Jump to content

And the Iron Thrones goes to...


Lady Octarina

Recommended Posts

We all know Martin is fond of twists and turns and drastic changes in fortune, the facts as they stand don't make this outcome seem likely (and as I've mentioned it's not my personal desire to see Stannis as king I'm personally team Dany!) but it's reasonable to use foreshadowing from hprophecies within the book and from historical events that Martin has likely drawn inspiration from. All of Dany's prophecies and those surrounding her suggest she will be a great figure and she has gone a long way into proving this true however none of those prophecies place her on the iron throne. The clever thing about the red wedding was it destroyed the obvious hero of the story and the reader is then, as many characters in the book are, lost and left with nought but prophecy and Dany to turn to for hope, Martin has cleverly set us up for his bittersweet ending. Dany will be great but she will not sit the throne, through visions she has already seen the king but didn't dwell on the image enough to take any significance from it!

The prophecy was A king. Doesn't have to be the king of the Iron Throne.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Honestly, I have a hard time seeing anyone Besides Stannis Winning the Throne, lets look at the contenders contenders and players

Jon Snow: He's the one guy besides Stannis I could see winning. I have two gripes with him though. One, George hates familiarity. Him or Dany (more on her later) deafeating the others and taking the Throne would basically make ASOIAF a generic "Hero's Journey" Story. ASOIAF may contain elements from classic Fantasy Epics, but in the end George will take it a more Historical route. Also, Snow wouldn't leave the Night Watch's. He has a Stark's honor, and that means the only way he leaves is if the others are completely destroyed, leaving no threat to the realm. Now, I fully expect that the complete defeat of the others will somehow happen, but not in a way that leaves Snow alive or able to springboard to the throne. I think Jon's story arch will mirror Ned's, He'll at some point have a shot at the throne, but he'll do the honorable thing and fight the others instead, and that shall be what kills him. Also, Lets say he is the hero of The Song Of Ice And Fire. Apparently, that song promises a great prince, not a King. Maybe that's not important, but perhaps it is a hint?

Dany: Again, a victory by her would be a "Hero's Journey" ending, something George will likely avoid. Also, while she's clearly been indicated from the beginning as being Azor Ahai Reborn, George has also clearly shown that in his world prophesies are a flawed art (The Stallion who will Mount The World, Melisandre's flawed visions, etc) Add in her personal flaws, her ability to conquer but not rule, and she seems set up to fail. Her best case scenario is she dies destroying the others.

Aegon: Okay, George likes to avoid the cliche, but introducing his eventual victor in the fifth book would be to strange.

Cersei/her kids: There is no way they win/ don't all die. It's almost like they're trapped in a corner, since there doesn't seem to be a way the story could turn that would be beneficial for them

Tyrion: No way westeros excepts a Dwarf as their King. Maybe he becomes Hand of the King, since his story arch revolves around his relationship with his father, and could end with him basically becoming him.

Littlefinger: Doesn't seem likely. Yes, he is a political genius, but he seems headed for disaster. Sansa's story arch has to be headed somewhere. She's always been a pawn, but at some point she must become a player. She'll likely overcome LF in the end. If not her, Varys will land a decisive blow againts him.

Now, lets looks look at Stannis. Clearly Melisandre misinterpreted some vision of him as meaning he's Azor Ahai. Perhaps she falsely assumed him being the victorious king in the end as meaning he's the Hero? Possible. Beyond that, George loves Misfits, but Westeros doesn't. He's one of the only guys remaining who mostly fits the traditional Westerosi idea of a King. Beyond that, he fits as the sort person who historicaly wins these type of conflicts. He'll never bend, he's willing to do what's necessary for power, and power is his main goal.

