Your opinion of Edmure Tully?

[The Wolves]

He is awesome. That is all.

[Jslay427]

Based on what evidence?

There are several things Edmure does that are not "smart" to do when one is at war.

Piling hundreds of useless mouths inside your castle when you will most likely undergo a siege is not smart. It's a kind thing to do, but not smart.

Getting taken prisoner multiple times doesn't add a lot of mystique to ones ability level either. The only "victory" he is credited with actually severely cripples his Kings war effort. He was told to hold Riverun, nothing more.

[Good Guy Garlan]

There are several things Edmure does that are not "smart" to do when one is at war.

Piling hundreds of useless mouths inside your castle when you will most likely undergo a siege is not smart. It's a kind thing to do, but not smart.

Getting taken prisoner multiple times doesn't add a lot of mystique to ones ability level either. The only "victory" he is credited with actually severely cripples his Kings war effort. He was told to hold Riverun, nothing more.

Tywin did all kinds of "smart" things, look what it got him.

[Frances Bean Corbray]

Not that I want to start the 700th iteration of "if you could live/had to live in any part of Westeros/under any Westeros Lord who would it be?" but if and when that question is posed, Edmure Tully is the only sane answer. Because he's the only one who can be proven to legitimately give a fuck about you as a peasant and his responsibility/duty to protect you in exchange for your being tied to his land giving him a share of your crop yield/income/etc.

He is too soft for The Game Of Thrones. But that's a point in his favor.

[Jslay427]

Tywin did all kinds of "smart" things, look what it got him.

Tywin was murdered by his son, not due to any strategic flaw.

[Lee-Sensei]

^He was killed by his son because of the years of abuse he put Tyrion through.

There are several things Edmure does that are not "smart" to do when one is at war.

Piling hundreds of useless mouths inside your castle when you will most likely undergo a siege is not smart. It's a kind thing to do, but not smart.
Getting taken prisoner multiple times doesn't add a lot of mystique to ones ability level either. The only "victory" he is credited with actually severely cripples his Kings war effort. He was told to hold Riverun, nothing more.

Robb needed to be more clear with his instructions.

[Good Guy Garlan]

^He was killed by his son because of the years of abuse he put Tyrion through.

Robb needed to be more clear with his instructions.

This

Not that I want to start the 700th iteration of "if you could live/had to live in any part of Westeros/under any Westeros Lord who would it be?" but if and when that question is posed, Edmure Tully is the only sane answer. Because he's the only one who can be proven to legitimately give a fuck about you as a peasant and his responsibility/duty to protect you in exchange for your being tied to his land giving him a share of your crop yield/income/etc.

He is too soft for The Game Of Thrones. But that's a point in his favor.

Exactly. Look at Ned, he too sucked at the Game of Thrones, but the North still fights in his name because his subjects legitimally loved him. Someone like Tywin is never gonna get that, his whole legacy is unraveling.

Edmure's subjects truly are loyal to him as well. When the stupid Emmon was talking to the Tully household I could feel their hate radiating from the book towards that asshole, and I bet they're gonna welcome Stoneheart and the Brotherhood with open arms when they come calling. Because being good with the peasants eventually pays off, kids.

[Gneisenau]

^He was killed by his son because of the years of abuse he put Tyrion through.

Robb needed to be more clear with his instructions.

Robb's instructions were clear. How is hold Riverrun ambiguous ? Robb was being malevolent in giving Edmure the wrong instructions and then trying to blame him for it latter.

[Hypnomagica]

There are several things Edmure does that are not "smart" to do when one is at war.

Piling hundreds of useless mouths inside your castle when you will most likely undergo a siege is not smart. It's a kind thing to do, but not smart.

Getting taken prisoner multiple times doesn't add a lot of mystique to ones ability level either. The only "victory" he is credited with actually severely cripples his Kings war effort. He was told to hold Riverun, nothing more.

As this did not have any negative effects on the war effort, there is no reason to count this against his intelligent. it could evne be argues to be a better decision, long-term ad if all of his subject die or starve, the Lord will be fucked. And by sheltering his subjects, he helped insure that his small folk would remain loyal to him in a time of tremulous loyalty.

None of the times he was taken prisoner were through any fault of his own. And if you're going to argue that, I dare say that being prionser is a hell of a lot better for a man's "mystique to one's ability level" than being dead. Which is the situation most everyone else at the Red Wedding wound up in.

And the King severely crippled his OWN war effort by not communicating his strategy with one of his top officers, also that whole, 'marrying a woman from a minor house' thing.

All of Edmure's advisors thought his plan was a good one and agreed with the idea. Sure, it screwed things up in hindsight but the only ones who could see that were the two people who'd made the plan in the first place.

If Stannis had won the Blackwater, Edmure would have been hailed as a hero for forcing Tywin back and securing the Riverlands and Robb's position in the Westerlands. Tywin would have been stuck between Stannis in KL, Edmure in Riverrun, and Robb Stark in the Westerlands.

I'm not calling him a genius, but none of this is evidence of stupidity.

[Lee-Sensei]

Robb's instructions were clear. How is hold Riverrun ambiguous ? Robb was being malevolent in giving Edmure the wrong instructions and then trying to blame him for it latter.

Because the job of the Lord is to protect their smallfolk. Without telling him their plan (and knowing the kind of person he is), the fault lies on Brynden and Robb for failing to communicate their plan to Edmure.

