The Green Grace is the Harpy

[Miriel]

Agree re: Barristan totally buying the GG's 'wise helper' act. I love his character and how he took things into his own hands after Dany up and disappeared. I hope he catches on soon ...

[Ser Lepus]

Yeah, I thought that Barristan had been more suspicious and just reread his last chapter and ... he isn't, really. He's still assuming it's Hizdahr and/or a dude. Your reasoning for why Dany would trust the Green Grace makes a lot of sense, and like you said, she was already betrayed by one maternal type. Also, if Dany ends up losing Westeros and/or getting killed because of Olenna Tyrell, my head will explode from the awesomeness. :bowdown:

New crackpot theory! The Green Grace is in fact Olenna Tyrell, who has crossed the sea, murdered the real Green Grace and taken her place in order to steal the dragons!

Also, Olenna Tyrell died years ago, and was replaced by Granny Weatherwax...no, forget the last one...Weatherwax would have killed the Others in the first book and the dragons in the fifth (she could kill them in the first too, but that would be to easy for her; she would let them grow first...).

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

New crackpot theory! The Green Grace is in fact Olenna Tyrell, who has crossed the sea, murdered the real Green Grace and taken her place in order to steal the dragons!

I'm sold.

[Fire Eater]

GG: "He is innocent."

Barristan: "How can you be so certain?" Unless you know the poisoner.

"The gods of Ghis have told me."

"My gods are the Seven, and the Seven have been silent on this matter. Your Wisdom, did you present my offer?"

"To all the lords and captains of Yunkai, as you commanded me . . . yet I fear you will not like their answer"

"They refused?"

"They did. No amount of gold will buy your people back, I was told. Only the blood of dragons may set them free again. I know these were not the words you wished to hear, yet for myself I understand. These dragons are fell beasts . . . Even your young queen, fair Daenerys who called herself Mother of Dragons . . . we saw her burning, that day in the pit . . . even she was not safe from the dragon's wroth."

"Her Grace is not . . . she . . ."

". . . is dead May the gods grant her sweet sleep. Let her dragons die as well."

The Green Grace echoes the words of the Yunkai'i. From the lips of the Yunkai'i, Barristan wouldn't even consider it, but from her lips the words have more weight.

"These are dire days. Death stalks our streets, riding the pale mare from thrice-cursed Astapor. Dragons haunt the skies, feasting on the flesh of children."

How could she have known about Hazzea, the girl Drogon ate? The audience hall was almost empty by the time he displayed her burned bones, and Dany paid him one hundred times the worth of a sheep for his silence. Her bones were put in the Temple of Graces, and candles were lit for her name, but the information about how she died was not supposed to leave the the audience hall. I know, there' still a chance Dany told the Graces, but wouldn't that make it more difficult to keep it a secret?

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

The Green Grace echoes the words of the Yunkai'i. From the lips of the Yunkai'i, Barristan wouldn't even consider it, but from her lips the words have more weight.

Good catch. Barristan displays the barest hint of suspicion, but again, he'll only go so far as to think the Green Grace might know the poisoner, not that she is the poisoner, in terms of ordering it.

And again, there's that passive voice: "I was told."

How could she have known about Hazzea, the girl Drogon ate? The audience hall was almost empty by the time he displayed her burned bones, and Dany paid him one hundred times the worth of a sheep for his silence. Her bones were put in the Temple of Graces, and candles were lit for her name, but the information about how she died was not supposed to leave the the audience hall. I know, there' still a chance Dany told the Graces, but wouldn't that make it more difficult to keep it a secret?

Really good catch, nice work. :)

[b09boy]

It baffled me the amount of trust Dany put in the Green Grace. But then it also baffled me how she didn't see Plumm's betrayal or truly suspect Hizdahr at the end.

While I can't claim to have suspected the Green Grace of being the Harpy, she always came off to me as an enemy. Her push for support of Hizdahr really sold me on that. The woman isn't stupid and Hizdahr does not share Dany's intentions.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

It baffled me the amount of trust Dany put in the Green Grace. But then it also baffled me how she didn't see Plumm's betrayal or truly suspect Hizdahr at the end.

Yes. Dany's not exactly the sharpest arakh in the armory.