But, of course, there's still one more power player, Varys. Varys is the true master of the Game of Thrones. I don't think he can be beat, he's to smart. Even if someone killed him, that wouldn't stop him, he probably has things set up so his plans can survive without him. Illyrio might be a true Dragon loyalist, but I don't think Varys is. He seems to be motivated by his low birth, and wants a ruler who'll serve the smallfolk. In other words, someone who sees ruling as their duty, not their right. His main hope in this is definitely Aegon, but he must have backups. He showed a mysterious interest in Robert's bastard, and I think that's where he found a back-up: Gendry

Moving into crackpot zone, I know. Gendry seems to believe in the same things as Varys. He hates how the lords and ladies spit on the smallfolk, and how they are the ones who truely suffer in the Game of Thrones. If Aegon fails, he could easily serve as Vary's new Pawn. I think he'll see a momentous rise in these last two books. He'll like take over The BWB, I suspect Loras Tyrell would follow him due to his resemblance to Renly. He could end up helping Stannis securing the throne. Assuming Shireen is doomed, Gendry could become his heir.

I imagine ADOS's epilogue going like this: After a solid amount of time As King, Stannis dies in an apparent accident. Gendry (Pov) looks at the dead body while alone in the throne room. He thinks for a second he sees a young woman from the corner of his eyes, but when he turns she's gone. After that, he begins to think about the great war and the events that led him here. Finally, he decides to end the Feudal system in Westeros. He's unsure exactly what he'll replace it with, and he knows this choice will surely lead to another bloody war between the lords and the smallfolk, but he'll expect the smallfolk to win. The last sentence will describe the Iron Throne being burned to ashes by fire.

Okay, I'm surely completely off on that ending, but I'd bet everything the Iron Throne somehow gets burned to ashes in the end!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some great points above ^^, I think the blue eyed king vision is worth noting although it may just be simply be vision of A king and not THE king, it remains the only vision of a king we as readers have seen (through Dany) it was the vision of the king when there were three others in Westeros at the time and was also correctness simply a vision of a king, it's out of the blue enough to be worth taking note of.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some great points above ^^, I think the blue eyed king vision is worth noting although it may just be simply be vision of A king and not THE king, it remains the only vision of a king we as readers have seen (through Dany) it was the vision of the king when there were three others in Westeros at the time and was also correctness simply a vision of a king, it's out of the blue enough to be worth taking note of.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The top two contenders are the two characters which the story revolves around that would be Dany or Jon. Without these two situated for control or a resolution of power would be the biggest red herring of all time. they are poised to be the heroes since the beginning of the story. But this however does not mean that the IT will be the top spot. I feel the signficance of who will sit the Iron Throne will be irrelveant once the WW come from the north. Also from Dany's vision with the woarlocks I dont feel KL will be in any condition to be fit as a capitol city.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know why but I think that this theory that the corwn will be offered to Jon and he will refuse it and keep his word as member of the NW is a really cool ending for him. I think he'll be Azor Ahai, but I don't think that he'll ever seat the Iron throne... (its only a personal opinion)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know why but I think that this theory that the corwn will be offered to Jon and he will refuse it and keep his word as member of the NW is a really cool ending for him. I think he'll be Azor Ahai, but I don't think that he'll ever seat the Iron throne... (its only a personal opinion)

I have a feeling this will happen, but thats a horrible ending for him. He only took the black because of his hatred of being a bastard, not knowing who he really is, and bearing the brunt of Cat's jealousy. Rotting on the Wall and not being able to have children or the life that he should is just the sort of screwed up ending that GRRM likely has in mind. It suck because he is the king that should be. Raised by Ned Stark and having the blood of Rhaegar flow through his veins. We will have to be content that he knows his true heritage and is satisfied with it. I won't be. If anyone deserves a happy ending its Jon.

Somehow I just think that NW will cease to exist, opening a way for Jon to the Iron Throne.

Well, a 100 Lannister captives for the Wall would also do the trick. As would his death and revival.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 months later...

I think there are really only three possibilities for who wins the Iron Throne.



