Jon Jon's Decision (Spoilers!)

[Ser Malthred Storm]

Am I the only one who felt a bit hopeful that Jon would (SPOILERS ABOUT THE END OF THE 3RD BOOK)

Become a true Stark and reclaim Winterfell and the North? He may have been able to convince Stannis to allow him to keep the Weirwood---as is a contributing factor for his decision. The only reason I can see is that: Eddard would not break an oath. However, that is not entirely true. At his execution, he forgot his honor to save his daughters.

If anyone has any further reasons of why Jon chose the way he did, I would be glad to know them. Thank you.

[LuisDantas]

Night's Watch is not supposed to take a stand in political matters. I always felt that was his main reason.

And yes, I agree that his choices in ADWD don't really help him in that matter.

[TeamDanyArya]

I was hopeful for about a minute considering how much Winterfell is in ruin and Starks are all over the place but all think each other are dead. If anyone could rebuild Winterfell and restore the Stark name, it would be Jon. But, his place is at the Night's Watch and he's got plenty of work rebuilding that place.

[Blangadanger]

I loved reading the chapter when he's contemplating his choices (unknowingly being vouched for Lord Commander while he was doing so), because there was no real clear choice. I imagine that GRRM had a difficult time deciding which route to go himself. Ultimately I felt that while reclaiming/rebuilding Winterfell would have been a nice goal, I did not trust that it would happen so easily or without a great cost. I had been longing for Jon to meet up with Arya since the start of the second book, but even considering that, I did not think Jon should have chosen to accept Stannis's offer. I do not trust Stannis or Melisandre (thinking they'd use Jon the same way they planned to use Robert's bastard child), and though he is very much his father's son, I don't think it is in him to take his father's house for his own. Also, had he chosen to take Winterfell, I think he would've felt very guilty about it later when word of one of the remaining children is actually alive. In fact I do not think Sam would have been able to accept Jon's choice of Winterfell knowing that Bran was alive and well.

Of course Jon knew a lot less than the reader did, so the choice wasn't nearly as easy as it was for me. I was overjoyed when Ghost bounded out of the woods to remind him of his place at the Wall.

[TeamDanyArya]

I agree. I think Stannis would have wanted too much out of Jon if Jon had accepted Winterfell. Melisandre is scary enough as it is. I wonder if perhaps Stannis or Melisandre know or think they know who Jon's real mother is (or parents, I'm of the opinion Ned may not be his bio father but at least a relative). Perhaps us that to gain further control over Jon?

[IceVyper]

This is my first post on the forums, which I have been avoiding being afraid of spoilers. Yesterday I finished book 3. I have been reading with an incredible pace since I started the series on December 1st. Now I am lingering and not starting a Feast for Crows because I want to assimilate all the information that I got.

Jon Snow is my favorite character and ever since the first book I've been having so many theories about him. I just refuse to believe that he is only Ned's bastard son. The theories are about his origins, his decisions as well as his literary purpose.

1) He is Lyanna Stark's and Rhaegar Targaryan's son - making him the Song of Ice and Fire.

There are so many hints throughout the books and just as many discussions about it. I just need to state this because it is related to my other theories.

2) The Wall and beyond is the only place in Westeros where Jon Snow can reach his true potential.

With every book that I read I am getting more and more convinced that there is a reason why Ned's children are split up and left on their own. Even though some of them get really close to finding a sibling, something always gets in the way. I believe that all of them need to take this journey without another Stark close by, so that they can develop certain qualities. For example, Bran would have never become a Warg and left on his journey, had his mother or older brother's been around.

In Jon's case the Wall is the fresh start that he needs in order to leave the bastard stamp. It is not easy as there are still plenty of people who try to put him down, but at least he is given opportunities to prove himself and to advance in the ranks. Had he left, like he tried at first, and joined Robb, he would have gotten lost in the warlords politics. I fear that he would have gotten himself slaughtered on the battlefield trying to prove his worth.

Luckily enough, he didn't run.

3) The importance of Jon's oath.

At first I was annoyed with all this talk about the oath and how it would rule all his decisions and actions. But then I realized that without his oath, Jon is nothing but a bastard and a potential deserted to be beheaded. His oath elevates him beyond the baseborn status, even higher than many highborn lords. That is why he can only "break" it only if ordered by a higher commander, but not at his own decision. I think that there is some symbolism in Ned Stark (Jon's admired role model) beheading the deserter in front of his sons. I see this as a direct message to Jon - leaving the wall and going south will kill you: your spirit, your persona etc.

Some spoilers about swords and weapons follow:

It is revealed that the 2 Valaryan steel swords, that Lord Tywin has made for Jaime and Jeoffrey, came from the melted steel from Ice. There must be some intention of revealing this other than showing Lannister cruelty and lack of respect for the Starkk’ heirlooms. Ned has several heirs that might end up wielding those swords.

