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[Book Spoilers] EP201 Discussion

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I really wish they would've opened the same way Clash of Kings did -- on Dragonstone with Cressen. I realize the importance of quickly giving the audience a glimpse of familiar faces, but I thought the CoK prologue would've worked really well. Loved seeing Dragonstone in the opening credits, too. I anticipate the opening sequence as much as the show itself, feels like.

Also, Cressen came across as a shady and conniving douche rather than a sympathetic martyr. When he tried to kill Mel on the show, IMO, you almost felt relieved that he failed more than you felt sorry for him. I think more of an effort should've gone into expressing his hopelessness and how everyone turned away from him when he had once been so respected.

(...) Also, they seemed to have changed that Stannis knew about the incest before Ned. I guess Stan got Ned's letter and it was the first time he heard the news? Don't know how I feel about that. Seems to undermine Stannis.

I don't know if it is because I really like Stannis and just wanted to see more of him, but I felt they wasted some time on Littlefinger's stupid scene when they could have used it to develop more the Dragonstone characters... When the episode started I was expecting to see the prologue of Clash, but that didn't happen, ok. And when the scene actually came it felt very rushed to me. I was very surprised when Cressen started to defy Melisandre while they were actually in the middle of burning the seven! But, okay, hopefully we will see more of them next week...

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Axels15,

The prologue in the novel gives us emotional resonance to Cressen's death, it gives us a sense of how powerful and scary Melisandre is, and it provides some more sense of who Stannis is and why there are people who care for him and are so loyal.

I love Dillane's performance, but I should note that for non-readers he's going to be quite the cipher at least until episode 4, when we start to get more of him.

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Different strokes, I guess. I thought that scene came across great. Sansa is the caged bird singing the song. She says all the right things, the bare minimum and no more - see her parrot back the "Well struck" at Joffrey, unwilling to venture any more than that. If her voice sounds lifeless it's probably because she's being forced to watch a gruesome spectacle while sitting betrothed to the little shit who had her father's head lopped off.

I will admit that when it is supposed to be obvious she is faking it, like with 'well struck' or her line about Ned, Robb and Catelyn being traitors, she pulls it off well. But her "you cannnnn'tttt" was just dreadful. Her scenes in the first season are littered with poor acting scenes like that from her, and I was hoping she had improved. I thought the scene was very flat until Tyrion arrived.

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I thought the Cressen poisoning was poorly done. He started foaming at the mouth before she even drank, and he just drank without even bothering offering it to her first. It's like, errr... what? Well, Mel is certainly creepy as hell.

Well....... this is the way I envisioned it. She knew what was coming, and she wanted Cressen and everyone else in the room to know that she knew. It makes her much more intimidating and confident rather than a situation where she did not know what she was drinking but mysteriously survived the poison.

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The Littlefinger-Cersei scene....

My immediate reaction was that Petyr is not as stupid as that to leave himself open and vulnerable, yet after thinking back on it, I like the idea of portraying him as a man who makes mistakes just like any other man, albeit far less. I will be honest, I cannot see Petyr slipping up at all in the books, but I am sure it is bound to happen before the last book, lol. Ultimately, I do not mind the scene as much as I thought I would.

It certainly surprised me, but that's because:

1. It didn't happen in the books

2. Petyr Baelish wouldn't be that stupid

In the first season he revealed his ambitions to two whores. I didn't like that either. It seems that Cersei/Petyr scene is the one most disapprove of from these boards. Petyr and Varys were the two "untouchable" characters in the books, and I wanted them to stay faithful to the books.

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So, I'm confused...who ordered the bastards to be killed? Joffrey or Cersei? Did I miss that?

It was Joffrey. He was asking about them in a prior scene, so it's gotta be him.

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Moving at a quick pace, seems to me that S2 is going to have a fair amount of ACOK in it. This may imply that they could wrap up all of the current books in 2 seasons. I hope I am wrong, talk me down. 7 books 7 seaasons right?

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I was very happy to see Dolerous Ed. He was great!

