Table Top RPG Stuff

[King Tyrion I]

All I want to say is the dark sun setting was fucking awesome.

I never had the chance to play it. Our troupe got around in the Forgotten Realms only. And some Ravenloft.

[Guy Kilmore]

Anyone have advice for RPGs that allow PCs to run kingdoms?

I recall Birthright from way back, and Paizo had an adventure path with some kingdom management, but beyond that not sure what's out there.

Thanks!

I have used Pathfinder's system and like most problems with D20 things get real clunky once you approach higher levels and you have to just kind of adjudicate stuff. You also have to have players who don't go around actively exploiting systems as some of the more dated rules created a situation where you could make money really easy. With that said, the Kingdom Rules are in Ultimate Campaign from Paizo. They closed the loop hole from what I read in the rule book and have some good ideas and systems in there for running a kingdom or an organization.

[Werthead]

Anyone have advice for RPGs that allow PCs to run kingdoms?

I recall Birthright from way back, and Paizo had an adventure path with some kingdom management, but beyond that not sure what's out there.

Thanks!

The Green Ronin ASoIaF RPG has rules for running houses/regions which could be adapted, probably the Guardians of Order one as well. Otherwise Birthright. Me and my friends were working on a way of combining the old Greyhawk Wars board game with D&D, with you controlling armies and kingdoms whilst also roleplaying, but it was a little bit clunky. Worked though.

[The Kingmaker]

I need a little help from someone who knows about Dark Sun. My friend's birthday is soon and I want to give him a poster size map of Athas as gift(he loves Dark Sun setting, he runs nearly all of his games there). But I don't have any information about setting, sadly.

He runs game with 3.5e based on stuff released at Dungeon and Dragon magazines, so I think he uses 2e version of setting. I don't know if there are any differences on map between 2th and 4th edition of setting. So my question is, how accurate this map is for him? Can I find a better one or should I go for it?

[Werthead]

There are three editions of Dark Sun. The first two came out for 2E, published in 1991 and 1995. The first one is the classic Dark Sun setting with the wizard-kings ruling over the Tablelands. The second edition is set after the revolution, with the wizard-kings deposed or being deposed and things generally being more positive than the very grimdark original setting.

The 4E version of the game threw out all of the stuff from the second 2E version in favour of the classic setting. In all three editions the geography remains the same, so there's no real problem there.

[Matrim Fox Cauthon]

The Winners of the 2014 ENnies

Fate wins the gold for 'Best Game' and 'Best Rules' while Numenera wins the gold for 'Product of the Year' and 'Best Setting.'

I have enjoyed what I have read so far regarding Numenera, but I may also have to check out Fate.

Also, I have heard some great things about D&D 5E so far, which has just released its Player's Handbook.

[Weeping Sore]

The AD&D 2E Thief's Handbook was a revelation to me as a Dungeon Master. Started a whole corrupt port city campaign with competing Thieve's Guilds, politics and assassinations, and usually ran it with just 2-3 Player Characters. I couldn't go back to hexagon maps and hack-n-slash after that.

[Guy Kilmore]

The Winners of the 2014 ENnies

Fate wins the gold for 'Best Game' and 'Best Rules' while Numenera wins the gold for 'Product of the Year' and 'Best Setting.'

I have enjoyed what I have read so far regarding Numenera, but I may also have to check out Fate.

Also, I have heard some great things about D&D 5E so far, which has just released its Player's Handbook.

The PDF for FATE Core is essentially free at Evil Hat, as you can pay what you want for it. I enjoy the system, right now I am running a Dresden Files RPG. It lends itself well to...cinematic and narrative game play. If you end up trying out Numenera, I would be curious to hear your thoughts on it.

[Ken Stone]

The PDF for FATE Core is essentially free at Evil Hat, as you can pay what you want for it. I enjoy the system, right now I am running a Dresden Files RPG. It lends itself well to...cinematic and narrative game play. If you end up trying out Numenera, I would be curious to hear your thoughts on it.

