Sarge Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I haven`t read the Dunk & Egg stories yet. Which one should i buy first? The Hedge Knight or The Sworn Sword? A friend of mine told me it`s better if i buy Dreamsongs Vol I and II because they contains every D&E books . Is that true?Dreamsongs contains only one of them (The first, The Hedge Knight -- I don't remember in which volume). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuisDantas Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I haven`t read the Dunk & Egg stories yet. Which one should i buy first? The Hedge Knight or The Sworn Sword? A friend of mine told me it`s better if i buy Dreamsongs Vol I and II because they contains every D&E books . Is that true?Read them in order. Or at least, read The Hedge Knight first if at all possible.Dreamsongs is a coletany of GRRM's works (not all, mind you - a representative sample). I haven't seen it yet, but I understand that they are a good value for the price. STILL, far as Westeros and Dunk and Egg go, it only has one tale, which happens to also be the very first Dunk and Egg tale, namely "The Hedge Knight".For the other two D&E tales already published, you will have to seek elsewhere. No Dreamsongs volume has them.Allow me to direct you to the Wiki:http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/The%20Hedge%20Knighthttp://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/The_Sworn_Swordhttp://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/The_Mystery_Knight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kibblie Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Several times it was stated that a drunken septon married Tyrion and Tysha when they were young. At the wall, Septon Cellador is a drunk. My question is, are they the same person? Is there ever any indication in the text? Am I just overthinking this? (< probably this, but the silly question has been floating around my head for a while now, so I figured I'd ask you fine, knowledgeable people) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrogant Bastard Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I was rereading AFFC, and Jaime tells Cersei that as Lord Commander it's up to him to pick new members of the Kingsguard. So my question is, who picked the kingsguard members in AGOT--Boros, Meryn, Mandon, etc? None of them seem very competent or possessing knightly qualities except maybe Swann and Oakheart, so I would have thought Barristan had better judgment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Shadowbinder Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Several times it was stated that a drunken septon married Tyrion and Tysha when they were young. At the wall, Septon Cellador is a drunk. My question is, are they the same person? Is there ever any indication in the text? Am I just overthinking this? (< probably this, but the silly question has been floating around my head for a while now, so I figured I'd ask you fine, knowledgeable people)I like your thinking, seems like a plausible theory and also explains why a septon chose to take the black (Tywin sentenced him as punishment for Tyrions wedding).I was rereading AFFC, and Jaime tells Cersei that as Lord Commander it's up to him to pick new members of the Kingsguard. So my question is, who picked the kingsguard members in AGOT--Boros, Meryn, Mandon, etc? None of them seem very competent or possessing knightly qualities except maybe Swann and Oakheart, so I would have thought Barristan had better judgment.Great question.... In CoK while Jorah is telling Dany about his wife he says that in the tourney at Casterly Rock "I even unhorsed Ser Boros of the KG" - apparently before Jorah was exiled it must have been impressive to brag about defeating Ser Boros. So perhaps they were all great knights at the beginning and declined. IIRC Ser Mandon was a good swordsman prior to death and just had a unreadable, icy demeanor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buried Treasure Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Aerys picked Jaime, so probably king and LC pick new members together - with the king getting the final say if he wants it. It should be Jaime choosing new members because Tommen would not know who to pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elaena Targaryen Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I just read the three Dunk and Egg stories, and I have a couple of minor questions. First of all, did Ser Arlan ever actually knight Dunk, or did he just claim to be a knight and let things play out how they did, I never really got any confirmation one way or the other. http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/Norescon_Boston_MA_September_2_67/Martin officially confirmed Dunk was not knighted by Ser Arlan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elaena Targaryen Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 very small question: what does ETA mean on this board? I've known it as estimated time of arrival, but it seems to have a different meaning here.ETA edited to add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akisut84 Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Thanks everyone for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tywin's Privy Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Thanks to Lebronn Jaime & LuisDantas for the input on the religioous questions.Very good point, too about most religions in the book being based on Greco-roman pagan religions; how monotheism began the age of religious intolerance; and how melisandre and he followers of Rh'llor are really pushing conversion on everyone else.It should be very interesting to see what will happen when melisandre and the believers in the lord of light meet the faith of the seven and the new high sexton now that they're armed to the teeth (thanks a lot cersei!