The Wall, the Watch and a heresy

[hotweaselsoup]

Good points Scurvy and Kissdbyfire. These are some of the reasons I don't believe this theory to the full.

One of the other reasons I don't think the Children and BR are involved with the Others is Bran's real time vision in AGoT, when he is flying over Westeros. He flies all the way to the heart of winter and sees what dwells there, and he is terrified. BR wanted him to see it, and why would he want that if the CotF and himself are part of it? I can't see any good reason for BR doing that.

Could the White Walkers have originally been the Children's ultimate weapon of mass destruction, unleashed in desperation when they were threatened by extinction by the First Men? (The Children's "dragons", if you will.) Maybe they - the Children - used a powerful sorcery to bring about these White Walkers, but they don't have full control over them (sorcery being a sword without a hilt and unsafe to grasp and all), and the White Walkers can only be held in abeyance by the wards in the Wall, and the words of the Watch? (Sorry, couldn't resist ;))

[kissdbyfire]

This theory is something to consider, and parts of it make a lot of logical sense. Still, there are many references in the text (i do not mean visions/prophesies) that distinguish the Others and Children from each other. For example:

- If the Others are the Children, why would the former be attacking Bran and his party on their way to Bloodraven instead of supporting them in their journey? The only assistance they are providing is Condhands, and even his origination is questionable.

That's how I see it as well.

- If the magic of the Wall works both ways, and was conjured to protect the Children from mankind, why are the NW and other people able to cross the Wall without consequences? Certainly, we seem to lack evidence of a WW or a Child south of the Wall.

I agree in regards to the WWs. As to the CotF, we have the Ghost of High Heart. I'm not sure, but I thought she is a CotF? Or was, and is now a ghost... What about the Green Men on the Isle of Faces? I thought they were CotF greenseers. I'm not at all sure about this, though.

- NW members are actually men, so why would the Children help building the Wall, and not help manning it? Since the Children were the ones "providing" magic component to the construction of the Wall, it would only strengthen it if the Children were present at the Wall at all times. We don't have to speculate that the Wall was built by men and the Children together, so, naturally men and the Children were allied at some point. But there is no reference that the NW and the Children ever entered into any kinds of arrangements other than those leaving the men guarding the Wall.

- The Wall has been standing for 8,000 years, and within those years has certainly grown in height. There is explanation in one of Jon's chapters (I believe) essentially saying that the constant fortification work and maintenance have been performed to the Wall, including layering it with gravy, which I believe within the scope of 8,000 would have certainly added to the height of the Wall.

Some good points. Regarding the protection provided by the Wall, I think of it as the magic protecting the south from the WWs and its height (the actual physical barrier the wall is) being a deterrent that will discourage people from going north.

- If the Children were the Others, they would have been in position to attack any time during previous cataclysms south of the Wall. Say, immediately after Redgrass Fields, or Baratheon Rebellion - which are relatively recent events from the historic perspective. Instead, we see no activity of the Others prior to the events of the series, and no evidence of the Children prior to the encounter with Bran. So, who caused what? Did the Children cause the Others, or did the Others "awaken" the Children?

Yes, again, good point. What brought on the current events? What 'woke' the WWs, why now? Is it possible they have a lifespan of hundreds of thousands of years and these types of attacks or awakenings happen in a cyclic fashion? I have no idea...

[FanTasy]

Yes, again, good point. What brought on the current events? What 'woke' the WWs, why now? Is it possible they have a lifespan of hundreds of thousands of years and these types of attacks or awakenings happen in a cyclic fashion? I have no idea...

Good thinking, I think those are the important questions. Were the white walkers just sleeping and recently aroused? Or did they migrate south from further North, out of the unmapped Land of Always Winter?

I hope Sam will find some books at the Citadel. And somebody has to get to that Isle of Faces soon! When all kinds of people were wandering to and from Harrenhal I hoped somebody would go to that isle, but alas ...

[Free Northman]

I don't think the Others and the Children are related. Instead, I think that the Others and the Dragons are related. Both of them are alien to the world.

I think the Children were the original sentient inhabitents of the planet, and that they originated on Westeros maybe a million years ago or more - I recall the children refering to a "thousand thousand" years of their existence when talking to Bran in Dance.

Men evolved in Essos, much, much later.

Magic at this time was limited to the Children's nature magic, which serves neither Ice nor Fire, but is simply linked to the endless cycle of nature itself.