What are some of the cool mechanics in FATE?

[Guy Kilmore]

What are some of the cool mechanics in FATE?

It is an easily hackable system. In a nut shell, character design is around skill points, refresh, and aspects. Refresh you use to buy stunts or powers. These stunts or powers are pretty much made up. Unspent Refresh equals the number of FATE points a player gets at the start of the session. FATE points can be spent by a player to either add 2 to a roll or to re-roll dice. They can also be used to "compel" and "invoke" aspects. (They basically allow narrative control). Aspects, simply put are descriptors of things. Like if I said a small room filled with fire. A player could use the fact it was small and/or filled with fire to compel things.

Skills are used to interact with the world. You roll fudge dice. Skills are either attacks, manuevers or declarations. Attacks deal damage, or shifts. If you take a certain amount your character takes on Consequences which are severe aspects. Manuevers create tags, which are temporary aspects. Declarations can be tags or narrative declarations, like using scholarship to say that the stone ceiling is weak. You can also spend a FATE point to make something true.

You get your amount of unspent refresh at the start of each session as FATE points. However, every time you are compelled to do something that complicates your life. (In that small room of fire, you want to run through, after the bad guy, but the GM offers a FATE point to say that the fire is too hot and you can't go through. You can take the FATE point, or spend one of your own and roll dice to go through.) Players also create Aspects that are describe their character, their beliefs, and/or their relationships. These usually have the more interesting compels as they are personal. You can also invoke those Aspects, so usually in character creation it is good to create a two edge sword with them.

My description doesn't really do it justice, but the game plays like a Dresden File novel. The Player is Harry getting the snot beat out of him because of his own traits and decisions, but eventually is able to turn the tables and really pull one over the bad guys. The game is really narrative with the FATE point system and encourages you to do interesting things instead of just the mechanically beneficial things. When I GM I also feel less of an antagonist because any time I really screw someone over, they get a currency that allows them narrative control when they really need it.

Oh invoking an Aspect is not simply the use of a FATE point, you also have to describe WHY it would work there, weaving it into the story of events.

[Ken Stone]

It is an easily hackable system. In a nut shell, character design is around skill points, refresh, and aspects. Refresh you use to buy stunts or powers. These stunts or powers are pretty much made up. Unspent Refresh equals the number of FATE points a player gets at the start of the session. FATE points can be spent by a player to either add 2 to a roll or to re-roll dice. They can also be used to "compel" and "invoke" aspects. (They basically allow narrative control). Aspects, simply put are descriptors of things. Like if I said a small room filled with fire. A player could use the fact it was small and/or filled with fire to compel things.

Skills are used to interact with the world. You roll fudge dice. Skills are either attacks, manuevers or declarations. Attacks deal damage, or shifts. If you take a certain amount your character takes on Consequences which are severe aspects. Manuevers create tags, which are temporary aspects. Declarations can be tags or narrative declarations, like using scholarship to say that the stone ceiling is weak. You can also spend a FATE point to make something true.

You get your amount of unspent refresh at the start of each session as FATE points. However, every time you are compelled to do something that complicates your life. (In that small room of fire, you want to run through, after the bad guy, but the GM offers a FATE point to say that the fire is too hot and you can't go through. You can take the FATE point, or spend one of your own and roll dice to go through.) Players also create Aspects that are describe their character, their beliefs, and/or their relationships. These usually have the more interesting compels as they are personal. You can also invoke those Aspects, so usually in character creation it is good to create a two edge sword with them.

My description doesn't really do it justice, but the game plays like a Dresden File novel. The Player is Harry getting the snot beat out of him because of his own traits and decisions, but eventually is able to turn the tables and really pull one over the bad guys. The game is really narrative with the FATE point system and encourages you to do interesting things instead of just the mechanically beneficial things. When I GM I also feel less of an antagonist because any time I really screw someone over, they get a currency that allows them narrative control when they really need it.

Oh invoking an Aspect is not simply the use of a FATE point, you also have to describe WHY it would work there, weaving it into the story of events.