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrogant Bastard Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 One more question, with ADWD spoilers. When Doran mentions to Arianne and the Sand Snakes Balon Swann's plan, is he right? I don't recall Cersei ever devising that plan in AFFC, though she does mention sending Swann to Dorne with a plan that her thoughts leave mostly ambiguous. I think Doran is right and Cersei came up with this plan, but considering how many POV chapters she had in AFFC it seems odd that she never thought about it more, though I'm sure Martin could have just wanted it to come as more of a surprise in ADWD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tywin's Privy Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Another thing about melisandre-- sure she seems evil conniving and bitchy when were introduced to her from cressens and then davoss povs-- but when we meet her again on the wall, and even get a glimpse of her thoughts first hand in her one pov chapter-- she comes across completely differently. She truly seems like one of the few forces of good in the series-- not just another power-hungry character out to manipulate her way to the top. Her actions seem genuine, and if it weren't for convincing stannis that davos was right about going to defend the wall the NW probably would've been completely wiped out by the wildlings-- at the very least Jon Snow would've died that day. His life was saved when stanniss troops smashed the wildling forces.My points being: melisandre was one of the only people in the entire real (not counting the NW and the wildlings) who realized the realm was in serious trouble. Of course this is in keeping with her religion and her belief in the long night and AA defeating the darkness. Still though she goes to the aid of the NW when no one else will. Also, she genuinely seems to care about Jon snow-- probably one of the few who do after he becomes lord commander-- and does all she can to gain his trust so he will heed her warning about "daggers in the dark"-- which of course he never does. It seems to me that she realizes he is th only fit person to command the watch and protect the realm in such dire times. Maybe she even has an idea of his parentage.And tying this all back into the religion thing-- maybe she respects the power of the old gods more than she's letting on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuisDantas Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 You have a very forgiving definition of "genuine actions". I fear you haven't noticed how deeply self-deluded people may be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tywin's Privy Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 by genuine i meant acting on what they think is right-- which i guess is a little too forgiving, since every character in the series is acting on what they think is "right"-- or at least "right" for themselves. i guess i didnt express myself correctly.i just think that melisandre is one of the few characters taking action against the true threats to the world, ie the darkness, the wights, the white walkers, the undead, etc... even when grrm gives us a glimpse of her true intentions in her pov chapter in ADWD, shes not the scheming power-humgry bitch we were intoduced to in ACOK. she is trying to save jon's life and protect the world from the white walkers and an endless night where all living things are destroyed.sure she is misguided in many ways, but so are all the book's protagonists. see: ned stark, jon snow, robb stark, catelyn, beric dondarrion, tyrion, brienne, etc etc etc etc etc...what i was trying to say is that her actions in ADWD put her amongst those few characters i count in the "good guys" column Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanTasy Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 by genuine i meant acting on what they think is right-- which i guess is a little too forgiving, since every character in the series is acting on what they think is "right"-- or at least "right" for themselves. i guess i didnt express myself correctly.i just think that melisandre is one of the few characters taking action against the true threats to the world, ie the darkness, the wights, the white walkers, the undead, etc... even when grrm gives us a glimpse of her true intentions in her pov chapter in ADWD, shes not the scheming power-humgry bitch we were intoduced to in ACOK. she is trying to save jon's life and protect the world from the white walkers and an endless night where all living things are destroyed.sure she is misguided in many ways, but so are all the book's protagonists. see: ned stark, jon snow, robb stark, catelyn, beric dondarrion, tyrion, brienne, etc etc etc etc etc...what i was trying to say is that her actions in ADWD put her amongst those few characters i count in the "good guys" columnEh ... she is burning people alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wightman Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 by genuine i meant acting on what they think is right-- which i guess is a little too forgiving, since every character in the series is acting on what they think is "right"Everybody, everywhere (even in RL) has always acted on "what they think is right". It's that judgement that is sometimes called into question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanTasy Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I looked for a thread about the two 'mirrored' chapters in AFFC and ADWD, one out of the p.o.v. of Sam, the other out of Jon's p.o.v.It's the chapter where Jon Sam, Gilly, Aemon and Baby Aemon leave for Braavos. The one where Jon 'killes the boy' in himself.It bugs me since I read ADWD for the first time why this mirroring is used for this particular chapter.We see some important events out of two p.o.v.'s, which apart from being nice is also revealing. But this chapter contains a lot of repetition of factual information written without much coloring out of the p.o.v. of Sam or as seen by Jon.Was the mirror chapter in ADWD just to mend the gap between Sam's and Jon's timeline - I think not.GRRM is a clever writer, he could have solved this without extensively mirroring factual information in ADWD.So why did he do this?ETA The 'mirroring' is in AFFC Samwell I; ADWD Jon II Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveSumm Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Why exactly did Joffrey attempt to kill Bran? What would the motivation be if he didn't know his Uncle was also his Dad, what did he think Bran knew? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mummer Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Why exactly did Joffrey attempt to kill Bran? What would the motivation be if he didn't know his Uncle was also his Dad, what did he think Bran knew?Joffrey set up the assassination attempt after hearing Robert say something like "Someone should put that poor kid out of his misery." Tyrion thinks Joffrey was trying to impress his "dad" (and that sure would've been some scene if the attempt had succeeded and Joff stepped up to take credit for it...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westerirei Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Are we even 100% sure that Joffrey ordered to kill Bran? Is it possible that it's false deduction and there's something more to it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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