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pov character deaths


the wolf warg

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I would contend he didn't need to make all these characters POVs to begin with, but part of that was because two books got turned to one. I don't see why he thinks he has to kill someone to stop using their POV. Characters like Sansa or Bran have who used to have numerous chapters now only have a couple in the recent books; he could do just stop using the ones he doesn't need instead.

But if he does want to kill them off instead of letting them fade away, look for anyone that has merged with an existing POV as a prime target.

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As stated up thread GRRM doesn't necessarily have to kill p.o.v.-characters, just not use their p.o.v.

Though I strongly suspect in TWOW there will be another Stark death. This may be not one of the pov's but Rickon.

Theon could be out of the picture soon and maybe Victarion.

On the Lannister side: Jaime or Tyrion. Cersei is foreshadowed to die.

Arianne probably has plot armor, who else is going to show the Dorne angle.

ETA: and maybe Brienne. It's between her and Jaime, I guess.

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i think he will he has around 200 pages done or semi-finished according to reports and he said he would start re-writing in january so maybe he has around 250 already i expect it to be around 1200-1800 pages depending on if he sticks to 7 books or expands so i think it may take 3.5-4 years

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Well, I think all created POV's had a purpose (except maybe Hotah), and it does make sense he'll start killing off POV characters wherever we have more than one to tell the story. My guesses, according to location, on the future of some POVs:

Beyond the Wall: Bran will only be killed off if we never need to learn anything from the Children or Bloodraven, and I can't see that happening before Book 7.

The wall: Right now we only have Melisandre, but as I've said somewhere else, I don't think we'll need a POV at the Wall for that long, it will be much more interesting not to see the Others' invasion, but only hear scattered news about it. That said, Mel will only be around until she has finished whatever she must do to help Jon as AA or whatever.

Winterfell: once Stannis gets it back and Davos returns with Rickon, we'll have a problem. Assuming no one goes away, we'll have Theon, Asha and Davos at the same place. I bet on a useful death for Theon.

Dorne: Areo Hotah won't die for now, unfortunately, because he's the only POV in Dorne. But I don't think we'll see much of Dorne in TWoW anyway, it's unlikely the war will go there right away.

Storm's End/Wherever YG is: it seems Arianne is on her way to YG, right? That tells us, I believe, Jon Connington won't be around much longer.

King's Landing: queen Cersei will be alive for a while longer, it seems...

The Riverlands: yes, I'm betting with everyone else that either Jaime or Brienne (or both >.<) won't be around much longer. As much as it's Jaime who seems to have less chances of staying alive, I think it's Brienne who dies. Mostly because I believe Jaime is the valonqar, but also because her death could have some importance to his development as a character, whereas the opposite is not true.

Slaver's Bay: too many people converging to the same tiny spot. Daenerys, Tyrion, Victarion. If they all end up meeting, I guess that would mean Victarion's end (I hope so, really), because Daenerys seems to have plot armor, and Tyrion... Martin likes him too much to kill him before the last book, I guess. Oh, yes, Barristan! Hmm... yeah, he's the most likely to die, being old and everything. But since he's the most likely, he might actually last longer than the rest of them...

Arya and Sansa are safe for now, because we don't have any other POV character around them. The same about the Damphair, as much as I hate to admit it (unless whatever importance he seems to have in TWoW is that he'll decide to drown the Iron Islands? One can always hope...). Forgot someone?

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A lot of characters are teaming up, so they won't need as many chapters.

Jaime and Brienne -Riverlands

Barristan, Victarion, Tyrion, and Dany. -The East

Arianne and Connington. -Stormlands and the vicinity.

Asha and Theon -The North

Areo -Dorne

Asha -Bravos (for now...)

Mel -The Wall (Until it falls at least...)

Sansa -The Vale

Cercei -King's Landing

Sam -Oldtown

Davos -Skagos and The North

Aeron - ?

Jon and Bran probably won't get many chapters.  He could cut back the chapters on a many of the characters.  Personally, I'd love for Dany to lose her POV status; I think she'd be less annoying through the eyes of the others.

The Winds of Winter Death Watch List:

Griff (We know he is going at some point.)

Aeron and/or Victarion

Vic or Barristan

Brienne (I hope, but maybe not.)

Cercei, Areo, Mel, Barristan, Jaime or Tyrion, Theon or Asha, all the elder Greyjoys, and another Stark kid will probably die at some point, but I'm not sure when the deaths will happen.

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A couple of the POVs seemed like filler and are often of lesser importance than many of the non-povs.

For instance...

Aeron, he was only there to facilitate Euron's ascendancy to the Seastone Chair,

Melisandre, she was only there to add some prophecy to Jon Snow

Areo, he gives us eyes in Dorne, otherwise we'd have no clue what was going on down there

Barristan, he gives us eyes in the Great Pyramid and an overall understanding of the situation in Meereen, which was important with dany flown away

-None of these need to die, as they are barely POVs to start with

A few others have seen their roles diminishing, for instance...