It sounds very cool. There is a game called Technoir that has a lot of those same mechanics. So much so I wonder if it isn't based off of FATE to some degree. I have the book but haven't played it.

I really love the direction that indy RPG's have gone. Narrative game play just so much more interesting then the 4th ed D&D version of a fluffy war game. The only problem, it's tough to explain and to get people into it.

[Guy Kilmore]

It sounds very cool. There is a game called Technoir that has a lot of those same mechanics. So much so I wonder if it isn't based off of FATE to some degree. I have the book but haven't played it.

I really love the direction that indy RPG's have gone. Narrative game play just so much more interesting then the 4th ed D&D version of a fluffy war game. The only problem, it's tough to explain and to get people into it.

I agree. I am more of a fan of Narrative Game Play. I know FATE is pretty open, so it wouldn't surprise me if other people use elements of that system.

The other cool feature of FATE is character creation almost requires people to make their characters together. Characters typically are created with 5 Aspects. One of this is called a High Concept. This is kind of like what you are in a sentence. This is what drives you the most and should change very little, or change only when something REALLY significant happens. The next aspect is call the Trouble. This is something that should conflict with your High Concept. It doesn't have to be bad, just generate Conflict with what you are driven to do.

There are then the 3 remaining aspects. For the next one you are supposed to write a small blurb about what your Character's first adventure was. Then you create a one sentence aspect pertaining to that blurb. This is where the other players come in, for the last two aspects, you then exchange those blurbs and your character makes a "guest" appearance in that other person's first adventure. It can be as an ally, enemy, obstacle, victim, however. You then generate aspects of those last two verbs. This is a nice innovation because it kind of loads in relationships and tensions between players, skipping that whole "you meet in a bar."

It also makes it easy to introduce a new person, they just guest star in two establish players back stories and there you go.

[Ken Stone]

I agree. I am more of a fan of Narrative Game Play. I know FATE is pretty open, so it wouldn't surprise me if other people use elements of that system.

The other cool feature of FATE is character creation almost requires people to make their characters together. Characters typically are created with 5 Aspects. One of this is called a High Concept. This is kind of like what you are in a sentence. This is what drives you the most and should change very little, or change only when something REALLY significant happens. The next aspect is call the Trouble. This is something that should conflict with your High Concept. It doesn't have to be bad, just generate Conflict with what you are driven to do.

There are then the 3 remaining aspects. For the next one you are supposed to write a small blurb about what your Character's first adventure was. Then you create a one sentence aspect pertaining to that blurb. This is where the other players come in, for the last two aspects, you then exchange those blurbs and your character makes a "guest" appearance in that other person's first adventure. It can be as an ally, enemy, obstacle, victim, however. You then generate aspects of those last two verbs. This is a nice innovation because it kind of loads in relationships and tensions between players, skipping that whole "you meet in a bar."

It also makes it easy to introduce a new person, they just guest star in two establish players back stories and there you go.

Damn that is a cool character generation. I am currently spinning up a game of 13th age and the whole "Wait, why are we together again?" is already a problem.

Do you have an example of a FATE character that you created?

[Guy Kilmore]

Yeah, let me post the PCs from a current Dresden Files Game we are playing. It is based on an older version of FATE and has some other stuff added in for the Dresden File RPG, this makes it more complicated that your standard FATE Core Character. FATE Core is more streamlined, but you do have to do the work of defining Stunts and Powers. They don't have their refresh spent posted and that stuff, but the character sheets are pretty easy. Everyone has a skill at 0 and they can spend points to make it higher. Fudge dice range from totals of -4 to +4, you add that to your skill total and that is how well you DO something. There is also a skill pyramid so you can't have more skills at a higher rank than a lower rank. (To have 2 +2 skills, you would have to have at least 2 +1 skills). NPCs are almost to easy to make, only the bad guys I need in great detail have a character sheet. Most I write a paragraph description and just jot some of the skills at game time with an aspect or two. We do a house rule that when you get a read on a bad guy, you can come up with an aspect for the dude and if matches the character and/or the table likes it, it sticks. (I am sure that sentence did not make sense). Also, my players went way overboard in their character backgrounds, more than I expected, which is really awesome.