When Jaime gives his swords to Brianna, she seems to me like a temporary bearer, just till she gets the sword to its rightful owner. She names it Oathkeeper right in the middle of chapters where Jon is struggling with the meaning of his oath. In this story, there is only one more person, besides Brianna and Ned Stark, who values oath that much - and this person is Jon Snow. I think that the sword will get to Jon somehow and that he will do wonders with it. The other one might end up with Arya or Rickon, or even Bran.

4) Leader of Winterfell or the Night Watch

This choice is not only about keeping the Oath, but also about fate and self-preservation.

Two kings want Jon Snow to be the Lord of Winterfell, not because he is an awesome leader, but because they have no other choice. Robb loves him and believes in him, but he chooses him as a successor because he has no heir. We’ll see what will happen to that storyline. And Stannis wants him because there is no one else. Yet again Jon is given a way out from the Night Watch, a royal pardon, but he stays.

I am very sure that Jon is meant to fight some major supernatural power, and he can do that only if he stays in the wild North and trains his warg abilities. Returning to Winterfell as a Lord, would only trap him into politics and wars with the surrounding kingdoms. He might become a great war strategist but this is not what the realm needs from him. He is needed to fight the mysterious and forgotten evils. Also, with Catelyn alive, she would have gone to destroy him if she sees him ruling Winterfell while still considered Ned’s bastard. The only way she will ever accept him is if he turns out to have Stark blood through Lyanna.

.

5) Jon Snow is one of the heads of the 3 headed dragon

While Dany believes that she and her possible 2 husbands will be the 3 heads, I think that you must have Targaryan blood, to be a head. Since I believe that Jon is Rhaegar’s son, I think he will be the second head. The third one is tricky. For a while I thought that Edric Dayne might be it (his blond hair and violet eyes make him look a lot more Targaryan than Dornish) but he is way too young to be the missing baby Aegon. Maybe it will be a character yet to be introduced.

6) When it comes to storytelling, I think that Jon is kept on the North, so that the reader will know what is happening up there. Also, to humanize the wildlings. Jon needs to interact with them and show the reader that they are no different than the rest of the population of the Realm. If not, they just become like faceless Orcs from LOTR and the reader does not care what happens to them.

[Lions-and-Roses]

I felt he thought Winterfell belonged to the Old Gods, and when he saw Ghost again he remembered that he did to. He didn't want to renounce the Old Gods for Rh'lorr. Or however you spell it.

[Rodrigo Borges]

Freerider, well i did! Thought he would reclaim it and bitch slap Catelyn.

[redqueen]

His oath is all he is. He can't turn his back on it. I can't see him betraying it for any reason, not after his friends made him turn around when he wanted to join his brother. I found it admirable that he wanted to fight for his brother. The old gods (Martin) has other plans for him. He would have died in the war or died as an deserter if he left the wall. He can only leave the wall under orders. Stannis could free him from his orders and make him a Stark, but seeing Ghost made him see that his obligation is to the wall. He made a vow and it can't be taken lightly. Jon needs to keep his honor. The only way he can keep his honor is by staying at the Wall.

I know that he believes that his brothers are dead. Arya is missing. I don't know how much news he has of Sansa. He could not know that Tyrion is believed to have killed Joffrey and she is implicated. She might still think she's safe as Tyrion's new wife at the Red Keep, not that she's hidden from them. It's unlikely that he would have had time to receive a raven about Joffrey's murder. If Stannis had received one, which is more likely, he isn't likely to have shared the news with Jon. We don't know what Jon's opinion is about Sansa's future children (be them Tyrion's or otherwise) inheriting Winterfall. Jon with his vow to the Brotherhood of the Night Watch shouldn't concern himself with who inherits Winterfall or if it remains in ruins.

As a member of the Night Watch, he shouldn't be concern with the politics of the south. He has to let others concern themselves with those issues no matter how tragic it is. The Night Watch needs him. Even if it didn't, he still has the obligation to serve them in anyway that he can.

[TyrionFan82]

I do think Jon chose to stay for the reasons others have said, that he deep down thinks it'd be a betrayal of Ned and the Starks. I think too that he finally has found a place where he fits in more or less at the Wall and if he did leave he'd still be thought as baseborn, even if Stannis fixed that. He may even continue to feel like that in the presence of highborn lords like the Boltons, Umbers, etc not to mention southron lords. At the Wall he can now be Lord Commander and have a continued measure of respect w/o all the bs.

@IceViper, great theories!

[KhaleesiDany]

I do not think Jon would have been able to convince stannis to let him keep the Weirwood. The books make the point over and over again that to serve R'hllor you must forsake your old gods. Remember the Mother crying to Stannis when he was on the spire rock? If Jon was Lord of Winterfell even if he supported Stannis I doubt Melisandre would let Stannis believe that Jon was really on their side until she'd burned the trees down.