[Glyn Tarvoke]

Maybe the betrayal for love prophecy refers to how Dany has betrays of herself by loving and trusting her purported swell swords and subjects too much. Might fit. Seems pretty obvious that the Green Grace is probably the harpy but Dany doesn't pick up on it.

[Lian]

It baffled me the amount of trust Dany put in the Green Grace. But then it also baffled me how she didn't see Plumm's betrayal or truly suspect Hizdahr at the end.

Tyrion seems to have realized pretty early how Plumm's mind works, and he's a pretty astute judge of character. It'll be interesting to see what he sees in all the Meereenese people, in particular the Green Grace and the Shavepate.

[SeanF]

If she's not the harpy, the Green Grace is certainly close to him/her.

[Melpomene]

Makes sense to me, OP! And the other posters made good notices too.

Not sure if it entirely counts, but you also get hints of tension and conscending behaviour on the Green Grace's part that annoyed Dany...

Inevitably it was Galazza Galare who stepped forward, her head held high, her face hidden behind a shimmering veil. "Your Radiance, it might be best were we to speak in private."

"Would that I had the time" said Dany sweetly. "I am to be wed upon the morrow." Her last meeting with the Green Grace had not gone well. "What would you have of me?"

"I would speak to you about the presumption of a certain sellsword captain"

She dares say that in open court? Dany felt a blaze of anger. She has courage, I grant that, but if she thinks I am about to suffer another scolding, she could not be more wrong. "The treachery of Brown Ben Plumm has shocked us all" She said "but your warning comes too late. And now I know you will want to return to your temple to pray for peace"

The Green Grace bowed. "I shall pray for you as well"

Another slap, thought Dany, color rising to her face.

(Pg 568-569 HC)

It just *oozes* with uneasiness and boldness. GG appears to be growing more and more rude. One could assume that something doesn't seem right right here...

Being a priestess would be a good cover, especially in front of Dany - many wouldn't immediately suspect a high ranking holy figure to do bad things. But then again, being high ranking...means a lot of authority on GG's part.

[sarah.jenice]

I'm doing a reread now, and I find the Green Grace very suspicious. I can't understand why Dany is so trusting. She doesn't seem to see things logically. I doubt many countries/cities that have been conquered with fire and blood and had their biggest trade abolished would be that welcoming to the person who led the attack.

I think you make a very good point with Hizdahr just especially since it was the Green Grace who recommended the marriage. I also can't understand how Dany doesn't notice that the Green Grace is against any changing in the policy or culture of Meereen. Hizdahr lets Dany decide that she doesn't want to perform several of the marriage rituals, but the Green Grace is appalled by Dany's feelings and has really strong reactions to wanting Dany to do things their way. I guess Dany just thought she was honest, but I think she comes off as very rude and disrespectful to her queen.

She wants Dany to open the fighting pits for the wedding and have a nude inspection by Hizdahr's female family members and three graces. I found that to be a very extreme request to ask of your queen.

I could definitely see her as the Harpy or being very involved in the effort to remove Dany from power in Meereen.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Makes sense to me, OP! And the other posters made good notices too.

Not sure if it entirely counts, but you also get hints of tension and conscending behaviour on the Green Grace's part that annoyed Dany...

(Pg 568-569 HC)

It just *oozes* with uneasiness and boldness. GG appears to be growing more and more rude. One could assume that something doesn't seem right right here...

Being a priestess would be a good cover, especially in front of Dany - many wouldn't immediately suspect a high ranking holy figure to do bad things. But then again, being high ranking...means a lot of authority on GG's part.

Indeed it does. I also think it's hilarious that the Grace at least asked to say it in private, Dany rebuffed her, so she said it in public and Dany got pissed off. Well, duh?

I think what happened to the Astapori Green Grace is telling. She's the one who told them to put Cleon's corpse on a horse and send out a sortie, and the sortie was cut down to a man. They impaled her on a stake in the Plaza of Punishment. The takeaway? The nobles/citizens are capable of and willing to punish their priestesses if there's a presumption of massive failure or treachery. If the Green Grace was truly benevolent and helpful to Dany, I have to think that she herself would have already been harassed or murdered because of that. It's pretty telling to me that she wasn't.

[Grail King]

This has been tossed around before, last summer when the book first came out, but I'm doing a reread of ADWD and I'm pretty much sold on the Green Grace being the Harpy.