Brittany Winters, a Badass Battle Barrista

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/brittany-winters

Craig Hale, Wizard of the White Council

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/craig-hale

Det. Jack Hunter, A Shapeshifting Police Detective

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/jack-hunter

Thomas Owens, Bearer of Living Iron

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/thomas-owens

Ripley, A Wolfhound on the Hunt (I don't have the full write-up for this PC posted on the Portal)

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/ripley

Det. Aleksander Erickson (This is one my lazier players, so it is still not fully done. I shake my fist at him, it also has a ton of odd notes, because we were making it together online).

https://dresden-files-twin-cities.obsidianportal.com/characters/aleksander-erikson

[Ken Stone]

Very cool. I'm not familiar with the Dresden Files so a lot of this is over my head, but I like the traits as descriptions and such. That looks like it is going to be a badass campaign.

[Guy Kilmore]

Thanks! Our sessions have been pretty awesome. The players make the game. FATE rules encourages everyone participating in the setting creation by creating Themes, Threats, Locations and Faces. It is nice because everyone gets the same feel as to what to expect in the game. The GM still does most of the heavy lifting, but you get a good idea of what people are hoping for.

[Sci-2]

GenCon Special – What’s Up With the New World of Darkness?

Interesting stuff for Mage: The Awakening, Changeling: The Lost, and so on...

New line -> Beast: The Primordial.

[Sci-2]

From Monte Cook Games:

We’re holding an ENnies sale on the Numenera corebook. If you’re thinking of giving Numenera a try, now’s the time to pick it up! We’re running the sale for 10 days in honor of 10 ENnies, and knocking 10% off the cover price while it runs. Nope, that’s not celebratory enough: Let’s make it 25%! That’s right: 25% off the Numenera corebook for the next 10 days.

It’s a great time to give Numenera a try, or if you’re already playing, to introduce it to a friend. But don’t dawdle: This sale ends September 19th!

[Durckad]

So I ended up getting the three 5E D&D books for Christmas this and surprise, surprise I am now the proud DM of a new 5E group. I've purused the rules and run one game so far, but my initial impression is that I really, really like 5E. It brings back some things I liked about AD&D but it retains the customization of 3E and Pathfinder without going overboard. Yes, I do miss the options and choices of PF and 3E, but I certainly don't miss the stacking bonuses of doom that were inherent to those systems. No longer will characters sheathe themselves in layers of buffs or calculate innumerable +1's from spells, feats, skills, items, and special abilities and that's a good thing because creating challenges for a group and remembering to use all of those abilities was far beyond the simple processes that my brain was capable of. I'll go over a bit of what I like, what I don't and what I'm unsure of below:

What I like:

1) Advantage/Disadvantage - A Very simple but elegant mechanic and a huge replacement for the stacking bonuses of doom that was endemic to PF and 3E.

2) The Classes all look very interesting with enough options to differentiate each one while still keeping them viable. They aren't as varied as the PF classes (which were, in general, pretty awesome in how many options they offered) but the PF classes all started to suffer from immense amounts of power creep.

3) The fact that attack bonuses, Armor Class, and saving throws increase slowly and flatten out sooner rather than later. This means lower challenge enemies are still threats to higher level characters. In 3E and PF, AC's could easily skyrocket to stratospheric numbers that even armies of hobgoblins were nothing more than an inconvenience to characters that were mid-level and beyond.

4) Magic is rare and generally not as required as it was in 3E and PF or even 2E.

5) Electrum is back! I don't know why I care about this, but I do. My players are going to end up hauling a ton of this shit around.

6) Feats are much more powerful and have evolved beyond giving boring static or mere situational bonuses. They now feel like a big, important choice.

