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Lord Davos Seaworth

The future of Jaime and Brienne?

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I believe only Jaime will survive the meeting with Stoneheart.Brienne will be killed trying to save him.Then Jaime will be forced to help her taking Riverrun (LS has already a spy inside the castle) and leave with the help of Blackfish.He will end up in King's Landing trying to secure Myrcella's safety after Cersei is imprisoned (again) and Tommen dies.


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Briennes whole purpose in this story is to be a catalyst for the changes happening in Jaime.



It's hard for me to imagine either of them dying, as the two make a great dynamic duo together, and I think there is still a great deal more to be told with their relationship.



There is quite a few ways GRRM could take them. Brienne could die, with her death completing Jaimes metamorphasis into a "good guy". Or we could see Brienne's character develop more by having her stand her ground, and saving Jaime, killing Stoneheart in the process.


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Or one can question in the case of Brienne, what is loyalty and what is betrayal? Is serving the demands of Lady Stoneheart truly loyalty and is breaking the oath she had once sworn to Catelyn Stark actually betrayal? Or is Lady Stoneheart as she has become, now, so different from how Catelyn used to be, that the actions of one Stoneheart are a betrayal of the very core principles of a once much more kind Catelyn? Perhaps the death of a certain young Payne would testify to how serving Cat could also mean betraying Cat, by asking if Stoneheart is still Cat in spirit, or if what defines Catelyn Stark is dead in meaning and spirit already. And then a bitter parallel with a certain Lannister, also upon one time forced to choose between two wrongs, reveals itself.



Brienne might realize that doing the honorable thing isn't always the same as serve unconditionally and that honoring your oaths sometimes involves questioning to whom you have actually sworn this oath - or that keeping a knightly oath means to protect the virtues of that one person you once upon better times had granted your sword to - even if it means protecting that person from themselves when their virtues have changed - by chance striking down a monster with the face of that person when this abomination pisses on those very virtues that define the person you have sworn to serve?



;)


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I really hope Brienne chops Lady Stonehearts head off with Oathkeeper. If she does there are so many layers to that story line. Oathkeeper forged from Ice, killing the Lady she had sore an Oath to protect. Sully her own honor to protect the man who supposedly has shit for honor. Jaimie is a romantic so if she does do that for him it would touch him deeply.


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Or one can question in the case of Brienne, what is loyalty and what is betrayal? Is serving the demands of Lady Stoneheart truly loyalty and is breaking the oath she had once sworn to Catelyn Stark actually betrayal? Or is Lady Stoneheart as she has become, now, so different from how Catelyn used to be, that the actions of one Stoneheart are a betrayal of the very core principles of a once much more kind Catelyn? Perhaps the death of a certain young Payne would testify to how serving Cat could also mean betraying Cat, by asking if Stoneheart is still Cat in spirit, or if what defines Catelyn Stark is dead in meaning and spirit already. And then a bitter parallel with a certain Lannister, also upon one time forced to choose between two wrongs, reveals itself.

Brienne might realize that doing the honorable thing isn't always the same as serve unconditionally and that honoring your oaths sometimes involves questioning to whom you have actually sworn this oath - or that keeping a knightly oath means to protect the virtues of that one person you once upon better times had granted your sword to - even if it means protecting that person from themselves when their virtues have changed - by chance striking down a monster with the face of that person when this abomination pisses on those very virtues that define the person you have sworn to serve?

;)

Just so. Brienne is in almost the exact position Jaime was. She has sworn an oath to follow someone who has become insane and is now a danger to everyone around them who they see as enemies. And are prone to see anyone as an enemy at any given time.

Will she make the same choice Jaime did? Will she have to? Anyway, I love this part of the story.

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Since I see a possibility (disclaimer: possibilty, mind you - I don't claim to know what's gonna happen, so please don't be offended) of Jaime ending up on the IT as the (possible) son of Aerys II, I also see the possibilty of Brienne becoming the commander of his kingsguard. That ending kind of echoing Aegon V and Ser Duncan of whom Brienne might be descended.







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I just really so badly want Jaime & Brienne to end up together, even if it's for a short time.



So I probably need to start a separate thread for this, but there's something that's been bothering me about the whole Stoneheart thing (having had to suffer a mother who was never going to let go, but that stemmed from abuse): I seem to be the only person I've run across so far who sees just how horrible it would be for the Stark girls long-term to have their zombie mother chasing after them forever! Arya, especially, who did not get along with her mother. I've thought that a nice twist would be for Arya to have to be the one to put Stoneheart down with all of her new-found skills: "All right, you've gotten Walder Frey and all the bad guys; time to rest now".


