Lemon Cake Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 According to Varys, he gambles, so he apparently engages in some form of socializing, though I doubt the men he gambles with could be called friends. More like acquaintances. I can't imagine people go out of their way to seek him out if they don't have to, and on an objective level I can't blame them. A huge, freakishly strong, intimidating guy who usually has only snide, cutting things to say to everyone when he's not too busy standing around and glowering? Yeah... I can understand people avoiding him. :lol:On the other hand, it'd give you some serious street cred to be able to say the Hound was your BFF. *has a sudden and inexplicable image of Hot Pie strutting around Flea Bottom, telling everyone who will listen about how he's totes besties with the Hound* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
only me Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 According to Varys, he gambles, so he apparently engages in some form of socializing, though I doubt the men he gambles with could be called friends. More like acquaintances. I can't imagine people go out of their way to seek him out if they don't have to, and on an objective level I can't blame them. A huge, freakishly strong, intimidating guy who usually has only snide, cutting things to say to everyone when he's not too busy standing around and glowering? Yeah... I can understand people avoiding him. :lol:On the other hand, it'd give you some serious street cred to be able to say the Hound was your BFF. *has a sudden and inexplicable image of Hot Pie strutting around Flea Bottom, telling everyone who will listen about how he's totes besties with the Hound*He definitely socializes, as he seems to be aware of courtly gossip :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemon Cake Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 He definitely socializes, as he seems to be aware of courtly gossip :)I always just assumed he knew courtly gossip simply from standing guard at council meetings, royal family dinners, etc., but you're right, it could also have been from socializing. I guess it's just hard for me to picture him being sociable, not because I think it's impossible, but because the two times we saw him off-duty in KL (that I can recall), he was by himself and stalking Sansa. That, and because he's such a misanthrope. *pets him* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
only me Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 I always just assumed he knew courtly gossip simply from standing guard at council meetings, royal family dinners, etc., but you're right, it could also have been from socializing. I guess it's just hard for me to picture him being sociable, not because I think it's impossible, but because the two times we saw him off-duty in KL (that I can recall), he was by himself and stalking Sansa. That, and because he's such a misanthrope. *pets him*As Joffrey`s guard (or babysitter) he also has to know what people are talking about the royal family (and Joffrey`s pretty girlfriend) behind their backs. I think he socializes when he wants information about something (including his personal interests and enemies). Just like with Polliver and Tickler, only it does not have to end with swordfight every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE CROW Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 Yeah, yeah, Sandor is interesting, but one last comment on Crow:He may very well be Azor Ahai. That is all.this right here :agree: has officially made me fall in love you littlespider :wub: , i may be Azor Ahai but you are the Queen of of Love and Beauty, Now about the discussion about how Sandor is the lonely man and has no friends. A man who has no friends needs never worry about them betraying him. And i definitely could see him living his life with that way of thinking, considering his own blood tried to cook him like a piece of rotisserie gold. After something like that trusting anyone would be a hard thing, Stranger probably was his truest friend.paragraph in bold is on topic about Sandor, i just want to make sure that is understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaughterOfThe9Moons Posted December 12, 2011 Share Posted December 12, 2011 Yeah, I don't think that Sandor ever had any friends per se. More gambling and drinking buddies with whom he could talk shit while getting wasted. He seems like someone who wants everybody to fear him and in that respect I doubt that he tried very hard to strike up or maintain friendships on even a superficial level. I think he probably actively discouraged people from spending time with him. I think he was so disenchanted with the world ( "It's the world that's awful.") and the people who surrounded him that he spent most of his off-duty time by himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlespider Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I was just thinking of the irony of Sandor being so anti-religion, and besides ending up in a monastery, his deathbed confession to Arya was classic atonement for sins - you know in addition to trying to get her to kill him. But my opinion begs the question: was he in a sense seeking some atonement for his sins by confessing the truth to Arya?It's great irony, and in some ways perfect that he ends up in a monastery.I am not sure that the deathbed...er death tree? or whatever moment was a confession or request for atonement. It was a gigantic spew of regret and self-hatred. He wasn't requesting forgiveness, or even apologizing -- I don't think that's in his vocabulary. But regret (contrition) is the first step towards seeking atonement.Elder Brother uses the term "penance" when he talks about the monks, yes? Something like "we do penance for our sins here"? So regret's the first step -- and Arya definitely heard that. Confession's the second (which EB would have heard). Penance is the third -- bodily punishment or somehow making it up. Fasting, keeping vigil, saying prayers. The QI's version of this is digging graves, I guess.Now, as for Sandor's drinking buddies: I don't know. I mean, he is definitely, like, even more socially artarded than Samwell in GoT, right? Though he can make hilarious snide quips (Say, make my horse a knight...), which takes a kind of social ability, and he's pretty perceptive of others' thoughts. It seems to me like he just really hates most people and wouldn't be the kind that would want friends. Which is okay because he will always have his pony STRANGER.