Lord of the north and The Riverlands?

[Lord Damian]

GRRM said the Riverlands can not realistically be defended by the north because they have no natural defences, e.g the neck.

That is the truth of it. I always thought the capital should be built at Harrenhal after it was demolished or seriously "modified" and make the Riverlands the crownlands, this of course if there is still a unified Westeros in the end.

[R'hllor-Is-The-Truth]

I think the River Lords have had a belly full with the Northerners because they brought them nothing but more suffering and defeat. I think the River Lords will make their own new Lord of Riverrun and make sure he or she sides with the Lannisters because there is no point in fighting them.

or maybe they will make peace with the Lannisters and the Iron Throne. Then Jaimie might put Edmure back in his rightful place. But seriously no more Starks or Northerners.

[ClashOfTheAsh]

Rickon will rule the north as a Lord no more!!

Riverland will stay independant of the north as R'hllor-Is-The-Truth stated above :agree:

maybe not edmure but a person of Tully Blood!?!

[Free Northman]

The Kingdoms are defined by their natural boundaries and will revert to that in the long run. The Riverlands will remain a no man's land due to its vulnerable position and will probably be fought over for millenia to come.

The North will eventually rule the North, nothing more, and nothing less.

[EgoistMusketeer]

Why do you think Hot Pie is being kept at an obscure inn in the Riverlands??

The brotherhood without banners will siege River Run and install him as lord.

come to think of it, we don't even know Hot Pie's parents, do we?

He is the aborted child of Lysa and Petyr!!!

lol

[the wolf warg]

WTF are u high on... hot pie is a nobody, gendy may be someone of great importance though he is with the bwb and could be stormlord someday or aryas man toy

[WightWolf]

Howland Reed will be a part of how lands get divided. He's got some sway with the northerners from being friends with ned stark. he'll be the one to reveal the truth about jon snow being the son of rheagar and lyanna. jon will rise to prominance and have reed be one of his closest allies.

[Arya Targaryen]

I don't understand why anybody thinks Sansa would be a good Queen in the North/ regent for Rickon. She may be learning to play the game, but she won't get far with that knowedge in the North, with Winter and the Others coming. The North needs a tough military leader who gets shit done. Sansa doesn't sound like one.

She should stay in the Vale or eventually in Riverlands and offer alliance to the North. But I just can't picture the most "southron" Stark to rule the North in wintertime.

I'm pretty sure Jon will become some sort of leader in the north, either as King or Regent, or just a Stark-looking guy who happens to be there when needed. Bran will be out of picture, Rickon needs a Regent (who else than Jon), Sansa is disinherited anyway, (though the will may have been gone for good), and Arya who knows what will be doing next.

My guess is that Jon will get more or less easily the support of the North, Sansa may help him in the Vale and probably Arya will turn up in the Riverlands. That would mean a strong alliance.

[Ser Kevan of Stone Hedge]

For too long the Riverlands have suffered under one outsider or another. For too long our fields have been burned and our people put to the sword. Others take the Northmen, Westermen, Ironmen and the dragons.

I know only one King, the King of the Riverlands, and his name is Bracken.

Jonos King! Jonos King! King in Stone Hedge!

[Kim87]

I think the River Lords have had a belly full with the Northerners because they brought them nothing but more suffering and defeat. I think the River Lords will make their own new Lord of Riverrun and make sure he or she sides with the Lannisters because there is no point in fighting them.

or maybe they will make peace with the Lannisters and the Iron Throne. Then Jaimie might put Edmure back in his rightful place. But seriously no more Starks or Northerners.

They did in fact win most of the battles... and I do not see the logic of loving the Lannisters and hating the Starks. Hate the guys who fought and bleed with you and love the guys who killed your people... Sure, that makes sense!

[Blackfyre Bob]

It seems more and more likely (especially after reading the posts on this topic) that the iron throne is going to be split up into several kingdoms again. That being said, I think that the Iron throne will be split into three parts (dragon has three heads) with probably Jon, Bran, Dany and Sansa being important players in the end, assuming they all survive.

[Inara]

A kingdom comprised of the North, Riverlands, and the Vale seem unlikely. They share blood ties, but that's about it.

The Riverlords declared for Robb because he was half Tully and because they were united in opposing the Lannister Army. The Riverlords themselves were too fractured to offer a strong enough candidate of their own, and Robb had the added advantage of arriving as a victorious liberator. And though many families in the Vale were willing to add their military support to Robb's campaign, I got the feeling that it was partly because they wanted glory and honor as much as it was about supporting the Starks. But historically, besides being allies during Robert's Rebellion, these three regions have no shared past.

In the long run, the Vale and Riverlands would resent being ruled by a Stark, nor would the North want to kneel to a southern king (not when they went to all the trouble to separate from the Iron Throne). A big issue would be a matter of religion - the Starks hold to the Old Gods, and that defines many aspects of their rule while the Riverlands and especially the Vale are ardent followers of the Faith. It also doesn't help that the North looks down upon Southern customs and their way of life as being too weak. Even knighthood isn't held in high regard whereas in the South, it's a really big deal.

The North is also poorer than the Riverlands and the Vale and will most likely be dependent on them to get through harsher winters. Compared to the more courtly and affluent lands south of the Neck, the North probably seems more barbaric as well. It's pretty much First Men vs. the Andals all over again.

Once matters settle down concerning the throne, I don't see why the Riverlands would want to continue having their fates in the hands of a northerner. So far, the Starks have proven to be incompetent with leadership (things only got worse for the Riverlords after Robb Stark took the kingship) while the Vale has failed to come when they were needed them the most. As for the Vale, if what happened to the Riverlands happened to the Vale, I doubt the lords there would be as eager to fight for the Starks.

Regarding the ties of kinship, I would argue that they don't really matter in the long term. The Stark children are half Tully by blood while their cousin Sweetrobin is heir to the Vale. But besides Sansa, none of the Stark kids have much of the South in them, and given what we've seen of Sweetrobin so far, I doubt he'd be very sympathetic towards his cousins. We've seen some resentment among northerners for Ned's southern wife, and while Lady Dustin's bitterness is somewhat personal, given Westerosi attitudes, where lords married amongst their bannermen, I don't think Lady Dustin would be alone at wanting a northern lady for a Stark overlord.