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[Book Spoilers] EP 205 Discussion

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Tywin's brutality is usually carried out by others, like the Mountain.

And even with Rhaegar's kids, he was bothered by the brutality. He talked about how unnecessary it was for Lorch to have the little girl drug from under her bed and stabbed to death when reassuring words and a silk pillow would have served the same purpose. Ruthless does not necessarily equal cruel.

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I've always had a soft spot for poor, screwed-up Jorah. He's made terrible mistakes for which he hates himself. He just wanted to go home, and that then led him to strike a deal to inform on Dany... only to, not only fall in love with her, but to ultimately revere her and truly take her for his queen. The problem is he's betrayed her in the past and doesn't want her to know it. He's a very flawed, very well-developed, very HUMAN character.

TEAM JORAH

I've adored him in all the books and in the show. Love the actor, love his storyline. Obsessed. and I agree with everything you said. His motives are all very understandable too--he just wants to go home, he's all torn up over betraying his father, and then Dany

AND he's the brightest pot of wildfire in the bunch of nitwits Dany accumulates around her. He's the ONLY part of her storyline I like. and the Dragons.

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Not 'retarded' monks, my friend. Frightened, superstitious men in a frightening, superstitious time--confronted with a terrifying new enemy no one in their world had ever envisioned. Not retarded.

I was being facetious. :cool4:

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literally sat up and said "WTF" alone when i saw that. I'm thrilled they brought her and Pyatt in. I was expecting his lips to be insanely blue and obvious but I don't care that they weren't, my imagination was just running on hyperdrive while reading. I think her coming up in the middle of the crowd was almost more disconcerting than her riding up in the desert. One of the changes in this ep that I approved of!

does anyone think Jorah's outfit looks like a cowboy? Maybe it was the blue scarf bandana and the belt. I was expecting him to pick up a cowboy hat and start spitting tobacco

I think I did see some stains on Pree's mouth. I'll have to check that again.

I wasn't quite sure what to make of Jorah's outfit either. But damn, I'm just glad Iain Glen got a lot more screentime. He's so good and rocks an Obi-Wan Kenobi vibe too. I only hope we get the scene where he goes into great detail with Dany about his past in a future episode.

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And even with Rhaegar's kids, he was bothered by the brutality. He talked about how unnecessary it was for Lorch to have the little girl drug from under her bed and stabbed to death when reassuring words and a silk pillow would have served the same purpose. Ruthless does not necessarily equal cruel.

He also said to Tyrion that he hoped he didn't think the rape of Elia was his idea either. Tywin just wanted to get the job done. But the fact that he will utilize men like The Mountain and Lorch does show you what kind of man he is. It's kind of like Don Corleone and (Book) Luca Brasi.

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Really enjoyed this episode. The CGI was great. First with the shadowborn, which was awesomelly creepy, the way it shrieked when it killed him. Drogon looked so damn lifelike it was amazing. And the awesome shot of Ghost we got was great to see, at first I thought it was a polar bear. And man, Dany looked beautiful in this episode....

And it was great to see Jon again after his absense last week. And I loved the scene with Tyrion and Lancel in his little sedan chair. The wildfire was magnificent, it seems we will see it used in Blackwater after all the worrying that was being done over it not being shown in previews.

And can't forget Jaqen. So fricking boss at the end....

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TEAM JORAH

I've adored him in all the books and in the show. Love the actor, love his storyline. Obsessed. and I agree with everything you said. His motives are all very understandable too--he just wants to go home, he's all torn up over betraying his father, and then Dany

AND he's the brightest pot of wildfire in the bunch of nitwits Dany accumulates around her. He's the ONLY part of her storyline I like. and the Dragons.

Also... Jorah-show is fu****g sexy!!! :drool:

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TEAM JORAH

I've adored him in all the books and in the show. Love the actor, love his storyline. Obsessed. and I agree with everything you said. His motives are all very understandable too--he just wants to go home, he's all torn up over betraying his father, and then Dany

AND he's the brightest pot of wildfire in the bunch of nitwits Dany accumulates around her. He's the ONLY part of her storyline I like. and the Dragons.

I always found it very poignant that, even as he decries Ned and his "precious honor," he truly respects men of honor (like his father); and he sort of hates them a little too, if only because he failed to be like them. Leaving his father's sword behind when he fled says a lot about his character -- he knew he wasn't worthy of keeping it. I always found it an interesting correlation to Jon Snow doing the same when he was about to desert to join Robb in AGoT, because he "was not so lost to honor" as to take it with him.

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Agreed. I'm very happy with what they're doing. Could it be better? Of course. Could it be much, much worse? Absolutely.