The Nerdstream Era: A communication error or just throwing blame around? - The Riverrun decision

[Pod The Impaler]

What is your opinion of Edmure Tully as a war time leader, a lord of the Riverlands and a potential small council member? He may not be the most intelligent person in the series but he does seem to have a decent grasp of justice. He could have made a good master of laws. Probably better than Renley Baratheon or Orton Merryweather and definately has a good sense of honor the way Lord Hoster and Jon Arryn did.

PS I am speaking of him as a lord of the Riverlands that has not been ravaged by war, Hypothetical

Edmure tries to please, and to salvage his pride, tries to prove himself (to his father, to his sister, to his uncle, to Robb) but deep down, he's not one of the "hard men" like the Blackfish. He is brave and defends his people with his heart, but not his head. If I led an army, I do not think Edmure would make a bad soldier, but within a limited range of actions.

Peacetime suits him better. As a lord, he's probably somewhat better - he seems to care about his subjects. I can see him on a small council as Master of Coin or something.

[Lee-Sensei]

^I'm not sure how good he'd be as Master of Coin, but if I was a commoner in Westeros and I got to choose my Lord I'd choose Edmure (or Doran Martell since he hasn't really done anything).

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Edmure tries to please, and to salvage his pride, tries to prove himself (to his father, to his sister, to his uncle, to Robb) but deep down, he's not one of the "hard men" like the Blackfish. He is brave and defends his people with his heart, but not his head. If I led an army, I do not think Edmure would make a bad soldier, but within a limited range of actions.

Peacetime suits him better. As a lord, he's probably somewhat better - he seems to care about his subjects. I can see him on a small council as Master of Coin or something.

Edmure is not a hard man because nothing has really hardened except well, a few ladies. Every other knight or lord has been green at some point. Had the RW not happened, I think he could have raised himself as a good commander.

[Pod The Impaler]

Edmure is not a hard man because nothing has really hardened except well, a few ladies. Every other knight or lord has been green at some point. Had the RW not happened, I think he could have raised himself as a good commander.

Well, to a point. The guy is brave, and as I said he would make a good soldier, a moderately good commander.

Ironically, he gets his "chance at redemption" in defending the fords, and wins. And then is blamed for it, because Robb and Brynden gave him unclear rules of engagement. (That blog link is a good one.)

Edmure does not shame himself and I think he got more abuse than he really deserved.

Yet, when I say "hard men" (or women, we must not forget), I mean people who just that sort of unknown quantity, the sort of "X" that separates a true war leader from a sidekick or a pretender.

[Jslay427]

As this did not have any negative effects on the war effort, there is no reason to count this against his intelligent. it could evne be argues to be a better decision, long-term ad if all of his subject die or starve, the Lord will be fucked. And by sheltering his subjects, he helped insure that his small folk would remain loyal to him in a time of tremulous loyalty.

None of the times he was taken prisoner were through any fault of his own. And if you're going to argue that, I dare say that being prionser is a hell of a lot better for a man's "mystique to one's ability level" than being dead. Which is the situation most everyone else at the Red Wedding wound up in.

And the King severely crippled his OWN war effort by not communicating his strategy with one of his top officers, also that whole, 'marrying a woman from a minor house' thing.

All of Edmure's advisors thought his plan was a good one and agreed with the idea. Sure, it screwed things up in hindsight but the only ones who could see that were the two people who'd made the plan in the first place.

If Stannis had won the Blackwater, Edmure would have been hailed as a hero for forcing Tywin back and securing the Riverlands and Robb's position in the Westerlands. Tywin would have been stuck between Stannis in KL, Edmure in Riverrun, and Robb Stark in the Westerlands.

I'm not calling him a genius, but none of this is evidence of stupidity.

I'm talking strategic wartime IQ, and if you think Edmure is strategically smart then you need to reread the books.

[Wmarshal]

Edmure's assaults during the fords was brilliant, he is a lord that loves his people, but he is easily bullied by family.

[Driesel Snow]

He does get bullied a bit, but he does seem like a good Lord to his smallfolk. Thats got to count for something. I felt bad for him when he kept missing the arrow to light his father's funeral boat pyre deal.

[Luthien Targaryen]

I for one hope that Edmure and Roslin make it out ok. I don't think he's a military or political genius, he's certainly not ruthless enough to be any good at the Game, but his heart's in the right place. And he takes his family motto seriously. You can be a good lord without being a political mastermind or a bad ass general, but you need your bannermen united behind you. I think that Edmure has a lot in common with his late brother-in-law, Lord Stark, not that that's very encouraging news i'd imagine. He needs to grow up a bit, he acts like a kid of Robb's age and thus gets treated like one by his family, although I think that Catelyn is happier accepting that Robb might be an adult and able to make his own decisions than she is Edmure! In her defence, she hasn't seen Edmure in a long old while, and he probably was younger than Robb when she last saw him, and has forgotten he's grown up. If he gets the chance to grow up, i think he could be a benevolent and much loved Lord, but let's face it, Good Guys aren't known to get the rewards they're due in this series.

It would be interesting to see how he handled the centuries old Bracken/Blackwood spat though.

[the storm king returns]

Edmure got a bad wrap from Rob Stark when IMO, Rob should have been more clear about his orders hold riverrun could still mean prevent yourself from being sieged. Edmure had the defensive position one to give the lannisters nice and bloody, preventing him from crossing saved his people more tragedy as well. For such a big piece in robs plan a discussion with his uncle (Lord of the riverlands) would have been nice.

Also just because he was bad with a bow doesn't mean he's bad with a sword, he had a master of arms since the day he picked up a sword he can't be too bad. Long live Lord Edmure Tully a good man in a bad world

[SkaggCannibal]

Edmure Tully, the best Lord ever. He will get his revenge, just watch it.