Some time during the Dawn Age - after the evolution of humans on Essos, but before the migration of the First Men to Westeros, we arrive at the event referred to in legend by one of Dany's Dothraki slave girls. She tells Daenerys that Dragons are not native to this world and that originally there were two moons in the sky, one of which split open and spilled out dragon eggs, if I recall correctly.

These Dragons fell to earth and were somehow attracted to the Fourteen Fires of Valyria, where they settled and brought Fire magic into this world. We know that Dragons existed all over the world, including in Ashai and in Westeros long before the Valyrians discovered them in the Fourteen Fires. But it seems the Dragons were only able to survive in the volcanos of Valyria.

My hypothesis is that this was only one half of the story - but the only part known to men, since men were limited to observing events on Essos at the time, with only the Children inhabiting Westeros in this Dawn Age. The other half of the tale is that an opposing force to Dragons and their Fire Magic also fell to earth during this cataclysmic event. This was the magic behind the Others - represented by Ice, in the Song of Ice and Fire.

Where the Dragons settled in the Fourteen Fires of Valyria, the Others were attracted to the only land area located in the extreme polar regions of the planet - the far north of Westeros.

Only the Children observed their arrival in this early period of the Dawn Age. The Children's magic allowed them to contain this new threat in the ages before men arrived, but as men gradually weakened the Childrens magic though cutting down their weirwoods, so the magical barriers containing the Others gradually weakened.

By the time the Long Night came around, it was the first time that men experienced the threat of the Others, and hence they had to appeal to the Children to help them to combat this existential threat.

We can see from the text that magic appears to wax and wane in cycles, and as Dragons reappear, so too did the abilities of the Fire Mages and the priests of R'hlorr increase, but at the same time the Others also emerged for the first time in 8000 years.

The Childrens magic on the other hand, is not linked to this cycle. Instead, their power is linked to nature, as can be seen by Bloodraven's power which has endured for a century prior to the rebirth of dragons and the return of the Others.

So to conclude: The Dragons represent Fire, yes. And the Others represent Ice, yes. But the Children don't represent either of these two opposing forces. They are a Third Force. The original magical force native to this planet.

Both the Others and the Dragons, however, are alien to this world. I could speculate that the waxing and waning of their power relates to some orbital movement of the planet, as its orbit comes closer to that of some other celestial body, which may have been the original home of both the Dragons and the Others.

The fact that the Children are located in the North is merely due to the fact that this is the area least populated by humans. The Children's tale really is the sad one told to Bran in Dance. They are in the era of their long, slow decline, and are merely ancient observers to this eternal struggle between Ice and Fire.

They happen to oppose Ice, because it threatens nature in the North. But should Fire win, it would threaten nature in equal measure, I am sure. And in that case the Children would have been opposed to it as well. In fact, I would not be surprised if it was the Children who used their greenseer magic to eradicate Dragons from Westeros in ancient days. Because I don't see how any other native creatures could have done so, given the utter invincibility of dragons in Martin's world.

In short, Mellisandre therefore represents the "evil" force of Fire. And the Others represent the "evil" force of Ice. But the Children represent the "neutral" force of nature, which simply advocates a balance, through which all things live, die and are born again in the endless cycle of life.

[nygyg]

Alot of interesting posts but I don't think that the word "others" refers to the cof, giants ect. I'll admit that there is alot of solid reasoning for looking at it that way and could almost be won over except for one moment in AGOT.

When Dany agreed to let the maegi do her ritual to stop Drogo from dying his blood rider Qotho said "You will die maegi, but the other must die first".

At this point in the story it is pretty clear that Drogo is all but dead from his infected wound but why did his blood rider refer to him as "the other".

The maegi aslo tell Dany "Once I begin to sing no one must enter this tent. My song will Wake powers old and dark, the dead will dance here this night". Who else do we know of in the story that can harness magic and do alot of singing?

So on the other side of the world we have a man who is for the most part dead refered to as "the other". IMO the word other is used to refer to the walking dead.

[BurnedCrow]

brut, on 05 December 2011 - 12:33 PM, said:

- If the magic of the Wall works both ways, and was conjured to protect the Children from mankind, why are the NW and other people able to cross the Wall without consequences? Certainly, we seem to lack evidence of a WW or a Child south of the Wall.

The Wall is there to protect against the Others and the WWs. CotF are not the Others, and I believe the Pact made between the First Men and the CotF was in direct response to the threat of the Others. Hence, the Wall. Read Bran's last chapter in GoT, Maester Luwin makes a long speech about "Dragonglass" saying that CotF only were armed with this.