Jaime, he had an interesting character development, but it seems to have run its course

Brienne, she was our eyes in the riverlands, but now the riverlands are settling down

Sansa, she had been our eyes for many of the events of King's Landing, that was passed on to Tyrion and then to Cersei, her tale in the vale is filler to get her to a more important place

Bran, his physical journey is over, now a tree will grow through him and he'll make subtle changes that'll have a huge outcome by the finale

Cersei, she's had her fall from grace. I agree with Kevan, she can never be queen again (good thing too)

-None of these need to die for the sake of getting rid of POVs, as they are already on the descendancy*

*Although, Brienne or Jaime will likely maintain a high level of POVs to flesh out lady stoneheart

Logically, Jon should lose his POV status and trenscend to a more lofty, legendary role, like his step mother Cate has done.

Victarion has to visit the smoking ruins of old Valyria, there he will probably meet his end.

Barristan has one final battle, a great last hurrah, there he will probably die.

Cersei's death is all but certain, but first her last two children need to die

Griff will die, though I doubt it will be in TWoW

For whatever reason, I feel that Asha will kill Euron, and then she herself will be killed in turn. But not in the north.

Now off to find the thread where everyone predicts which characters POV or not, are going to die.

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Sansa, she had been our eyes for many of the events of King's Landing, that was passed on to Tyrion and then to Cersei, her tale in the vale is filler to get her to a more important place

I dont agree. I dont find her role in the Vale to be just a filler. I sense something important will merge from there !

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Well I reckon Martin needs to cut down the cast quite a lot. I think the POV deaths will be as follows (I'm counting POV characters even if I don't think they'll have a POV in TWOW):

.Victarion - I think eventually Dany will force him to blow the dragonhorn himself, putting her in full command of the dragons.

. Asha - I don't think she'll have a POV but I reckon she'll sacrifice herself to help Theon escape from Stannis

.Brienne - She'll probably die towards the end of TWOW just as she and Jaime realise their love for eachother. But again no POV.

.Aeron - Euron will probably kill him and he'll become a martyr for the drowned men. So ultimately his death will help bring Euron down. Hopefully will happen in TWOW.

. Joncon - depending on how long TWOW covers we could see him sucumb to Greyscale by the end, unleashing an epidemic across Westeros.

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I dont think JC will die of Greyscale... you know, it is even possible he dies during the battle of Storm's End, and if not, I'm quite sure he'll die of fights and battle during the book. I think the greyscale is on him just to create an epidemic in Westeros, which could add a lot of mess !

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most of what I read for you is who is the most likely to die , in order to ease the plot , how to make it "efficient" . Martin does not work this way.

Stanis can send Asha to iron island or somewhere else, Davos and Rickon might contact Bran through the trees and get other missions

Arya can be a game-changer anywhere. and it is no likely that Sansa remains in the vale till the end , just plotting with littlefinger.

There is going to be a war between Aegon and KL and wars tend to lead to unexpecting places

Redarding Meereen - if I recall right Tyrion is about to leave. Wasn't the deal that the merceneries will help him reclaim the Rock? ( I just don't want Barristan to die so soon , greet POV)

One last thing - somewhere, there is a guy named Howland Reed , someone has to meet him

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most of what I read for you is who is the most likely to die , in order to ease the plot , how to make it "efficient" . Martin does not work this way.

Stanis can send Asha to iron island or somewhere else, Davos and Rickon might contact Bran through the trees and get other missions

Arya can be a game-changer anywhere. and it is no likely that Sansa remains in the vale till the end , just plotting with littlefinger.

There is going to be a war between Aegon and KL and wars tend to lead to unexpecting places

Redarding Meereen - if I recall right Tyrion is about to leave. Wasn't the deal that the merceneries will help him reclaim the Rock? ( I just don't want Barristan to die so soon , greet POV)

One last thing - somewhere, there is a guy named Howland Reed , someone has to meet him

No Tyrion is persuading the sellswords to switch back to Dany's side again. So presumably he'll stay in Slavers Bay for as long as she does (probably about half of TWOW.).

And I have to disagree with Martin's deaths not being for plot efficiency. While shock value is a part of it, most major deaths are used to catalyze events that would have taken a while to get rolling otherwise.

And as for Howland Reed, I think Jaime and Brienne might be meeting him.

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And I have to disagree with Martin's deaths not being for plot efficiency. While shock value is a part of it, most major deaths are used to catalyze events that would have taken a while to get rolling otherwise. And as for Howland Reed, I think Jaime and Brienne might be meeting him.

Don't agree with you . Note that the "one-book" POV that died (the Queen make, forgot his name , and the Doran prince) were not placed in the "crowded" area to begin with . Or they were placed there but were not POV. Martin start with them and kill them soon after.

There was no situation were at the start of the book - there is "too much" POV in one place so one of them is killed.

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