Dany - As much as I dislike Dany as a character, I think she has perhaps the best chance of reuniting the kingdom and holding the Iron Throne. This is for the same reason that she has been able to achieve basically anything in the series: Dragons.



Jon Snow - If R + L = J, then I see Jon as being one of the few characters in the series who would have the potential to gain Southern support while also bringing the North back into the kingdom.



No one - Under this scenario, the Iron Throne would cease to exist, at least in the sense that it would control all of the seven kingdoms. The North only originally submitted to the IT because of the Targaryen dragons, but remain culturally and geographically distant from the rest of Westeros. The dreams of independence brought to life by Robb's rebellion mixed with the resentment of the throne caused by RW, makes me think that North will never rejoin the kingdom. The only ways I can see them submitting would be under the force of Dany's Dragons, under the will of a fellow northerner and half Stark Jon Snow or after being completely decimated by the invasion of the Others. Barring those, I don't see the North permanently reuniting with the throne. Their secession would likely that of other ambitious lords (esp. the Iron Islands) and the Seven kingdoms would dissolve into just that.


Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think there are really only three possibilities for who wins the Iron Throne.

Dany - As much as I dislike Dany as a character, I think she has perhaps the best chance of reuniting the kingdom and holding the Iron Throne. This is for the same reason that she has been able to achieve basically anything in the series: Dragons.

Jon Snow - If R + L = J, then I see Jon as being one of the few characters in the series who would have the potential to gain Southern support while also bringing the North back into the kingdom.

No one - Under this scenario, the Iron Throne would cease to exist, at least in the sense that it would control all of the seven kingdoms. The North only originally submitted to the IT because of the Targaryen dragons, but remain culturally and geographically distant from the rest of Westeros. The dreams of independence brought to life by Robb's rebellion mixed with the resentment of the throne caused by RW, makes me think that North will never rejoin the kingdom. The only ways I can see them submitting would be under the force of Dany's Dragons, under the will of a fellow northerner and half Stark Jon Snow or after being completely decimated by the invasion of the Others. Barring those, I don't see the North permanently reuniting with the throne. Their secession would likely that of other ambitious lords (esp. the Iron Islands) and the Seven kingdoms would dissolve into just that.

A few other options to consider:

1. Dany, Jon, Aegon, and the dragons all die, or Jon refuses the throne outright, once his true heritage is discovered. In that case, continuing the Baratheon line makes sense. A marriage between Edric Storm and Shireen Baratheon could work.

2. A marriage between Rickon and Shireen could also do the trick. The story ends the way it began, with an alliance between houses Stark and Baratheon controlling the kingdom.

3. The war with the Others leave the Seven Kingdoms in absolute ruin and devastation. The conditions would be ripe for an outside invasion from Essos. The remaining Free cities could band together like the Ninepenny Kings and launch an all out invasion of Westeros. This would mirror the Turkish and Persian historical invasions.

I just don’t see the Iron Throne going away. Very hard to put that genie back inside the bottle. Stannis shared Aegon I’s sentiment that seven separate kingdoms was folly. As long as there is someone strong enough to conquer their neighbor, there will be war and subsequent attempts to reunite the empire that Aegon I built. The existence is the Iron Throne is the best chance for long term stability and security against outside invasion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Honestly, I have a hard time seeing anyone Besides Stannis Winning the Throne, lets look at the contenders contenders and players

Jon Snow: He's the one guy besides Stannis I could see winning. I have two gripes with him though. One, George hates familiarity. Him or Dany (more on her later) deafeating the others and taking the Throne would basically make ASOIAF a generic "Hero's Journey" Story. ASOIAF may contain elements from classic Fantasy Epics, but in the end George will take it a more Historical route. Also, Snow wouldn't leave the Night Watch's. He has a Stark's honor, and that means the only way he leaves is if the others are completely destroyed, leaving no threat to the realm. Now, I fully expect that the complete defeat of the others will somehow happen, but not in a way that leaves Snow alive or able to springboard to the throne. I think Jon's story arch will mirror Ned's, He'll at some point have a shot at the throne, but he'll do the honorable thing and fight the others instead, and that shall be what kills him. Also, Lets say he is the hero of The Song Of Ice And Fire. Apparently, that song promises a great prince, not a King. Maybe that's not important, but perhaps it is a hint?