Quite honestly I do not think it could be better. And it is following the story amazingly closely to be honest.Ive read the books 3 times and I am amazed at the indignation over the tiniest of changes, even some that are not really a change. It is hitting EVERY major plot point of the books.

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He also said to Tyrion that he hoped he didn't think the rape of Elia was his idea either. Tywin just wanted to get the job done. But the fact that he will utilize men like The Mountain and Lorch does show you what kind of man he is. It's kind of like Don Corleone and (Book) Luca Brasi.

Yup, yup.

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@ Rockroi Great summary of the episode!

What is it with that stupid dress Margaery wears? Gag me with a spoon, puhlease!

Arya and Gendry have chemistry.

This Asha is not a commander I would follow, she's too insipid. Her costume is fine, it's not like she's too grey, lol, there's just no joy in her. You have to have a spark of fire to make people stand up and say they will follow you.

Harry Potter taught me the painful lesson that changes will be made between the transfer from book to screen, but some of the changes are startling. So far they haven't been horrible, but even though it's very well acted, I hate the whole Arya as female cupbearer to Tywin. And I wasn't crazy about Brienne killing the members of the Rainbow Guard, it changes Loras' character, and I can't see the honourable Brienne doing that. She's just like any other knight reacting to act this way, and she was supposed to be someone better.

Edited by Fragile Bird

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I think I did see some stains on Pree's mouth. I'll have to check that again.

I wasn't quite sure what to make of Jorah's outfit either. But damn, I'm just glad Iain Glen got a lot more screentime. He's so good and rocks an Obi-Wan Kenobi vibe too. I only hope we get the scene where he goes into great detail with Dany about his past in a future episode.

there was some staining but I had just imagined it being really obvious. Nitpicky and not something that really bothered me.

He's like Obi-wan/Han solo/Indiana Jones in that outfit haha

Yeah i always found the part about his first wife looking just like Daenerys to be very interesting and the little hints you get give you a better idea of why he does what he does.

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Asha Greyjoy worked in the book but Yara Greyjoy doesn't. She just comes across as bitchy. I think that's because Theon is more sympathetic in the show and unlikeable in ACOK's. Here it just looks like Yara is being an asshole to her brother with her constant mocking of him.

I did find Jeor's lines about Jon to be funny but he could have given him a slightly warmer good-bye.

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For some reason the first comment that comes to mind is that I didn't like Quaithe's mask.

Don't get me wrong, it was a cool mask...but I always imagined hers as a smooth hard shell, and that you could not see any part of her face move, just a disembodied voice from an unreadable figure. So this interpretation was a little odd.

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Quite honestly I do not think it could be better. And it is following the story amazingly closely to be honest.Ive read the books 3 times and I am amazed at the indignation over the tiniest of changes, even some that are not really a change. It is hitting EVERY major plot point of the books.

Agreed. I think most of the nitpicking is because people love the book so much that they want all the minor plot points as well; and for nothing to be changed. I can sympathize with that POV, even while knowing it is totally unrealistic. In the end, I'm loving it.

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I don't know I sort of feel like the Asha everybody describes around here wouldn't really fit the iron islands. Everyone elses descri

Asha Greyjoy worked in the book but Yara Greyjoy doesn't. She just comes across as bitchy. I think that's because Theon is more sympathetic in the show and unlikeable in ACOK's. Here it just looks like Yara is being an asshole to her brother with her constant mocking of him.

I did find Jeor's lines about Jon to be funny but he could have given him a slightly warmer good-bye.

I don't know when I read everyone elses description of Asha it doesn't really fit the Iron islands wheras this asha like her or bot is believable as being from the iron islands. The way everyone else describes her she sounds like someone from the pirates of the Carribean.

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Unless I completely missed it while reading A Clash of Kings, wasnt the whole Xaros vault/Xaros necklace key idea completely made up? While watching this episode a second time on HBO GO there was a special feature clip on the set creation of Xaros vault and they specifically said multiple times that the vault, and what lies inside it, are critical plot elements. Wtf? Does Dany break in and steal something to escape Qarth?

Something else I noticed too: wasn't Jorah always against getting ships and sailing directly to Westeros? If I remember correctly, he always wanted to head further east to Assai, or go the Slavers Bay and purchase unsullied.

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People calm down about Tywin dying/it being unrealistic if he doesn't die.

Charles Dance has explicitly stated there is a scene(his favorite) where the girl that keeps trying to kill him(Arya) gets a slight insight to his humanity. This clearly means she briefly views him as human, uses her kill elsewhere(true to character as she's an impulsive child) and then regrets it.

I actually like it better this way, because personally I think this will make it even more believable she didn't kill him than in the books, if done well, which I'm sure isn't in question considering its Dance.

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