7) Backgrounds - An excellent addition to the game

8) The new spell system - It combines the old-style Vancian system with a bit of the flexibility of the psionics system. I, for one, heartily approve.

9) Buffing is much less important now - In fact, it's pretty much impossible to buff characters to stratospheric levels, teleport in, and nuke the enemy before the buffs all wear off.

What I don't like:

1) Monsters generally aren't as interesting as in 3E or PF. They lack a lot of the out-of-combat or roleplaying abilities that made me want to use them or made them interesting to read about. They are certainly not as bad as 4E monsters, but goddamn if Paizo wasn't great at making some cool monsters, even if those monsters were a bitch to run properly.

2) Lair abilities and legendary actions seem like they will make tough monsters interesting to run but they are very 'gamist' in a 4E way. Maybe they will prove to make for very cool encounters when I eventually get around to using some monsters with these abilities, but just looking at them gives me a very video gamey vibe.

3) Some rules are very concrete with little leeway in interpretation and others are more... handwavey. I don't need a rule for everything but I'd prefer one approach or the other, not the mixed one that's in the books.

4) Lack of options - Some classes come with three or four different paths to choose from, others are limited to a mere two. I would've preferred a bit more variety. A few more backgrounds wouldn't hurt as well.

5) No example of play in the PHB - Not only are the examples of play a good introduction to just how tabletop RPG's are played, they're usually fun to read as well.

What I'm unsure about:

1) Saving Throws - I like the idea of every stat being important but it really doesn't seem that way in practice. Any class that's proficient in either Charisma or Intelligence saves just seems like they're getting one worthless save seeing as very few abilities or situations call for those saves.

2) The skills - Rolling skills into simple ability checks is a brilliant idea, unfortunately the progression of proficiency is so flat that I wonder if the feeling of getting better at your skills is going to go away. That's one thing I really liked about 3E and PF, as you gained levels there was a real feeling of progress, you were getting better at certain things or you were choosing to broaden your skill set by focusing on other things. That's largely gone as you're now locked into what skills you're good at for the rest of your career, barring the choice of a feat or multiclassing.

I'm sure as I play more, I'll come across more for each category (or maybe some will change) but that's all I have after one session and a single readthrough. I will say that anyone who's tired of the number crunch of 3E and PF, give 5E a look. It basically combines the better parts of 2E and 3E while not having the incredibly idiotic rules of the former and none of the minutiae of the latter.

[Sci-2]

Ah I missed that last post - Durckad are you still running 5e? How do you feel about it now? It's funny I haven't really looked at the new 5e stuff aside from flipping pages at a store. A friend of mine is a Pathfinder super subscriber or whatever you call it so I've been able to better keep up with what's going on there.

 

Also been tracking some the of the stuff coming out of Onyx Publishing - I like that the Kickstarters often allow you to check out the game text of an entire book they are looking for $$ to fund art/layout/printing. For example the new game Beast: The Primordial where you play some kind of lineage of monstrous creature is rather interesting as it sorta mixes in some aspects of The Dreaming and Geist.

 

Also the 2nd WoD lines are getting new books, one bonus from that is the corny-ass "city of dragons" from Mage: The Awakening has been replaced with a much looser and cooler idea of a civilization out of time that nobody knows much about:

 

The Fate of Atlantis

 

 

The evidence from these ruins and artifacts can’t be shaped into a single, consistent history. Tales of glorious cities and empires that existed in the time before time are sprinkled throughout world mythology. The Aztecs referred to Aztlán; the Mahabharata opens with the history of the Naga Kingdom; ancient Buddhist texts mention Shambhala. Call it Hyperborea or Brittia or Paititi. Name its people Pelasgians or inhabitants of the Dreamtime. “Atlantis” is a catch-all term, suggested for its familiarity to the Diamond Orders whose origins lay in ancient Greece.

 

Over the last four millennia, the Awakened have chased these conflicting-yet-similar stories to tease out one larger truth: a world existed before this one. Little and less is known about the inhabitants of the Time Before, but the Orders do agree on a few key points.