OMFG! That was him?! I kept trying to figured out who that was, how embarrassing! lol

But yeah, he was great. Obviously. ^.~

I forgot to mention this before, but I'm still not convinced by Melisandre. She looks like Madonna O.o

But I do admit her first "for the night is dark and full of terrors" sent shivers down my spine O.O

And yes, the need to show sexual scenes does get old after a while... The brothel scene was ridiculous, but I actually liked Ros better now than in season 1.

Where is Catelyn's family? Are they deciding to take out Edmure, Hoster, and Brynden Tully? Is that why Jaime is being dragged everywhere instead of being held at Riverun? I really fear for the 3rd season then...

Is Stannis single? Not as important as Catelyn's family (so far in the books) but still. I was hoping to see the maester wear the jester hat.

Selyse was there - wasn't she the blond woman (or something - actually her hair was what we call in Portuguese "cor de burro quando foge", I think) who was standing far to his right, and then was the first to follow him back to the castle?

About Riverrun and the Tullys, well... It would be great to have them this season, certainly, but are they really necessary? The budget will always be the problem here.

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It was Joffrey. He was asking about them in a prior scene, so it's gotta be him.

Or as someone else said, he publicly shamed Cersei in the throne room, so she acted out - power is power, after all.

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If Renly can turn down a naked Natalie Dormer he isnt gay....he's dead

I doubt we'll ever know either way. Simply because Margaery's purity is a question later on. But we do know there are supposed to be "praying" scenes.

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What a terribly scattered episode. I won't sit here and nitpick particular scenes, but, as I felt throughout the entire first season, tonight's episode was seriously flawed and poorly acted.

Hope it doesn't continue to disappoint, but after an entire season of disappointment and disappointment after watching the premier of the second season, I only see it getting worse.

Greywind looked alright though, I'll give the show credit there.

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So is there supposed to be some growing sexual tension between Dany and her bloodrider?

I loved the Bran-as-Summer thing. I thought Sansa saving Ser Dontos was done well.

Didn't love this episode overall, but I'm no less excited for the season.

I haven't been loving Dillane as Stannis in the previews, but I liked tonight's scene where he both wanted "beloved" taken out of the letter for Robert but also insisted that "Ser" be included before Jaime's name even in a letter condemning him. That is the Stannis we know (was that in the books?).

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I forgot to mention this before, but I'm still not convinced by Melisandre. She looks like Madonna O.o

About Riverrun and the Tullys, well... It would be great to have them this season, certainly, but are they really necessary? The budget will always be the problem here.

Melisandre looks like Juliet from LOST to Dub and I.

I think maybe the Tullys were bumped back to next season. Perhaps at the end of the season they'll be mentioned, and then they'll be in Season 3. It's kind of mandatory that Edmure at least be there, if you know what I'm sayin. ;)

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I caught Stannis motioning toward Selyse, and I had to chuckle at his facial expression. It was a nice nod to the fact that he is not at all enamored with his wife. And, yes, I forgot to mention how great it was to see Dolorous Edd!

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Can someone correct the record? I don't remember in the books who ordered Roberts bastards dead, or is this one if those unanswered GRMM questions?

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I haven't been loving Dillane as Stannis in the previews, but I liked tonight's scene where he both wanted "beloved" taken out of the letter for Robert but also insisted that "Ser" be included before Jaime's name even in a letter condemning him. That is the Stannis we know (was that in the books?).

Yeah, Frisky, that was pretty much verbatim. His delivery was EXACTLY how I read it.

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Loved Tyrion as always

They didn't feed enough backstory in my opinion to show the division among the religions in the Stannis camp, as that in itself feeds the creases sympath and the power of Mel

The Craster to Walder Frey comparison seems true... I expected Craster to come off cruel and crazy... Not polished and sensible...

Overall happy it's back on, even If its a little off

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I have not seen this brought up yet - we got a little more San/San in this episode. I am looking forward to the show putting more emphasis on that relationship as the season continues.

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