Yes, again, good point. What brought on the current events? What 'woke' the WWs, why now? Is it possible they have a lifespan of hundreds of thousands of years and these types of attacks or awakenings happen in a cyclic fashion? I have no idea...

Maybe it was brought about by the birth of some guy/girl named Azor Azhai? Its obvious also that the birth of Dany's dragons had magical effects across the Westeros and Essos (The glass candles) I would think that the birth of the PtwP caused a reaction.

[Eyron]

I never mentioned anything regarding the CotF and the Others being in the same camp, simply that they may not be the complete antithesis of each other like it seems to be. Whether or not its believed by fans, Pycelle does indeed say the Children fled, and it wasn't from the Others as we know they were fleeing from. It was men, the Andals. Hell, for all we know, they were fleeing from the Seven as their old gods were, with the burning of weirwoods and all, and followed them north. But theres not much said during those earlier stories of the CotF going against the Others on a large scale, nor does it seem there was need for a Wall til the men came. But the CotF and the Others, w/e they are, were there together on Westeros first. My point was supposed to be similar to Free Northman's, but with the added stipulation that the Wall might guard against the other gods/magic out there that was brought over. Just explained poorly and sort of holey cause I'm trying to be brief. xD

This is how at least I read it. (just a note: you do mean maester Luwin and not Pycelle right?)

I agree on that the CotF did not have to flee from the Others.

The CotF seems to have managed fine before men came, and since they knew how to defeat the Others I guess there was some kind of coexistence going on, perhaps the Others were seen as predators and the CotF had adapted to their behaviour.

Or perhaps the CotF are not warmblooded as you mentioned as a possibility, and the Others can't sense them as easily for this reason.

But I am not sure the Wall was built for the purpose of protection against the Andals since they were not in Westeros at that time. The CotF could however have known that they still needed a Wall to retreat behind (that First Men would [edit]not hold their end of the pact) and also there were other species that needed protection from men (from the First Men), the giants, mammoths, direwolves, aurochs, unicorns and many others that also were hunted and slain almost to extinction. But of course we now know that the CotF have ways of seeing past, present and future so the Wall could have been built for protection against the Andals anyway. :)

I'm going to do some more thinking and try to summarize all the reasons why I think the Wall is a protection from the south... That is the part that I agree with the OP on.

Edit: one little word lost in translation and the whole meaning gets lost...

[nygyg]

Could the White Walkers have originally been the Children's ultimate weapon of mass destruction, unleashed in desperation when they were threatened by extinction by the First Men? (The Children's "dragons", if you will.) Maybe they - the Children - used a powerful sorcery to bring about these White Walkers, but they don't have full control over them (sorcery being a sword without a hilt and unsafe to grasp and all), and the White Walkers can only be held in abeyance by the wards in the Wall, and the words of the Watch? (Sorry, couldn't resist ;))

This is for the most part how I keep seeing it. When Ygritte is crying ontop of the wall she tells Jon it is because they opened half a hundred graves and relesed all those shades (I take this to mean ghosts). During one of Jamies dreams he sees his old brothers of the KG who are now dead, in his dream they are armoured in what seemed to him as snow and he refered to them as shades.

The desciptions given in the story of the WW is very ghost like.

[kissdbyfire]

Maybe it was brought about by the birth of some guy/girl named Azor Azhai? Its obvious also that the birth of Dany's dragons had magical effects across the Westeros and Essos (The glass candles) I would think that the birth of the PtwP caused a reaction.

Hmmm which came first, the chicken or the egg? I think it's the opposite; I think the return of magic to the world is what made it possible for the dragons' eggs to hatch. I am not sure, of course... :-)

But I am not sure the Wall was built for the purpose of protection against the Andals since they were not in Westeros at that time. The CotF could however have known that they still needed a Wall to retreat behind (that First Men would [edit]not hold their end of the pact) and also there were other species that needed protection from men (from the First Men), the giants, mammoths, direwolves, aurochs, unicorns and many others that also were hunted and slain

Isn't there mention of the Wall being much lower and less imposing originally?

:-)

[Black Crow]

Not being GRRM, or related to him in any way I don't know what the answers are, but as I've said before we've thus far been presented with a quite astonishing piece of literature by any standard and whatever the eventual outcome I really can't see it coming down to something as trite as a horde of blood-freezing ice warriors coming pouring over the wall to be defeated by Dragonfire at the last moment. I expect to enjoy better (and hope to enjoy it sooner rather than later) and a large part of the fun is trying to figure out what's really going on.

