[ADWD SPOILERS] Daenerys 8

[Xray the Enforcer]

pg 661

[Loras]

I find it very difficult to sympathise with Dany at any point of this chapter. She has got to the point where she has given up on Meereen, Hizdhar now rules the city through her - because she is entirely incapable of ruling herself. She has a long way to g before she should even contemplate sitting the Iron Throne.

In a book that is about accepting responsibility for your own actions, Dany is the only character who can't accept that she is doing a terrible job of ruling Meereen.

* Dany has become more and more prone to bouts of escapism. She asks Missandei at the end of the chapter to tell her about Naath and the butterflies, she clearly does not want to be in Meereen any more. In a previous chapter, Dany has sex with Daario as opposed to holding court. She doesn't want to rule, she wants to liberate and conquer and move on.

* She is convinced that Quentyn was called Frog because he wasn't handsome, she doesn't ever ask the reason. She is so self absorbed and interested only in surface beauty that she does not even consider any other option. She also judges the Yunkai armies as absurd - but they have just forced her into peace!

* Why did she take Quentyn to the dragons? She was trying to convince the Prince of Dorne to go home, but instead takes him to the dragon pit and says: "I don't want you, but look at my three dragons... oh what's that I can only ride one?"

* She seems to think that she has worked so hard for this peace agreement with the Yunkai, when she has actively worked against it for most of the book.

[Arryathecat]

I'm really starting to think the crazy genes may have been passed down to Dany too...

[sting129]

i forget, why was he called frog?

[Kirazi]

I'm really starting to think the crazy genes may have been passed down to Dany too...

Ha, yes...I see it too! The father was extremely cruel and she is extremely kind. Both make for poor leaders.

Still wondering where her arc is going. Perhaps all this was to show that she can never rule the Iron Throne by herself -- and will have us accept her other dragon heads? I dunno.

[Direwolf named bob]

I'm really starting to think the crazy genes may have been passed down to Dany too...

I'm thinking she doesn't have the crazy genes, but most of her upbringing was with a crazy person.

Don't mistake a bad ruler for a crazy person. Hell, at least she is delegating to some extent. Aerys would of had meeren as ruins by now. He would of gone with the executing one noble from each temple for every murder by the harpies for starters.

[AnotherDeadStark]

I think your analysis here is spot on Loras. I do not want Dany ruling Westeros as things stand. She's showing to be completely incompetent as a ruler.

[tzanth]

To all you haters out there, what exactly would have you had Dany do? She was in a pretty hard situation, all things considered.

[Queen Arya]

To all you haters out there, what exactly would have you had Dany do? She was in a pretty hard situation, all things considered.

if she was truly worried about her children's destiny she should have stayed in Astapor instead of fighting yunkai and meereen. she stayed in meereem, putting herself in this situation so i dont pity her at all.

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she is growing more and more pathetic and superficial, she used to be such a strong character... makes me sad :unsure:

its very clear that Dany its a conqueror not a ruler..... and that makes me think that she will conquer Westeros but will not rule... so who will? Aegon? Jon? Tyrion?

we dont know much about Aegon (if he is the real one) but Tyrion seems to be the most capable for the task. Jon is showing us that he have some skills but he underestimate his enemies and this is never a good thing.

[malarky1231]

You're right, Tyrion would be the best ruler, if he wasn't a dwarf. He's clever, brutal, yet at the same time kind. But he is still a kinslayer, and that's something people aren't going to forget. One must also take into account his state of mind, which is wrapped up in finding out what happened to Tysha and his constant drive to find someone to take her place, like Shae. He's emotionally wrecked, like Mormont was. Also he had become more cynical and cruel since his escape from KL. On top of this he had a loose tongue and easily angers others, while being a dwarf does nothing to help this. People have it in their heads that he is evil and that he killed Joffrey. Even when he successfully ran KL in his father's abscence, the people still hated him mainly bc he was a dwarf. Did I mention his tax on whores? The fact that he tries so hard and gets so little respect means that in the end, the people would never accept him as a leader. He doesn't get any credit after the battle of blackwater, although his father acknowledges his use of the chain.

Don't get me wrong, Tyrion is my favorite character, and I love his story arc. But the people of westeros/Essos despise him for the most part, and only the few who are close to him ever appreciate him, ie. Jaime and Penny. Everyone else just loves his gold and would betray him if it suited their interest. he's one of the most hated individuals in Westeros. Hell there are others worse than him that get more respect.