First off, the obvious: The Harpy in its mythological connotation is female. The (male) Meereenese nobles who are waging guerilla war against Her Radiance are referred to as Sons of the Harpy. If there really is a "head" figure in this guerilla war and they're not just a bunch of independent sleeper cells, it makes sense that the Harpy in question would be a woman. But it never occurs to Dany, herself a woman allegedly ruling a city, and her advisers that this is a possibility.

Dany's advisers are convinced that Hizdahr (who I think is a slug but ultimately just a pawn) is the Harpy, because "he" can get the violence to stop when Dany agrees to marry him. But who suggested to Dany that she should marry Hizdahr? The Green Grace.

Dany starts getting paranoid about the prophecy, thinking, for instance, that Reznak is probably the "perfumed seneschal." Yet she lets the Green Grace have access to her with pretty much no hesitancy or suspicion or wariness whatsoever. Even though she's a Ghiscari high priestess with significant cultural and familial ties to the city — she seems to defend the rise of the slave culture, saying that the area had no other economic prospects; she tells Dany to her face that she's seen as an invading murderer; she's intimately aware of each noble house and the differences between them. By giving Dany "helpful advice," she also has access to most of Dany's plans and strategy, and as such would know the easiest way to exploit any weaknesses. Dany tells her exactly who's moved against her and how (i.e. Qartheen ships doing a blockade). The Green Grace knows when freedmen have been killed, "or so she's been told." She also knows that Dany would never kill the child hostages — namely that she and her agents can wreak havoc without worrying about losing anything.

She also moves pretty seamlessly between the nobility and Dany's court — it seems to me that if she were actually helping Dany, she herself would be a target and treated like a collaborator. But she isn't. Why? Because she's not actually helping Dany.

Finally — this isn't exactly evidence, just a bit of irony — it'd be hilarious if the people that Dany's really suspicious of were actually loyal to her while the woman she thinks of as a close confidante is actually the one working to destroy her. Oops?

:agree: I felt that way since my first read.

[Silmarien]

Yeah, I thought that Barristan had been more suspicious and just reread his last chapter and ... he isn't, really. He's still assuming it's Hizdahr and/or a dude.

Your reasoning for why Dany would trust the Green Grace makes a lot of sense, and like you said, she was already betrayed by one maternal type.

Also, if Dany ends up losing Westeros and/or getting killed because of Olenna Tyrell, my head will explode from the awesomeness. :bowdown:

Eh, that would be lame. (No offense, AM!)

I think Dany will connect the dots when she returns. I think by the time she returns, however, the Battle of Mereen will already have been fought, and it will just be her dealing with cleanup. She won't be staying there for much longer in the narrative (or ASOIAF readers would probably go on strike).

I think the theory that the GG is the Harpy is very solid. Good post, Apple Martini.

I'm not down with the Dany bashing, but hey, everyone is allowed to have their opinions.

I don't think Dany was naive or that horrid a ruler in Mereen. She was simply in over her head. Westeros is very different from Mereen, so I don't think it's possible to say that Dany isn't a competent ruler anywhere just because she couldn't rule a foreign city whose population was fighting a guerrilla war against her people.

[iamthedave]

Eh, that would be lame. (No offense, AM!)

What is GG if Lady Olenna who is... JAQEN H'GHAR?

[Silmarien]

What is GG if Lady Olenna who is... JAQEN H'GHAR?

Everyone is secretly Jaqen H'gar, it is known.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Eh, that would be lame. (No offense, AM!)

... It was mostly a joke. :P

I still think it'd be awesome if it happened — at this point anyone taking out Dany would be awesome, I don't care if it's Patchface — but obviously it's not a realistic idea. I can, however, dream ...

[Net-Viper X]

I agree that green witch is something bad, if she isn't the Harpy, then she has a direct line to her. I don't think Barristan fully trusts her. I think he wants too, and feels like Dany would want him too as well, but despite that there is this tiny part of him that doubts her. He can smell the stink of shit on her, he just doesn't know if its stuck to the bottom of her shoe or filling the back of her pants.

[Fire Eater]

When it comes to who is the poisoner, the Blue Graces are expert healers, like maesters, their knowledge of medicine would be accompanied by a knowledge of poisons as well. Plus, Dany asks that the Blue Graces tell whoever came for treatment of sword wounds, yet the Graces reported nothing, if the Green Grace is the Harpy, the Sons of the Harpy can come without fear.