I still cleave to the notion that the Others should be read literally rather than specifically and that the term actually encompasses all of the "old races" who fled northwards and took refuge behind what we know as the Wall. My contention that the Wall was built by the Children and the First Men to to protect the North rather than the South is countered by the obvious observation that it offers no hindrance to men travelling in either direction, to which I have to counter that being a magical barrier it was erected as a defence against magic not men. As@ve pointed out before if the Children helped build it as a defense against something nasty in the Ice it seems a bit strange that they left themselves on the "wrong" side of it. As to the nature of that magic it was probably, but not necessarily, dragons, but certainly whatever the original Azor Ahai was wielding.

Again a large part of my contention that the Children and the Others are synonymous is simply down to their place in the story as its being revealed to us. We start off in straightforward fashion with the Game of Thrones in Westeros, enlivened by hints of something nasty. Now, whether we've two books to go or three, we're way past the halfway point. If we were still in the original planned trilogy we've presumably had books 1 and 2, but not a sign of the Others, or at least the all conquering bogeymen. They're way too late to form a credible party; effectively they're going to be noises off, or at best they're going to rush in a couple of chapters from the end and get beaten just as quickly. Why bother? Revealing that they are the Children, and that they and Bloodraven have been with us from the beginning would provide a much more satisfactorybalance in story-telling terms.

Getting a little more specific, I've argued and continue to argue that the White Walkers are not a separate race but are conjured up (or bred up using Crasters sons and other "offerings") by the Children to do their dirty work while they remain safely below in their Darkness, which is why so far we've seen so little of them.

As to the why, I think KissedbyFire has the best idea; it was the red comet which set everything in train, bringing magic back, dragons and the determination of the Red lot to finish off the job started by AA so long ago, while north of the Wall the Others - the "old races" who cleave to the Old Gods are also gathering their strength for the last battle.

[Free Northman]

The Children's magic does not represent Ice. It represents all of nature. The Children are only located north of the Wall, because that's where the least number of men can be found. The Children were located EVERYWHERE originally, but now only a remnant of a remnant remains, beyond the Wall.

The real war here is between the Others and their Ice magic, and the Dragons and Red Priests with their Fire magic.

The Children are caught in the middle, using their own unique natural magic to defend themselves against both these alien forces.

[BurnedCrow]

Getting a little more specific, I've argued and continue to argue that the White Walkers are not a separate race but are conjured up (or bred up using Crasters sons and other "offerings") by the Children to do their dirty work while they remain safely below in their Darkness, which is why so far we've seen so little of them.

Black Crow, then why would the CotF arm themselves with dragonglass? The one thing that we know defeats the White Walkers? Possibly it could signify that was their means of controlling them, but I read it to mean they have been fighting the Others and the WWs for a looooong time.

Agree about the Red Comet being the catalyst. Good point, KissedbyFire.

[TrueLion]

This is how at least I read it. (just a note: you do mean maester Luwin and not Pycelle right?)

Heh, whoops. :D Indeed I do.

[kissdbyfire]

The Children's magic does not represent Ice. It represents all of nature. The Children are only located north of the Wall, because that's where the least number of men can be found. The Children were located EVERYWHERE originally, but now only a remnant of a remnant remains, beyond the Wall.

The real war here is between the Others and their Ice magic, and the Dragons and Red Priests with their Fire magic.

The Children are caught in the middle, using their own unique natural magic to defend themselves against both these alien forces.

Yes, I tend to see it that way too. I'm still very fuzzy on some details, though. Most of all, I agree with the notion of the CotF being not only the original inhabitants, but also the 'natural beings' here. Nature is a force that often as not is perceived as somthing a bit 'flower-power-peace-and-love' , but the truth is nature can (and will) be very 'cruel'. And I use cruel between quotation marks because I want to emphasise it's nothing to do with sadism, nor with inflicting pain/suffering/hardship for one's own pleasure or gratification. It's 'cruel' - perhaps brutal is a better word -in the sense of 'survival of the fittest', etc.

[Free Northman]

Yes, I tend to see it that way too. I'm still very fuzzy on some details, though. Most of all, I agree with the notion of the CotF being not only the original inhabitants, but also the 'natural beings' here. Nature is a force that often as not is perceived as somthing a bit 'flower-power-peace-and-love' , but the truth is nature can (and will) be very 'cruel'. And I use cruel between quotation marks because I want to emphasise it's nothing to do with sadism, nor with inflicting pain/suffering/hardship for one's own pleasure or gratification. It's 'cruel' - perhaps brutal is a better word -in the sense of 'survival of the fittest', etc.