[Swordswench]

Jon's leadership of the Night's Watch makes for a great foil to Dany's rule in Mereen.

[Darkohaku]

Dany should give her dragons to Tyrion and Aegon, I don't see other option for her character. She has f***** dragons for gods sake, she have to use it. But no, she lost one and the other two are in a prison.

Zero character builder, I was fond of her in the past books, but now I don't know, but I hope she will get better in the end.

[The BlackWolf]

I thought the "to please this prince, I must abandon my people" line was pretty ironic- she's abandoning her principles to please Hizdahr and his mother, and is effectively deciding that the people of Meereen are her people, compared to the people of Westeros. Dany is desperate for an army, but refuses to travel to meet her Dornish troops- she just assumes they should come to her.

At this point, I'm entirely fed up with Meereen. Hoping her and Quentyn hop on the dragons and fly to Westeros soon... Barristan will find his own way eventually.

[Valmy]

I kind of like Dany's journey to wisdom in this book. Alot of people complained before that she seemed to be getting away with alot despite acting too much out of a youthful idealism. Now we see all that was just a build up to this and I am sort of excited to see how her character continues to develope. Her attempt to make peace with her enemies is obviously not a good play because she is in a position of weakness but it is hard to see what else she could have done...since, you know, her position is bad. But she is learning.

My main criticism is that the process is really dragging out. But how I ultimately feel about these chapters depends on where Dany is by the end of the book. These might turn out to be some of my favorite chapters depending on where GRRM is taking it.

I feel bad for Quentyn Martell. He is obviously a man of great courage and determination. Dany though, which is understandable given her past, has a hard time respecting a man who is not virile in a warrior sort of way.

[winteriscoming73]

I was expecting so much more from Dany's story in this book but its just not happening. At least we saw two of the dragons in this chapter but I was hoping for more story progression for her by this point in the book.

She continues to not do much of anything and I find myself wanting to skip her chapters so I can read other pov's who are actually doing something.

We'll see where she ends up but its not looking very promising to me at this point.

[Raistlan]

At least, if and when HBO gets to this point, the Dany chapters are a good opportunity to condense. :D

[JD44Irish]

To all you haters out there, what exactly would have you had Dany do? She was in a pretty hard situation, all things considered.

Her lack of scheming is very troubling. Even Cersei was trying to think about what her foes would do next, who they were allied with etc... She was very bad at it, but Dany didn't even try.

Dany, like Ned, has been putting principles (or philosophies) over pragmatism. Perhaps she is getting away from that now: her wedding Hizdar is an exception to that rule, letting the Yunaki have slaves and opening the pits are others. She is realizing that she can't have it all and compromise and cooperation and necessary to rule.

Perhaps Dany will be the final character to be redeemed in this book. As somone pointed out elsewhere, one of the major themes of this book seems to be "redemption."

[A Redeemed Hound]

At least, if and when HBO gets to this point, the Dany chapters are a good opportunity to condense. :D

Too funny. I thought the same thing. Actually, all of the characters not in Westeros can be either deleted or condensed big time. Tyrion floated down a river for half the book. Dany wandered around and nibbled on figs for most of her chapters so far. This was all to get the timeline back in order. You can tell that GRRM had a hard time with his Mereenese knot.

Maybe this is why he decided to bring in Aegon. Maybe Aegon will be the ruler and Dany just one of the heads or maybe she will just get killed or something. At this point I went from loving her story and character to kind of hoping she gets eaten by her dragons.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

I feel sorry for Quentyn, he goes all this way to get rejected. dany has a long way to go before she can rule the seven kingdoms. At the beginning of the book she was the person(out of the possible candidates) I wanted to rule the throne. but Now I think Jon and Stannis are the two best options, even though stannis isn't great himself. Dany would probably be t hird and Aegon last since he has no ruling experience.

[Malcolm Reynolds]

* Why did she take Quentyn to the dragons? She was trying to convince the Prince of Dorne to go home, but instead takes him to the dragon pit and says: "I don't want you, but look at my three dragons... oh what's that I can only ride one?"

Yes, I didn't quite get the dragon part either. Did Quentyn want to see the dragons? And why did Dany let him? And that bit about riding only one dragon... that part seemed stangely out of place. Interesting nonetheless, though, because at least we get some informations about the dragons and how they are doing. Reading about how they are chained up I can't shake the feeling that they'll turn against Dany in some way...