*has a sudden and inexplicable image of Hot Pie strutting around Flea Bottom, telling everyone who will listen about how he's totes besties with the Hound*This didn't just make my day, it made my week!!*chaste peck to Ice Crow who can be my platonic sun and stars* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headtrip_honey Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Now, as for Sandor's drinking buddies: I don't know. I mean, he is definitely, like, even more socially artarded than Samwell in GoT, right? Though he can make hilarious snide quips (Say, make my horse a knight...), which takes a kind of social ability, and he's pretty perceptive of others' thoughts. It seems to me like he just really hates most people and wouldn't be the kind that would want friends. Which is okay because he will always have his pony STRANGER.Yep, Sandor's just a misanthrope. He could make friends if he WANTED to, but he's so petrified of rejection that he puts up a barbed exterior which repels anyone who might get close. Can't get rejected if you never put it out there. which is why his offer to sansa the night of blackwater was so touching and why he was so crushed and full of loathing when she not only didn't come with him but when he assaulted her he lashed out at the one person he let get close and it absolutely tore him apartAlso, PONY? Stranger snorts at your "Pony". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 which is why his offer to sansa the night of blackwater was so touching and why he was so crushed and full of loathing when she not only didn't come with him but when he assaulted her he lashed out at the one person he let get close and it absolutely tore him apart.I completely agree, and it was just so sad and pitiful and then the whole getting choked up and tearing off the cloak, and please I'm not trying to romanticise Sandor or minimize his jerkassity, but come on people, the man is a walking cry for help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headtrip_honey Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I completely agree, and it was just so sad and pitiful and then the whole getting choked up and tearing off the cloak, and please I'm not trying to romanticise Sandor or minimize his jerkassity, but come on people, the man is a walking cry for help. i am going to add that if he doesn't grovel at sansa bb's feet and apologize for holding his dagger to her throat i will be disappoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 i am going to add that if he doesn't grovel at sansa bb's feet and apologize for holding his dagger to her throat i will be disappointAgreed. He needs to make up for frightening and threatening her. Her refusal to look at his face was the trigger, and I think it just shows how much at that point he wanted her acceptance. Whatcha think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headtrip_honey Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Agreed. He needs to make up for frightening and threatening her. Her refusal to look at his face was the trigger, and I think it just shows how much at that point he wanted her acceptance. Whatcha think?I think it speaks to his need for acceptance in general. As much as he gives off a "I don't give a fuck," vibe, he clearly does. And she's the only one he can (sorta) admit that to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R & R Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Here's an option: Gravedigger/Sandor deals with his sexual frustration demons by at first opportunity slicing dear Sansa's head off of her lovely Stark shoulders.There. Sandor is now everyone's enemy, and there's no need to expend plot upon anyone currently in the Vale assuming the rebuilding of Winterfell, as Littlefinger is now bereft of leverage.Sandor's a player; it's all about efficiency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R & R Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Y'all know I'm just throwing out an option from a devil's advocate standpoint, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexia Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Y'all know I'm just throwing out an option from a devil's advocate standpoint, right?I know; I just couldn't stop myself. There are too many people on the devil's side... :lol::grouphug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashcandy Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 Here's an option: Gravedigger/Sandor deals with his sexual frustration demons by at first opportunity slicing dear Sansa's head off of her lovely Stark shoulders.Hmm, Sandor is a man who's probably accustomed to his whores on the weekend.... just how is he going to cope with such a drastic change? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R & R Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Because Sandor, for all that we love him, is best at violence, violent solutions. If he's all messed up about Sansa, killing her eliminates the mess. Note: I don't personally advocate this solution. What GRRM writes is what will happen. But I believe it's naive to assume that Sandor does not consider eliminating his demons the best way he knows how. Killing (un)Gregor, for instance, resolves one of Sandor's demons. Killing Sansa may leave Sandor empty and bereft of anything worth living for, but still serves to eliminate a troublesome psychological trauma in a manner that Sandor is best suited to enact. And, y'know, would make for tragic storytelling.It's also possible that I'm ashamed of my shippage... :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmeischa Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I wonder about why Sandor hasn't got any friends in KL.He is a very good warrior, he spent a lot of his time during the war expedition, he fought as well, maybe - from time to time- he saved the lives of another knights... guys, this is the best way to get a lots of friends as I know :) So, why he is so alone (or: lonely?)? cause of his character?I can just see Loras trying to get friendly with him :D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sand Snake No. 9 Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I can just see Loras trying to get friendly with him :D.Now that would be the REAL story of Beauty & the Beast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
only me Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I can just see Loras trying to get friendly with him :D.Sandor even made the first move by saving his life :Dand now they are (maybe) both burned. Strong base for a beautiful friendship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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