Yes. Totally agree. That's why the Children should not be judged by human standards.

Even to the extent that they may practice cannibalism. In nature, once you die, you are simply a resource to be eaten, and any carnivore will pretty much eat its own dead and not think twice about it. Especially if as the Children, you have this mystical connection to nature, and where your spirit can live on in the weirwoods. Once your spirit has left your body, it is literally just so much meat to be eaten - whether by scavengers, beetles, ants, or by the children themselves.

[hotweaselsoup]

Not being GRRM, or related to him in any way I don't know what the answers are, but as I've said before we've thus far been presented with a quite astonishing piece of literature by any standard and whatever the eventual outcome I really can't see it coming down to something as trite as a horde of blood-freezing ice warriors coming pouring over the wall to be defeated by Dragonfire at the last moment. I expect to enjoy better (and hope to enjoy it sooner rather than later) and a large part of the fun is trying to figure out what's really going on.

I still cleave to the notion that the Others should be read literally rather than specifically and that the term actually encompasses all of the "old races" who fled northwards and took refuge behind what we know as the Wall. My contention that the Wall was built by the Children and the First Men to to protect the North rather than the South is countered by the obvious observation that it offers no hindrance to men travelling in either direction, to which I have to counter that being a magical barrier it was erected as a defence against magic not men. As@ve pointed out before if the Children helped build it as a defense against something nasty in the Ice it seems a bit strange that they left themselves on the "wrong" side of it. As to the nature of that magic it was probably, but not necessarily, dragons, but certainly whatever the original Azor Ahai was wielding.

Again a large part of my contention that the Children and the Others are synonymous is simply down to their place in the story as its being revealed to us. We start off in straightforward fashion with the Game of Thrones in Westeros, enlivened by hints of something nasty. Now, whether we've two books to go or three, we're way past the halfway point. If we were still in the original planned trilogy we've presumably had books 1 and 2, but not a sign of the Others, or at least the all conquering bogeymen. They're way too late to form a credible party; effectively they're going to be noises off, or at best they're going to rush in a couple of chapters from the end and get beaten just as quickly. Why bother? Revealing that they are the Children, and that they and Bloodraven have been with us from the beginning would provide a much more satisfactorybalance in story-telling terms.

Getting a little more specific, I've argued and continue to argue that the White Walkers are not a separate race but are conjured up (or bred up using Crasters sons and other "offerings") by the Children to do their dirty work while they remain safely below in their Darkness, which is why so far we've seen so little of them.

As to the why, I think KissedbyFire has the best idea; it was the red comet which set everything in train, bringing magic back, dragons and the determination of the Red lot to finish off the job started by AA so long ago, while north of the Wall the Others - the "old races" who cleave to the Old Gods are also gathering their strength for the last battle.

I agree with much of your post, except the last bit about the red comet being the catalyst that began everything. My understanding is that the White Walkers have been on the move for quite a while, as we are told that Mance Rayder began his attempts to unify the wildlings a long time ago, in fact "had spent years assembling this vast plodding host." I always assumed that Mance undertook this unification of the wildlings in response to the growing threat from the White Walkers, and my best guess as to when he began is something like 5-10 years ago. Bran was born around this time, so maybe that had something to do with the White Walkers re-emergence?

The red comet, I believe, was put in the story to illustrate a point: a sign or portent can have multiple interpretations, all of which might be true. The Red Sword, Mormont's Torch, the Bleeding Star, Joffrey's Comet, - every faction had a name for the comet, and an interpretation of what the comet's appearance meant. And every one of those names and interpretations could be said to have been true: the comet did herald the dragons coming, it did coincide with Joffrey's ascension to the throne, it did light Mormont's way through the haunted forest, it was the harbinger of war. I think the red comet was GRRM's hint that the Azor Ahai prophesy might play out in the same way.

[kissdbyfire]

Yes. Totally agree. That's why the Children should not be judged by human standards.

Even to the extent that they may practice cannibalism. In nature, once you die, you are simply a resource to be eaten, and any carnivore will pretty much eat its own dead and not think twice about it. Especially if as the Children, you have this mystical connection to nature, and where your spirit can live on in the weirwoods. Once your spirit has left your body, it is literally just so much meat to be eaten - whether by scavengers, beetles, ants, or by the children themselves.

Spot on. I'm a vegetarian myself. But if I were to be in a situation where the choice was 'eat your dead father or die', I'd eat daddy without batting an eyelash; it's not only survival instinct, but a good recycling policy, so to speak.