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Sandor Clegane gets off the QI to find "The Hound" that sacked Saltpans and clear his name which brings him to the BwB. Brienne tells LS that Sandor last had Arya. Sandor says that Arya left him for dead and continued on to the Vale (she didn't but he thinks that she did). LS releases Brienne (who has an oath) and Sandor (who knows what she looks like) to go to the Vale and bring Arya back but holds Pod and Jaime. Sandor and Brienne find Sansa in the Vale and from there their stories merge. LS then trades Jaime for Edmure. The trade goes bad and Edmure and LS both die. Jaime and Pod are restored to the Lannister army. Brienne and Jaime are afterward respectful but sworn enemies. They do not end up together.


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Somehow I feel Brienne's story will be similair to Jaime's. Brienne will kill Lady Stoneheart, because she had no other option. End her madness. Brienne will be so sad about it, and feels she totally failed her mission. No Sansa, no Arya and UnCat dead.

I do believe Brienne and Jaimie will try to keep their oath and help the Stark girls. There's still Bran's vision. I believe Jaime is one of the two people who are described as fighting Robert Strong. I'm not sure who the other person is, perhaps Sandor, but it can be Brienne as well with the Hounds helmet. That would make sense as well (af least to me ha).

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Somehow I feel Brienne's story will be similair to Jaime's. Brienne will kill Lady Stoneheart, because she had no other option. End her madness. Brienne will be so sad about it, and feels she totally failed her mission. No Sansa, no Arya and UnCat dead.

I do believe Brienne and Jaimie will try to keep their oath and help the Stark girls. There's still Bran's vision. I believe Jaime is one of the two people who are described as fighting Robert Strong. I'm not sure who the other person is, perhaps Sandor, but it can be Brienne as well with the Hounds helmet. That would make sense as well (af least to me ha).

I can see this, but I would hope LS has more of an impact than killing a few minor Frey's then dying herself. At least let her kill Walder and then die.

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I can see this, but I would hope LS has more of an impact than killing a few minor Frey's then dying herself. At least let her kill Walder and then die.

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I would love to see Walder Frey dead. People rarely get what they want though, or it will cost them/won't last long.

Maybe old Walder just dies in his sleep. And then his family will selfdestruct.

Lady Stoneheart is just a magical creature to me. If you kill her with the right sword, Oathkeeper?

Then something will happen to that sword and that will be important to the story. Just guessing, no idea why she got resurrected.

At the moment we have very little information about the BwB. I see Jaime and Brienne playing a role there as well. Very curious about the power dynamics and plans of the BwB. They J + B remain a team.

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I thought about why Stoneheart owuld keep Jaime alive and came to a theory, even if very unlikely:

Stoneheart wants the death of all the participants of the RW, plus revenge against the Lannisters. If she kills Jaime, she will kill one of the plotters (that's what she thinks anyway, thanks to Roose Bolton). If she keep him alive, she could use him as a hostage to send Brienne on some errands and could gain some information about the different hosts along the Riverlands, since Jaime was the commander and knows how strong they are and what are the commanders' personalities. With that information, tha BwB could rescue the prisioners from the RW, take Darry, Riverrun, Harrenhall and maybe even rescue Edmure.

So, if she is not just a vengeful spirit, but also has some cunning in her, she could use a live Kingslayer, instead of just feeding a few crows.

Or she could flip it and keep Brianne as a hostage and make Jamie bring her RW enemies to her.

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Hard to say, I would hate to see Jaime's story end at the hand of Lady Stoneheart but I can't see her being merciful at all.

"Jaime Lannister sends his regards" seems like too big a remark for Stoneheart to even consider mercy.

Brienne may have to break an oath to save him, which in itself would be interesting to see how she deals with that.

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Hard to say, I would hate to see Jaime's story end at the hand of Lady Stoneheart but I can't see her being merciful at all.

"Jaime Lannister sends his regards" seems like too big a remark for Stoneheart to even consider mercy.

Brienne may have to break an oath to save him, which in itself would be interesting to see how she deals with that.

I agree. People don't call LS Mother Merciless without reason. Jaime is a walking deadman. I have a feeling that LS wants to kill Pod, but that Jaime says that she must kill him in Pods place.

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I agree. People don't call LS Mother Merciless without reason. Jaime is a walking deadman. I have a feeling that LS wants to kill Pod, but that Jaime says that she must kill him in Pods place.

Jaime especially at this point of the story isn't going to allow Brienne/Pod to die for him. I anticipate that he will succumb to his fate/LSHs ruling until Brienne saves him and kills LSH. The dialogue leading up to that between Jaime vs LSH/BwB will be fantastic though.

Also, where do things go from there, in this assumed scenario? Back to the Twins to slay Freys as LSH would have wanted? Or off on a voyage to find Sansa Stark? Would they have men alongside them? BwB wouldn't just up and join their cause after Brienne killed their leader would they?

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George has said during a interview she yelled Sword

AFFC

"Take the sword and slay the Kingslayer.."

I believe she will do it. She will look him in the eye, and she will kill him. And then, she will kill herself next to him, because she loves him.

That's not what I wanted.. I liked Brienne. But that's westeros for ya. Life's a bitch, and then the wall falls and then long night comes! HA

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