Dany: Again, a victory by her would be a "Hero's Journey" ending, something George will likely avoid. Also, while she's clearly been indicated from the beginning as being Azor Ahai Reborn, George has also clearly shown that in his world prophesies are a flawed art (The Stallion who will Mount The World, Melisandre's flawed visions, etc) Add in her personal flaws, her ability to conquer but not rule, and she seems set up to fail. Her best case scenario is she dies destroying the others.

Aegon: Okay, George likes to avoid the cliche, but introducing his eventual victor in the fifth book would be to strange.

Cersei/her kids: There is no way they win/ don't all die. It's almost like they're trapped in a corner, since there doesn't seem to be a way the story could turn that would be beneficial for them

Tyrion: No way westeros excepts a Dwarf as their King. Maybe he becomes Hand of the King, since his story arch revolves around his relationship with his father, and could end with him basically becoming him.

Littlefinger: Doesn't seem likely. Yes, he is a political genius, but he seems headed for disaster. Sansa's story arch has to be headed somewhere. She's always been a pawn, but at some point she must become a player. She'll likely overcome LF in the end. If not her, Varys will land a decisive blow againts him.

Now, lets looks look at Stannis. Clearly Melisandre misinterpreted some vision of him as meaning he's Azor Ahai. Perhaps she falsely assumed him being the victorious king in the end as meaning he's the Hero? Possible. Beyond that, George loves Misfits, but Westeros doesn't. He's one of the only guys remaining who mostly fits the traditional Westerosi idea of a King. Beyond that, he fits as the sort person who historicaly wins these type of conflicts. He'll never bend, he's willing to do what's necessary for power, and power is his main goal.

But, of course, there's still one more power player, Varys. Varys is the true master of the Game of Thrones. I don't think he can be beat, he's to smart. Even if someone killed him, that wouldn't stop him, he probably has things set up so his plans can survive without him. Illyrio might be a true Dragon loyalist, but I don't think Varys is. He seems to be motivated by his low birth, and wants a ruler who'll serve the smallfolk. In other words, someone who sees ruling as their duty, not their right. His main hope in this is definitely Aegon, but he must have backups. He showed a mysterious interest in Robert's bastard, and I think that's where he found a back-up: Gendry

Moving into crackpot zone, I know. Gendry seems to believe in the same things as Varys. He hates how the lords and ladies spit on the smallfolk, and how they are the ones who truely suffer in the Game of Thrones. If Aegon fails, he could easily serve as Vary's new Pawn. I think he'll see a momentous rise in these last two books. He'll like take over The BWB, I suspect Loras Tyrell would follow him due to his resemblance to Renly. He could end up helping Stannis securing the throne. Assuming Shireen is doomed, Gendry could become his heir.

I imagine ADOS's epilogue going like this: After a solid amount of time As King, Stannis dies in an apparent accident. Gendry (Pov) looks at the dead body while alone in the throne room. He thinks for a second he sees a young woman from the corner of his eyes, but when he turns she's gone. After that, he begins to think about the great war and the events that led him here. Finally, he decides to end the Feudal system in Westeros. He's unsure exactly what he'll replace it with, and he knows this choice will surely lead to another bloody war between the lords and the smallfolk, but he'll expect the smallfolk to win. The last sentence will describe the Iron Throne being burned to ashes by fire.

Okay, I'm surely completely off on that ending, but I'd bet everything the Iron Throne somehow gets burned to ashes in the end!

Very good explanation :cool4: and it would explain why Varys had a back up plan for Faegon and anonymously paid for Gendry's smith apprenticeship.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...