And since we have 'heresy' on the topic, I'm going to say something totally outrageous... Does anyone else see a... hmmm I'll use 'similarity'. So, does anyone see any similarity between the CotF and those blue people from the movie "Avatar"? I don't even like this, I hated that movie.

There, I've said it. Feel free to stone me to death now. :-)

[Free Northman]

Spot on. I'm a vegetarian myself. But if I were to be in a situation where the choice was 'eat your dead father or die', I'd eat daddy without batting an eyelash; it's not only survival instinct, but a good recycling policy, so to speak.

And since we have 'heresy' on the topic, I'm going to say something totally outrageous... Does anyone else see a... hmmm I'll use 'similarity'. So, does anyone see any similarity between the CotF and those blue people from the movie "Avatar"? I don't even like this, I hated that movie.

There, I've said it. Feel free to stone me to death now. :-)

Nothing outrageous in your question. The weirwood system seems very similar to the biological superbrain that houses the Avatar people's memories.

However, I do believe that Martin started writing ASOIAF long before Cameron produced the movie Avatar, unless there was some book about it floating around in earlier times.

[Eyron]

In short, Mellisandre therefore represents the "evil" force of Fire. And the Others represent the "evil" force of Ice. But the Children represent the "neutral" force of nature, which simply advocates a balance, through which all things live, die and are born again in the endless cycle of life.

Exactly this!

Excellent post Free Northman.

The balance the Children represent is even hinted at by Bloodraven to Bran, every song must have it's balance.

That is what I think the Children are to the forces of ice and fire. In the world at risk by these two, the Children represent the forces of nature, life and death.

And yeah, the Children are the singers of the earth...

And the story is called A Song of Ice and Fire...

And as discussed at lenght before in other threads, the Reeds oath to Bran.

Earth and Water

Bronze and Iron

Ice and Fire

I think Men are represented by bronze and iron, and in this context they are also keepers of balance, being the shield between the forces and the ones that can tip the scale to either side, by empowering the Children or by tapping into and releasing the magic of ice or fire.

What you write about the magic the Children are connected with is almost exactly what I have written numerous posts about, I am so glad to see there are more to share this view.

One thing though, I think the forces of ice and fire magic are inanimate (I am not sure if this is what you meant), and that the people tapping into them are the ones that create the destructive forces. As in the red priesthood and the Others (who seem fairly human in their psychology). As I have said before, it's people who are evil, magic is just a tool for them to practise it. And magic in not controllable or measurable so results can be disastrous, as we have seen.

I also think there will be war on two fronts, both ice and fire, for humans and Children and that is the reason I don't see any chance of cooperation between Children + Bran and Jon (and any others that will rally to this party) and Dany and the dragon squad.

Jojen (who I like to think is a boy who knows what he is talking about) to Bran when they emerge from the crypts of Winterfell and see that the godswood did not burn.

"There is power in living wood", said Jojen, almost as if he knew what Bran was thinking, "a power as strong as fire".

Foreshadowing of the battle that will come?

The dragons are false saviours in this story and the way people are rushing to lay their hands on them is telling, people are greedy and want to have dominion over others, and they don't shy away from any horrors to get it. No way GRRM does not see the resemblance to another prominent fantasy story in this...

Fassreiter wrote it well earlier in the thread: The dragons are the "ring" in this story.

On the topic of the Wall, I think the old species (giants etc.) are part of the world that the Children wants to protect, they are part of the same pre-civilization culture, and in the name of balance I think the Children would try hard to save them.

Supposedly the Last Hero went to find the secret city of the Children to ask for their help to defeat the Others. And since the Children did not need to do this I think they exacted something in return, and that was the protection of the old species and a promise of the Last Hero to uphold this pact. Hence the Night's Watch and the Starks in Winterfell, and the Wall.

The south side of the Wall needs a defence from men trying to come through it, men can hack, burn and dig, hence a mobile ground defence as we see in the Night's Watch and the men who occupied the Gift. On the north side a ground defence is wasted since the magic in the Wall is keeping the Others from passing, and they don't burn or dig either I think.

[Black Crow]

The Children's magic does not represent Ice. It represents all of nature. The Children are only located north of the Wall, because that's where the least number of men can be found. The Children were located EVERYWHERE originally, but now only a remnant of a remnant remains, beyond the Wall.

Not so; Osha said they "went" beyond the Wall, while Maester Luwin rather more explicity said they fled up there.