. Oh, and when your major enemy are the rulers of Casterly Rock, having the rightful heir (as Tyrion is) on your side might come in handy if Dany manages to kill Cersei. In one fell swoop, all the gold in Casterly Rock.

[Blaer Dayle]

I loved seeing Meereen on the page, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I expected it. Jorah was too ambiguous, never explicitly stating that he was taking Tyrion to Westeros, and even mentioning he doesn't care to get a lordship.

I loved seeing the cult of R'hollor, and it strangely reminded me of the Medieval Catholic Church in Rome, Volantis itself reminded me of Medieval Rome as well.

I can already see the scene with Jorah and the whore arguing, and Tyrion in chains looking back repeatedly only to see the other dwarf slowly getting closer, and I think it will be great TV if the show ever makes it this far.

I'm glad to see Tyrion has finally decided that Casterly Rock is his by rights, and no longer is resigned to let someone else have it.

Tyrion in Volantis was great, because he was acting just like a kid in a candy store. Everything seemed so interesting to him, while the Volantenes just take it all for granted. The chapter also serves a good narrative function, in htat this world is almost as foreign to us as it is to Tyrion, and we get to see it as he first sees it, with all its wonder.

Also the line that went something like (quoting from memory) "he thought he saw Ilyrio Mopatis, but it turned out to just be one of the white dwarf elephants" was genius. I seriously had to stop reading for a minute because I was laughing so hard.

[Nymeria_Snow]

I'm just really, really enjoying this book! AFfC was alright, but it's the drama around Slaver's Bay, and the inevitable, oncoming meetings that is making it so exciting. Can't wait to see Dany's reactions, although they may irritate me!

[erolyn]

Aside from the fact that taking Tyrion to Dany (instead of claiming his lordship from Cersei) would prove Jorah's loyalty to her, is it possible he's also trying to bring her Tyrion as a potential ally?

Though he knows Tyrion has no reason to like him, what with the kidnapping and all, he does have good reasons to support Dany. She wants the Iron Throne, Cersei currently has it, and Tyrion wants to kill Cersei. What Dany needs most, at this point, are Westerosi allies. Tyrion is a Lannister, and even though he's burned a lot of bridges with his family (obviously) he still has some power, and there are probably some who would support him because he killed Tywin. (Though maybe not, since kinslaying is such a big deal.) And Tyrion does want to see Dany...though Jorah doesn't know that, at this point. But does anyone else think he knows Tyrion might help her?

On a side note...cannot wait to see Peter Dinklage and Iain Glen doing these scenes in the show. If the show ever gets this far.

[milk-of-the-poppy]

"Life's a jape. Yours, mine, everyone's".

That's why Tyrion is my favourite character.

Somebody who recognizes the Great Cosmic Joke but still gets on with it.

If only there were more of them in real life.

[Fire is coming]

Anyone else's heart flutter for all of 5 seconds thinking Arya had somehow found Tyrion, despite all the evidence that it clearly couldn't have been her (over-lapping time etc)?

I must admit that for a second I thought it may even be his daughter with some whore (or even Tysha herself - That was of course stupid, though not entirely impossible if I think about it, she could even have gotten pregnant before Tywin got her raped). Wouldn't Tyrion having a secret daughter being really cool? Imagine how proud he would be in his new role as a father! Still... wishful thinking I guess.

Oooh - or better still - Jorah tells Dany, I have a guaranteed lordship in my pocket here. Let's you and I get married. We'll keep your identity secret or come up with a phony identity for you. I'll claim the lordship and we'll get all settled in our castle. AND THEN we'll announce to the world that, oh yeah, by the way, this here is Danaerys Targeryan, rightful queen.

If that plan doesn't win over just about any woman, I don't know what would.

I don't think a plan like this would win over a woman as independent and ambitious as Dany. Coming to Westeros not "taking what is hers" but being granted a lordship by someone she thinks of as one of the Usurpers dogs surely isn't her idea of conquest. Also that would leave all of her army and dragons out of the game until she reveals her true identity... Doesn't make real sense neither strategically nor psychologically (within Dany's character). She's not the one to be waiting for some Prince Charming (sorry if I got you wrong on that one).

Also, why does everybody assume Cersei would be still ruling or even alive by the time anybody gets to Westeros? I haven't read it yet and am trying to avoid any spoilers, but I think she's going down after the whole accusing Margaery-thing and her being held up in the Sept. Don't you? NO SPOILERS PLEASE!

[Fire is coming]

Oh and by the way... where the hell is Varys? I caught myself expecting to turn up in Volantis on any corner to rescue Tyrion :D

[Kzamll]

knew this was going to happen... quite obvious! :P

[Lelouch Li Brittania]

For me the most puzzling think in the chapter was Tyrion's remark about Aegon. I do think the advice he gave Aegon was good, and when he talked about bait I just though that he thought Aegon had gone for his advice. But then he states that now he's going to Mereen while Aeron is foolishly heading east, which implied that does not want him to do that anymore. I can only assume that he gave that advice (which remain a good one) because he wanted to be with Aegon when they landed on Dorne so when Dany reached Westeros he wouldn't be seen as a enemy, but a friend, as he was an ally of her nephew. Now that he is captured and going directly to her, and Aegon is going east, nobody would be there to vouche for him as Aegon might've had, since he was with them because of Illyrio's, a friend of Dany.